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... Industrialism has three different stages, primary , secondary and tertiary. When our country first started most of our labor force was in farming. As we advanced to the second stage of industrialism most of our labor force was in manufacturing. Then we entered the last stage of industrialism where most of our labor force is in services. ...
Regards,
Robert
Tertiary | Definition of tertiary by Merriam-Webster
noun ter•tia•ry \ˈtər-shē-ˌer-ē, -shə-rē\
plural ter•tia•ries
Definition of TERTIARY
1 Medieval Latin tertiarius, from Latin, of a third] : a member of a monastic third order especially of lay people
2 Capitalized : the Tertiary (see 2tertiary)period or system of rocks
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Excerpted from Industrialism | Definition of industrialism by Merriam-Webster
noun in•dus•tri•al•ism \in-ˈdəs-trē-ə-ˌli-zəm\
: a social system in which industry and factories are the basis of a country's economy
Full Definition of INDUSTRIALISM
: social organization in which industries and especially large-scale industries are dominant.
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TalentLost, possibly I understand the meaning of “Industrialism has three different stages, primary, secondary and tertiary”, but I don’t agree that it is of great economic significance.
I’m a proponent of an Import Certificate proposal which would eliminate our trade deficit of goods but it does exclude the values of materials integral to the goods being assessed that are taken from the earth and listed within the legislative act as being scarce and/ or precious. It’s expected that crude oil, precious ores and gems would be on that list.
Other than those adjustments to assessment of value, Import certificate do not differentiate between manufactured, agricultural, or livestockproducts and it does not differentiate between nations that receive our diplomats.
I prefer that an Import Certificate act not be applicable to hand crafted goods or to goods produced, rebuilt or remodeled more than five years prior to the date of assessment. Those preferences should not be “deal breakers”.
If we continue to seek absolutely pure free trade our trade deficits of goods will continue to be a drag upon our economy until the purchasing power of USA’s median wage descends to wage parity with the remainder of our globe.
I completely agree that the trade deficit is at the root of our economic ills, but it didn't happen by accident. It was planned and executed to a tee. Globalization was used to make a few people insanely rich at our expense.
Our trade policies are not remotely free. For the most part, we don't restrict imports, but other countries do, usually to the tune of a 30% tariff or import tax.
If free trade resulted in a sustained large trade deficit, it would mean that the currency is overvalued. This is another thing that the Fed, congress, and the treasury have done to force a trade deficit.
... If free trade resulted in a sustained large trade deficit, it would mean that the currency is overvalued. ...
RRuff, conventional wisdom is nations which run global trade deficits will reduce their currency’s exchange rate, (i.e. will reduce their currency’s purchasing powers) within global currency exchange markets.
You’re contending that that due to USA’s annual global trade deficits the U.S. dollars being overvalued in global markets or due to the greater value of the U.S. dollar our annual trade deficits are being evoked? If what you contend is true, then we can anticipate the purchasing power of the U.S. dollar to be sufficiently reduced and consequentially our annual trade deficits will similarly be reduced?
...Our trade policies are not remotely free. For the most part, we don't restrict imports, but other countries do, usually to the tune of a 30% tariff or import tax. ...
RRuff, there are those that have read Adam Smith’s “Wealth of Nations” and advocate USA consistently practice absolutely pure free trade regardless of whatever other entities do.
I don’t share that belief.
The unilateral transferable Import Certificate policy would reward exporters of USA goods at the expense to USA purchasers of foreign goods and is not a net government revenue source.
[The rewards to exporters of USA goods are an indirect but effective subsidy of USA’s exported goods’ prices].
Due to the behavior of open markets, USA’s purchasers’ demand for foreign goods would increase the prices they must pay for those goods and reduces the prices of USA goods to foreign purchasers.
Increased demand for USA goods reduce the subsidy of USA goods to foreign purchasers and reduces the additional cost of imported goods sold to USA purchasers.
This self regulation would be entirely due to what Adam Smith described as markets’ “invisible” hand. Under such a policy those seeking to undermine USA’s foreign trade would do little or no harm to our economy but to they’d harm themselves to the extent of their attempted mischief.
If what you contend is true, then we can anticipate the purchasing power of the U.S. dollar to be sufficiently reduced and consequentially our annual trade deficits will similarly be reduced?
That in addition to our unilateral trade policies. But don't expect the US$ value to decline any time soon. Much of the world is quite dependent on dumping their production on the US, and the more fragile economies would collapse. I think the world's oligarchs are planning on the US absorbing a good deal more before this is over. They can't get off the "drug" easily and don't have a viable alternative.
Trade deficits for developed countries aren't a natural consequence of free trade. If we'd had free trade and intelligent policies we'd offshore inherently labor intensive low-skill production (though less than we have), but make it up with high value added production.
That wasn't good enough for the oligarchs who saw globalization as a way for them to get incredibly wealthy at our expense. They greatly reduced costs by offshoring production, and had a free and secure market back to the US. No risk and profits soared. US production and wages lagged, but consumption was kept boosted via easy credit and the one time shot of women entering the labor force, and treasuries were sold to fill our trade gap. Remember in the 80s when fiscal deficits ceased to matter?
Our economy since ~1980 has been a temporary construct based on debt escalation and stimulus solely to keep things running. Eventually the debt load gets excessive and it crashes. That happened in 2008.
