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We've all heard the word 'successful" be applied to people in various contexts whether it's a book about the habits of highly successful people or the friend who tried to once hook you up with a potential mate who was described as being "wildly successful." But what does this really mean? Take the following scenarios, for example. Which of these individuals would you consider a "success"?
-Jason was an All-State high school basketball star, an All-Conference star in college, and was drafted in the 2nd Round by the Minnesota Timberwolves. While Jason managed to put together a 12-year NBA career, he played for 8 different teams in that span, making it into the starting rotation only a few times, and played mostly as a backup. For short periods of time, he was relegated to the G-League, the NBA's minor league. He never won a championship and put up pedestrian numbers that failed to merit him any individual distinction or recognition. The fanbases for the teams he played for mostly don't even know who he is. Despite his lack of recognition at the pro level, Jason earned more than $50 million during his 12-year career. At 34, he's retired and has unsuccessfully tried his hand at sports broadcasting. He's not cut out to be a "front office" guy. He's still in the process of trying to figure out his post-NBA life and sits around the house most days in a semi-deep depression.
-Jenna knew from the very beginning she wanted to be a "creative" and followed her heart's desire. After college, Jenna hustled and found employment with a major publication as a photographer and editor, quickly distinguishing herself. After having received several promotions and awards, Jenna decides it's a good time to strike out on her own in her early 30s and open her own studio. However, Jenna was never the most business-savvy person, and her studio completely flops within 5 years. Jenna is then forced to go back to her old company with hat in hand. She gets hired back, but at a lower position than the one she was in when she left. She's become somewhat of a cautionary tale around the office. When she goes to the lunchroom one day, she overhears a couple of people saying that she "failed to live up to her potential." Jenna still produces brilliant work, but feels very bad about the state of her career.
-Brian graduated from Princeton and Wharton with honors and landed a high-paying job on Wall Street. After 10 years, Brian is still on Wall Street, making approximately $500,000 per year. Brian is good at his job, but not great, and has maxed out his promotion potential. In fact, people who are younger than him have been promoted ahead of him. He thinks his job is pointless and not really intellectually stimulating but he stays in it for the money. He'd like to leave and follow his "passion" but he hasn't really figured out what that is yet. For the time being, he's content to keep getting large paychecks until he's laid off or fired, whichever comes first.
-Peter has been working to make a partner at a large law firm for the past several years. He's put all of his energy into this pursuit. During the last partnership meeting, the partners voted against making Peter a partner for the third time. Peter decides to leave his firm and finds a solid in-house gig at a company that pays him $200,000 per year plus stock options. However, this is less than his salary at the firm, and a lot less than the $700,000+ he was expecting to make as partner. To make matters worse, one of his close friends, Mary, made partner, and while Peter is happy for her, he can't help but feel like he just wasn't good enough. Peter has no reason at all to doubt his wife's loyalty, but he can't shake the feeling in the back of his mind that he's failed her. His wife is a younger, hot number, and the other day when Peter went to pick her up from yoga class, he noticed her talking to a dashing, salt and peppered hair gentleman that was standing next to an Aston-Martin.
-Mary is a much better attorney than Peter. But she only ended up being an attorney because she couldn't figure out what to do after college with a degree in English and Creative Writing. Mary likes the work, but doesn't love it. After a few years, her salary swells way into the 7-figure range. Mary finds herself increasingly unhappy with her work/life balance and often wonders if she made a huge mistake by choosing this career path.
-Paul had a hard upbringing. He managed to scrap his way through the 4th best public university in his state. After college, he got a low-level cubicle job at a paper company making $40,000 per year, but through hard work and determination he has worked his way up to middle management and now makes $120,000 per year. In Paul's mind, he has "made it."
I’m going to post this video again because it encapsulates my thoughts on success. Only the individual can determine what success means to THEM. We each have to determine what we value and how we will pursue that. You have to be strong enough to not care how others define success for you. Success is what it meaningful to you. It doesn’t even have to do anything with education, or work status, or money.
In all the scenarios you talk about people having or not having resources and if those resources are enough or not enough for those people or other people that they know.
I'm sure you've heard that money increases overall happiness until about $75k and then the law of diminishing returns set in and then, generally speaking, you can't expect your overall happiness to increase in relation to the amount of income so that the average someone making $100k isn't going to be substantially less happy than the average someone earning $700k.
