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Old 12-21-2017, 04:17 AM
 
32,009 posts, read 27,191,473 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
They NEED to believe it will work.

Without such the only thing holding the R party together are the suicidal social conservatives.
Well them and the insane Norquist/Bannon contingent.

Thank you!


Am putting you down on my muffin basket list!
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:39 AM
 
4,698 posts, read 4,087,304 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaker281 View Post
Not entirely certain about that. The impact on debt might be the same, however who reaps the rewards and how that impacts growth could be very different. If the results flow to people that hoard/save it may be less impactful than the results flowing to people that actually spend it all immediately.
Of course it is slightly different, all changes would. But it doesn't resolve the main problem of the bill, we don't need stimulus right now.

And lets just talk a little bit about spending and saving. When a company buy stocks, someone else must be selling. The money doesn't vanish just because companies save money. And if the companies did find a way to take the tax breaks out of the economy, then that would be good news. But they won't and hence the economy will overheat.
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:46 AM
 
107,040 posts, read 109,362,256 times
Reputation: 80438
i wish i could claim to be smart enough to know what we need and to be able to solve the countries ill's .

i guess many here have that crystal ball and know what is going to work in advance .

but i am not . soooooo , i do the next best thing . i watch how things play out and i learn to play those cards to my advantage if i can .

all you arm chair economist wanna be's are great at monday morning quarter backing but fall way short of knowing how to deal with the unknown .
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:56 AM
 
4,698 posts, read 4,087,304 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
Debt escalation. Not sustainable. Higher incomes would be sustainable.
Yeah, but your argument no longer makes sense. It doesn't matter for the companies if the demand is sustainable or not.

And getting higher wage growth is easier said than done. Here are some causes of the low wage growth.
  • A lot of the jobs created are in low wage sectors.
  • A lot of the jobs in high wage sectors are not being filled.
  • A lot of high wage sectors are monopolies or cartels who take large profits and is very inefficient.
  • A lot of the business growth is taken by other costs such as taxes and health care.

Last edited by Camlon; 12-21-2017 at 06:25 AM..
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Old 12-21-2017, 05:01 AM
 
107,040 posts, read 109,362,256 times
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for the first time in decades the last 2 years have seen employees in my industry hold the cards .

employers are going all out to keep their best of breed employees as competitors are offering big increases to lure them away . we have a shortage now of good , experienced best of breed and it is being reflected like i have not seen in 40 years .
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Old 12-21-2017, 05:59 AM
 
7,898 posts, read 7,132,902 times
Reputation: 18613
There is a huge and potential critical shortage of labor looming for my former field of medical lab testing. In the 70s, implementation of DRGs meant the hospital labs were no longer profit centers but instantly became cost centers. The labs were sent to the basement, literally. The lab budgets and staffing and salaries were cut. At one time med tech salaries were on a par with nursing, but for many years the salaries have been about half. Training programs closed, people stopped entering the field. The demand for testing has gone up by orders of magnitude but jobs and salaries have not increased by much due to automation. Visit any lab in the country. You are very likely to see lots of old people about to retire. Most are disgruntled and unhappy about salary, workload and working conditions. All for good reasons. Younger people still do not enter the field and training programs greatly lag behind the looming demand for workers.


The situation has not turned yet, but eventually those in the field are going to be in high demand. Salaries and working conditions are going to have to improve in order to attract workers.
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Old 12-21-2017, 07:22 AM
 
4,765 posts, read 3,742,352 times
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^^^This^^^


I do believe that we are facing pending worker shortages among skilled workers in many fields, recessions notwithstanding. I have posted on this for a decade. We have poor population growth in the USA and the demographics are difficult to ignore. Automation, robotics and productivity can stave it off, but our nations growth may be hampered by labor shortages in areas where live, smart people on the ground are a basic necessity.

Look at Indiana, a state that has been seeing growth hampered by skilled worker shortages long before the national employment rate dropped to 4%.

Adequately targeted education and training may become very much in demand. Wage growth is another issue. At this point, companies view all workers as necessary evils to be squeezed for every ounce. I would love to see that change.

https://seekingalpha.com/article/410...gly-dire-issue

https://worldview.stratfor.com/artic...nomic-reversal

https://www.bcg.com/publications/201...ce-crisis.aspx

https://www.marketplace.org/2017/12/...-hope-they-can

Last edited by shaker281; 12-21-2017 at 07:35 AM..
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Old 12-21-2017, 07:31 AM
 
107,040 posts, read 109,362,256 times
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we found a huge shortage of skilled workers in the sales of robotic and factory automation gear .

the companies like the one i worked for that sell this gear have grown by leaps and bounds . i know our growth from an 8 employee company to a 100 million 300 employee company has created worker needs in every company we interface with . factories , suppliers , accounting , you name it and we require lots of it .

warehouse positions ,driver positions were all created by us or those that interface with us and we are only 1 company . there are want ads everywhere .
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Old 12-21-2017, 07:34 AM
 
4,765 posts, read 3,742,352 times
Reputation: 3038
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
i wish i could claim to be smart enough to know what we need and to be able to solve the countries ill's .

i guess many here have that crystal ball and know what is going to work in advance .

but i am not . soooooo , i do the next best thing . i watch how things play out and i learn to play those cards to my advantage if i can .

all you arm chair economist wanna be's are great at monday morning quarter backing but fall way short of knowing how to deal with the unknown .
I do not have to be railroad engineer to see a train coming, to feel the ground shake, to hear the whistle or to get off the tracks.

"Those who do not remember their past are condemned to repeat it"

I would love to believe that we are all going to get rich and the rewards will end up evenly spread among all those who deserve it. I've just never seen it happen and cannot recall hearing such a thing! LOL

I can find a way to make from lemonade from lemons, but not a silk purse from a sow's ear!
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Old 12-21-2017, 07:37 AM
 
107,040 posts, read 109,362,256 times
Reputation: 80438
it is funny because my saying is "the only thing that repeats itself is historians "

every event always is triggered by something different enough to make your preparation from last time invalid this time .

remember how stocks tanked first iraq invasion . second invasion we soared .

every major downturn has been triggered by something different . it is always the things not on the radar that send us reeling .
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