Supposn, my definitions of industrialism comes from the descipline called economic geography. It was a course I took in college the defined how our country evolved geographically from economics. One of the best economic classes I ever participated in. There we discussed how technology shaped our labor force and how labor and technology evolved our economy georaphically.
The movement of labor within the stages of industrialism, is what I learned. As an example once railroads were in place people were able to move away from the cities that were next to ports and waterways. Food could travel by rail expanding our population to different section of the country.
If you search the Internet for the term economic geography and read the Wikipedia overview you will understand where I'm coming from. It is that course I was taught the stages of industrialism.
As you know, every field defines their terms within the context of what they are explaining. The things I learned in that class still resonate with me today. It was one of the first economic classes I took of that wasn't as abstract as micro or macro economic theory. My two favorite economic classes were economic geography and international economics.
Economic geography and the stage of industrialism have shaped our country to what is is today, I would believe it is very significant. You seem to be a open minded intelligent person so I know that after you review the concept of economic geography you will understand the significance.
TalentLost, we agree that USA’s annual trade deficits of goods with higher median wage nations do us lesser harm than our deficits with nations of lesser median wages.
I googled “annual trade balances of goods between u.s. and mexico”
and compared it to “annual trade balances of goods between u.s. and canada”.
You have not responded to the contention that nation’s annual global trade deficits are always immediately to their economic detriment.
I concern myself with trade deficit of goods rather than our total trade deficits because I do not accept your contention that we can reasonably monitor and affect our global trade balances of services.
I would prefer that customer service representative be required to identify their relationship to the enterprise customers are seeking to contact and at least the town and nation that’s the originating source of the response to the customer. I would also prefer that such responses be required to reveal a direct contact address to the enterprise the customers’ are attempting to reach. Possibly these simple requirements would help our nation retain more customer service jobs?
That in addition to our unilateral trade policies. ...
If we'd had free trade and intelligent policies we'd offshore inherently labor intensive low-skill production (though less than we have), but make it up with high value added production. ... Our economy since ~1980 has been a temporary construct based on debt escalation and stimulus solely to keep things running. Eventually the debt load gets excessive and it crashes. That happened in 2008.
RRuff, what USA unilateral trade policies are you referring to?
I do not disagree with your suggesting a policy of off shoring “inherently labor intensive low-skill production (though less than we have), but make it up with high value added production”.
To no small extent due our poorly performing academic and vocational systems for education and training, the majority of USA jobs crowded out by our annual trade deficits are being replaced with fewer jobs and/or jobs of much lesser wages and salaries.
You don’t acknowledge that the facilities and jobs directly crowded out by our annual trade deficits are less than the additional crowding out of infrastructures and jobs that indirectly but certainly support USA’s production of goods. You may consider our trade deficits of goods as almost entirely to be manufactured imports but New Zealand lamb meat and Mexican fruits and vegetables also contribute to our trade deficit.
The costs of foreign nations' goods and service products are made possible by the lesser purchasing powers of their workers. It is not simply that their factories operate at lesser costs per unit produced, but the construction of the factory itself, the production supporting enterprises and infrastructure are all also of lesser costs due to their nations’ lesser wage and salaries’ purchasing powers. There are fewer and fewer goods and service products that may reduce our trade balance’s detriment to our economy.
Although all USA trade agreements have been more or less of a drag upon our entire economy, they have not ever been the primary causes of a USA severe economically traumatic experience.
RRuff, what USA unilateral trade policies are you referring to?
We allow imports with little or no tariffs, while our trading partners have high tariffs.
Quote:
You don’t acknowledge that the facilities and jobs directly crowded out by our annual trade deficits are less than the additional crowding out of infrastructures and jobs that indirectly but certainly support USA’s production of goods.
Of course I do. We are importing but not exporting (enough). That is the problem. A lower US$ value would neatly fix that and allow us to parlay our strengths and outsource the rest. No need to micro manage deals and policies.
Our academic institutions aren't poorly performing, BTW. Not after HS.
Quote:
Although all USA trade agreements have been more or less of a drag upon our entire economy, they have not ever been the primary causes of a USA severe economically traumatic experience.
The cause is:
Tax cuts on the rich.
Unilateral trade policies.
Fiscal deficits don't matter.
US$ value kept high.
Loose credit.
Financial shenanigans.
Globalization was used to create an unprecedented shift of wealth to a tiny fraction of our citizens, while 99.9% of us got the shaft.
... We are importing but not exporting (enough). That is the problem. A lower US$ value would neatly fix that and allow us to parlay our strengths and outsource the rest. No need to micro manage deals and policies. ...
The cause(s of USA's historic economic traumas are):
Tax cuts on the rich.
Unilateral trade policies.
Fiscal deficits don't matter.
US$ value kept high.
Loose credit.
Financial shenanigans. ...
RRuff, the prices of globally traded products expressed within any mutually recognized currencies are linked to those currencies exchange rates within global markets and those exchange rates to a great extent are related to wages purchasing powers within the products’ producing nations. (I will not participate in a “chicken or egg” discussion of currencies exchange rates relative to the purchasing powers of their producing nations’ wages).
I have previously and often agreed with your contention that USA’s annual trade deficits would be significantly “fixed” if the comparative value of the U.S. dollar were reduced; (i.e. corrected if the purchasing power of USA’s median wage were reduced).
I have previously and (but not sufficiently often) disagreed with your post’s listing the comparatively higher value of the U.S. dollar as among the primary causes of severe traumas that have been experienced by USA’s historic economies.
Respectfully, Supposn
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