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I read through these posts and thank God that I came through the system when I did. I got some good breaks, made some good and some bad decisions, but I always had a choice of work. I never got stuck with no job.
True, I drove an 18 wheeler for the last 5 years of my work life, but we made it through to a good retirement with house paid for and good income.
If you have a really good pension, you made top dollar. The high wage is spread out over your lifetime.
If an IT worker makes $120K a year and somehow manages to save a third of their take home pay until they get replaced by a 20-something at age 50, then works at Starbucks until they retire at age 67, they can look forward to living in a tent.
Nothing against you. You were lucky to live in the times you did, financially speaking. Today's youth are absolutely screwed in comparison.
I disagree. If the it worker did save that much and invested, by age 50 they would have a significant amount of reserves and savings.
Say that they made $120k per year from 30 to 50 and saved a third. It would be more than 700000 without considering dividends. If they work at Starbucks after 50, they won't necessarily live in a tent.
Most people in that situation also bought a home. By 50, their home is mostly paid off unless they bought too much home. Your mortgage is not supposed to be more than twice your gross income. I'm this case, the mortgage would be 240000. Anything more than that is looking for trouble. If you had 60000 as down payment, then you could buy a home that's 300000. In most of this country, that's quite a nice home.
If your home is almost paid off, that biggest expense is reduced dramatically.
Also, with 700000 in savings, you can invest in real estate property and get rental income. A one bedroom condo in many cities can be less than 100000. Pay with cash, and get $800 rent per month. Not bad. That covers your housing cost after mortgage and perhaps food too. Where is the crisis?
So they are mad that they made a choice to go into debt and cannot find decent jobs, what could they do?
Oh I know maybe instead of everybody going to 4 years schools maybe some of them should go to trade schools, and learn a decent trade, then they do not have the debt and maybe some of my clients can find help so they can actually build their businesses.
They could not go into debt and then not find a job with their high school diploma.
1: They feel if they have a college degree, that they should have a job, that pays $50,000 to $100,000 to start.
Problem, a lot of them took what are worthless degrees for all practical purposes. A study has been done, and found that well over half of the top 128 degrees, all have starting pay under the $50,000 level and as little as $30,000 to start. These degrees have several times more graduates, than positions open in their fields. When they get offers at the normal rate of pay for new graduates, they post on these threads complaining they were lowballed and did not take the job. They were not going to work that cheap. They took the easy way going for degrees with easy courses, or something that they thought would be fun. They are not reasonable in their expectations. Of course Petroleum Engineers are in short supply write their own ticket, and start about $100,000.
2: They think that if there is no work in their field, all they have to do is to apply in other fields and they will qualify for the job. They think the degree is the key to a top paying job, no matter what it is. They fail to accept the fact, that others took degrees for that job, and they are the ones that will be hired.
3: They complain on these threads, that they are asked questions they don't want to answer, as they had not practiced the answers. Especially if the questions are to find what type of person they are, and how they will fit in at the job with existing personnel. They think all that is important, is what degree they have, and any experience they have. They are wrong of course, but they fail to accept the fact they are wrong. They blame their failure to get a job on the HR and HM departments. However other people impress those same HR and HM people and get the job. I remember from my corporate days 40 years ago, when I was acting as HM many times, we had the same problem with them back then, so this problem is not something new.
The just cannot accept the fact, when they go on an interview, the way you act, and the way you answer questions that are sometimes used to test your ability to think on your feet, solve problems, etc. will be the difference between getting and not getting a job. When you refuse to answer those questions, you are always placed in the reject pile. Some refuse to take certain tests, etc., with the same reject pile results. When you go for an interview, there will be several people with equal qualifications. Those people are evaluated on their ability to fit into the team they will work with, and their attitude. The best fit gets the job.
Anyone that has been to 6 or more interviews and no job, should realize they themselves and their attitude are what is keeping them from getting a job.
4: They are angry that they have to be investigated. They say why credit checks, why check past work history, why check for arrests, etc., etc., etc. Anyone can be checked out today. A simple one that women may check out before they date a man what type of man he is, to make sure what kind of man wants to get involved with them. It is so easy to check out people today, companies will do it before they hire you. If you have something to hide that may keep you from getting a job, then don't apply for a decent job today.
1: They feel if they have a college degree, that they should have a job, that pays $50,000 to $100,000 to start.
Problem, a lot of them took what are worthless degrees for all practical purposes. A study has been done, and found that well over half of the top 128 degrees, all have starting pay under the $50,000 level and as little as $30,000 to start. These degrees have several times more graduates, than positions open in their fields. When they get offers at the normal rate of pay for new graduates, they post on these threads complaining they were lowballed and did not take the job. They were not going to work that cheap. They took the easy way going for degrees with easy courses, or something that they thought would be fun. They are not reasonable in their expectations. Of course Petroleum Engineers are in short supply write their own ticket, and start about $100,000.
2: They think that if there is no work in their field, all they have to do is to apply in other fields and they will qualify for the job. They think the degree is the key to a top paying job, no matter what it is. They fail to accept the fact, that others took degrees for that job, and they are the ones that will be hired.
3: They complain on these threads, that they are asked questions they don't want to answer, as they had not practiced the answers. Especially if the questions are to find what type of person they are, and how they will fit in at the job with existing personnel. They think all that is important, is what degree they have, and any experience they have. They are wrong of course, but they fail to accept the fact they are wrong. They blame their failure to get a job on the HR and HM departments. However other people impress those same HR and HM people and get the job. I remember from my corporate days 40 years ago, when I was acting as HM many times, we had the same problem with them back then, so this problem is not something new.
