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Old 04-14-2020, 06:05 AM
 
Location: The Triad
34,090 posts, read 82,975,811 times
Reputation: 43666

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post
(what gets characterized as) Doom and gloomers aren't wrong. They're usually just early.
Make that a .sig file.
Quote:
Nobody knows where the tipping point is with too much debt....until after you've gone past it.
Then things change very quickly.
Most of which seems rooted in not having a known limit on the 'corrective actions'.

Quote:
And the Fed has massively increased it's balance sheet. So WE ARE printing money.
And HAVE BEEN for over twenty years.

The recent biggies have been ...
1) the war that Bush Jr started without any sort of financing; and
2) the bailout triggered at the end of the Bush Jr term; and
3) the current fiasco at the end of another R term.
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Old 04-14-2020, 07:38 AM
 
14,993 posts, read 23,892,069 times
Reputation: 26523
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger View Post

And the Fed has massively increased it's balance sheet. So WE ARE printing money. $2 Trillion in about a month. This can't possibly end well.
That would not really be correct. There are real difference between printing money and borrowing money. Both have negative effect no doubt, but the effect and impact is different so that's why it's important.

Let me explain - we are not on the gold standard so indeed the government can print money, sometimes we do. Indeed inflation is the risk here as it devalues currency. Borrowing money doesn't create any money, it simply takes existing money from the market, with a fixed repayment date. The negative impact here of course is that the government has to pay interest and it increases the national debt.

"Printing money" is more used as a fed tool to, not to fund the economy, but manage the ecconomy...quantitative easing and all that. They can "unprint" money as well depending on circumstances.
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Old 04-14-2020, 08:21 AM
 
45 posts, read 26,188 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
There is a reason NO ONE seems to be talking about the TRILLION dollar stimulus, or round 2 coming pretty soon!!



If the govt effectively keeps everyone in the dark, as to the state of the economy, they can continue on like this for quite a while!


Example...the govt can just fire up the printing machines and start cranking out $100s 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, and just throw them out of an airplane over cities...if businesses are not aware that the economy has collapsed...they will keep their prices the same.


Obviously, this cannot go on forever, but it can fool enough people for long enough.
It has been this way since FIAT money was invented. The only reason some are complaining now is because they don't want to see others prospering. If you were really against it you would have been against it from day one.
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Old 04-14-2020, 09:00 AM
 
Location: The Triad
34,090 posts, read 82,975,811 times
Reputation: 43666
Quote:
Originally Posted by UCisannoying View Post
It has been this way since FIAT money was invented.
If you were really against it you would have been against it from day one.

The only reason some are complaining now is because they ...
Because they weren't really aware of the potential negative aspects and factors before...
certainly not to the degree of those who would most seem to have been benefiting most from that risk.

DDT and FREON used to be considered wonderful enhancements to life.
Then more was understood.

Last edited by MrRational; 04-14-2020 at 09:11 AM..
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Old 04-14-2020, 09:16 AM
 
37,617 posts, read 45,996,704 times
Reputation: 57199
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianGC View Post
No, YOU should write a check to the government if you want to.

Taxes are a part of life. You can leave anytime.
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Old 04-14-2020, 09:26 AM
 
45 posts, read 26,188 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
Because they weren't really aware of the potential negative aspects and factors before...
certainly not to the degree of those who would most seem to have been benefiting most from that risk.

DDT and FREON used to be considered wonderful enhancements to life.
Then more was understood.
It only becomes an issue when they see others benefiting equally from the system that brought them wealth. Then suddenly they must get rid of it and it is a major problem. I've seen this time and time again.

Using a broken system is OK as long as it benefits YOUR coffers; but as soon as others are able to pay their bills, buy food for their homes, and live a life full of less stress; its "evil, lazy, we don't need more taxes, we will pay for this later" and so on and so forth.

Corporations do this all of the time its a "handout" when people get it for their families; but "good for the economy" when a greedy corporation that doesn't even hire, can't compete in the market, and breaks all kinds of laws receives "free handouts." I'm no longer listening to anyone who supports this kind of inequality. If you're so against it give up your wealth. Return every last penny and everything it has bought to the state. If this is so bad, don't use cash/credit/etc. at all.

I doubt any of the naysayers here will go that route. You want to keep what you have but don't want others to have the same.
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Old 04-14-2020, 09:28 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Utah!
1,452 posts, read 1,081,687 times
Reputation: 4033
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChessieMom View Post
Taxes are a part of life. You can leave anytime.
Your other post was advocating for increasing taxes. Again, feel free to send more of YOUR money to the government.
They need to focus on reducing the reckless spending.
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Old 04-14-2020, 10:04 AM
 
37,617 posts, read 45,996,704 times
Reputation: 57199
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianGC View Post
Your other post was advocating for increasing taxes. Again, feel free to send more of YOUR money to the government.
They need to focus on reducing the reckless spending.
And taxes are the only way out of this huge debt that has been created. Clearly the "reducing the reckless spending" is wishful thinking at this point.
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Old 04-14-2020, 10:17 AM
 
Location: Orange County, CA
4,901 posts, read 3,361,298 times
Reputation: 2975
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post

The real risk is we have to eventually pay back this debt, oh and we pay alot for interest. ALOT. But even that is mitigated as long as we increase our GDP faster than our interest payments are increasing, and we have historically done that. So as long as GDP keep up we are OK. In fact, we can afford to borrow more. It's not desirable, but the US can do it. There is more of a cushion then you think.
Only problem is that you cannot have perpetual economic (or population) growth on a planet with finite resources.
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Old 04-14-2020, 10:32 AM
 
5,401 posts, read 6,531,949 times
Reputation: 12017
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRational View Post
Make that a .sig file.
Most of which seems rooted in not having a known limit on the 'corrective actions'.

And HAVE BEEN for over twenty years.

The recent biggies have been ...
1) the war that Bush Jr started without any sort of financing; and
2) the bailout triggered at the end of the Bush Jr term; and
3) the current fiasco at the end of another R term.

& national debt almost doubled during Obama administration.
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