The just cannot accept the fact, when they go on an interview, the way you act, and the way you answer questions that are sometimes used to test your ability to think on your feet, solve problems, etc. will be the difference between getting and not getting a job. When you refuse to answer those questions, you are always placed in the reject pile. Some refuse to take certain tests, etc., with the same reject pile results. When you go for an interview, there will be several people with equal qualifications. Those people are evaluated on their ability to fit into the team they will work with, and their attitude. The best fit gets the job.
Anyone that has been to 6 or more interviews and no job, should realize they themselves and their attitude are what is keeping them from getting a job.
4: They are angry that they have to be investigated. They say why credit checks, why check past work history, why check for arrests, etc., etc., etc. Anyone can be checked out today. A simple one that women may check out before they date a man what type of man he is, to make sure what kind of man wants to get involved with them. It is so easy to check out people today, companies will do it before they hire you. If you have something to hide that may keep you from getting a job, then don't apply for a decent job today.
I disagree. If the it worker did save that much and invested, by age 50 they would have a significant amount of reserves and savings.
Say that they made $120k per year from 30 to 50 and saved a third. It would be more than 700000 without considering dividends. If they work at Starbucks after 50, they won't necessarily live in a tent.
Most people in that situation also bought a home. By 50, their home is mostly paid off unless they bought too much home. Your mortgage is not supposed to be more than twice your gross income. I'm this case, the mortgage would be 240000. Anything more than that is looking for trouble. If you had 60000 as down payment, then you could buy a home that's 300000. In most of this country, that's quite a nice home.
If your home is almost paid off, that biggest expense is reduced dramatically.
Also, with 700000 in savings, you can invest in real estate property and get rental income. A one bedroom condo in many cities can be less than 100000. Pay with cash, and get $800 rent per month. Not bad. That covers your housing cost after mortgage and perhaps food too. Where is the crisis?
Forget working at Starbucks or having a mortgage. $700k, quit job, move to Detroit or other areas in southeast Michigan, and pay cash for a $15k house. You have no rent or mortgage and $685k. At a 4% SWR this gives you $27k/year. If you are single and willing to be frugal you could retire at age 50 and simply live on $27k.
There is a common misconception that not buying a house in your earlier years makes it tough to retire. In reality, far from it - you just have to be willing to move to a LCOL area, that's all. You may not even need to do that, since if you started in a HCOL area you could again forgo the mortgage and simply rent and invest the difference, so that after 30 years you could buy a house in cash and still have more than $700k left over!
In my opinion, Oldtrader should have inserted the word "some" before millennials in that post.
This thread was moved by the mods from Work and Employment to Economics. Anyone who has frequented the W and E forum has seen the threads of some Millennals who do complain about the things Oldtrader cited. I always say every generation has it's share of slugs, and while the percentage of slugs in the Millennial generation is smaller than the go-getters, it seems to be a larger percentage than the slugs of previous generations.
In the W and E forum you'll find people who are angry they have to wait any amount of time to be interviewed. Whether it's fifteen minutes or thirty minutes, there are a number of people who say they were disrespected, and get up and walk out, saying they don't have to take that. Some fellow Millennials will agree. If you really want a job, you don't do that.
You'll find people who don't like the questions being asked during the interview. They feel they're stupid and they get very angry about that saying these questions are a waste of their time. If you really want a job, you don't worry about that, you're grateful you got the interview.
If they don't get a rejection letter, they rip into HR, the corporation, the hiring manager, etc. saying it's rude.
When they do get a rejection letter, they may not like the way it's worded, so they rip into HR, the corporation, the hiring manager, etc., saying it's rude.
If they get a rejection letter sooner than they'd like, or later than they'd like, they rip into HR, the corporation, the hiring manager, etc., saying it's rude.
If they're called in for multiple interviews, they don't like it and complain they're being made to jump through hoops and they shouldn't have to do that.
One of the more frequent posters who stated he's 26 years old, posted he's given up and is tired of the struggle after so many years of toil.
Many of them find a job and then a month later say they hate the job, need a new job, and start looking for that job.
Some of them decide after a year of working that theirs isn't an interesting field and they've made a mistake and ask what other field they can get into.
One poster who complains and recently got a job a few months ago, seems to spend all his spare time posting on the forum, regurgitating what seasoned professionals have already said, or posting, "This is the correct answer." or "I agree you should do this". He's 22, couldn't find a job, but has time to pretend he's got years of experience and so spends his free time counseling people who are older than he is.
Some of these posters spend a lot of time online whining about a great number of things. If they were to take the time and energy they're using in stating how much they hate everything, how people who work overtime are slaves and they won't do it, how stupid people are in Human Resources, how corporations are all corrupt and managers are sociopaths, and being offended by every little thing - and instead put that time and energy into looking for a job, they might have been employed by now.
And last, but not least, they argue that they convey good attitudes during interviews. Look, if you thrive on spouting that kind of vitriol about all things relating to employment, it's either going to come across in an interview or you're going to come across like a phony. Either way, you're not going to be hired.
I feel sorry for those Millennials who don't live in or near large metropolitan areas, or who foolishly got a degree most would view as useless, and those who graduate without any work experience in their field, because they're going to have a more difficult time finding a job. And I feel sorry for those who did all the right things and are still struggling to find a job. It's the ones described above I have no patience for.
For the record - I have raised two children, both Millennials, and I work with mostly Millennials. It's my favorite generation to work with. They're full of energy, enthusiasm, creativity and optimism. All things this old coot has, but in smaller doses with every day that ticks by.
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