I guess $75k is around the mark that most people feel like the lower levels of well-being and survival, things like personal security and food and housing are taken care of and then it's time to work on those upper levels of Maslow's hierarchy. But those things may, or may not, require a substantial amount of capital. For example, your dream maybe to start a business or a non-profit and that would require a lot of capital whereas someone like me just wants to read lots of books and garden, which requires very little financial investment. That's how and why you get the differences in how "successful" people FEEL at different income brackets. That's why and how you get the differences in how "successful" people FEEL about OTHERS at different income brackets.
I'm not the least bit successful by most people standards: I have no special or marketable skill or talent. I almost failed at getting a degree. I failed at properly using my degree. I failed to ever make more than $30k. I have no incentive or motivation to do anything widely impactful in my community. Relatedly, I've got a very weak social network.
However, I've maintained a strong and healthy relationship with my spouse for the last 18 years and whatever he's built, I've supported. Whatever resources he's brought in I took care of so even though 14 years ago we were just above the poverty line and the kids and I were on public assistance we are now probably only a month or two of cresting the $2,000,000 mark.
You could argue that's only my husband's success. And/or having luck.
Sure... but we're surrounded by people who've been given and earned more for a lot longer than us yet seemingly struggle because they want more.. more stuff or more "experiences"... or because they weren't attentive to the bottom line enough... It's easy to overspend on lots of things, especially eating out.. I see it all the time...
I really don't let others perceptions of my success or failure trouble me because I know in all likelihood I've got the resources to maintain my preferred lifestyle for the rest of my life and I have a few ideas on troubleshooting if something very serious comes up like long-term unemployment or my husband's death.
These are the reasons why I don't stress out about other people and their net worth, including neighbors, relatives and coworkers. It does make me mad that other people would have anger or resentment towards us though. I feel like we are starting to see it, especially recently, with a few relatives following the deaths of a few other relatives. Stories and perceptions we never knew about, floating around.
Whatever. Like I said, we've always tried to "stay in our lanes" so to speak. It's really the best course of action.
I’m going to post this video again because it encapsulates my thoughts on success. Only the individual can determine what success means to THEM. We each have to determine what we value and how we will pursue that. You have to be strong enough to not care how others define success for you. Success is what it meaningful to you. It doesn’t even have to do anything with education, or work status, or money.
In all the scenarios you talk about people having or not having resources and if those resources are enough or not enough for those people or other people that they know.
I'm sure you've heard that money increases overall happiness until about $75k and then the law of diminishing returns set in and then, generally speaking, you can't expect your overall happiness to increase in relation to the amount of income so that the average someone making $100k isn't going to be substantially less happy than the average someone earning $700k.
I guess $75k is around the mark that most people feel like the lower levels of well-being and survival, things like personal security and food and housing are taken care of and then it's time to work on those upper levels of Maslow's hierarchy. But those things may, or may not, require a substantial amount of capital. For example, your dream maybe to start a business or a non-profit and that would require a lot of capital whereas someone like me just wants to read lots of books and garden, which requires very little financial investment. That's how and why you get the differences in how "successful" people FEEL at different income brackets. That's why and how you get the differences in how "successful" people FEEL about OTHERS at different income brackets.
I'm not the least bit successful by most people standards: I have no special or marketable skill or talent. I almost failed at getting a degree. I failed at properly using my degree. I failed to ever make more than $30k. I have no incentive or motivation to do anything widely impactful in my community. Relatedly, I've got a very weak social network.
However, I've maintained a strong and healthy relationship with my spouse for the last 18 years and whatever he's built, I've supported. Whatever resources he's brought in I took care of so even though 14 years ago we were just above the poverty line and the kids and I were on public assistance we are now probably only a month or two of cresting the $2,000,000 mark.
You could argue that's only my husband's success. And/or having luck.
Sure... but we're surrounded by people who've been given and earned more for a lot longer than us yet seemingly struggle because they want more.. more stuff or more "experiences"... or because they weren't attentive to the bottom line enough... It's easy to overspend on lots of things, especially eating out.. I see it all the time...
I really don't let others perceptions of my success or failure trouble me because I know in all likelihood I've got the resources to maintain my preferred lifestyle for the rest of my life and I have a few ideas on troubleshooting if something very serious comes up like long-term unemployment or my husband's death.
These are the reasons why I don't stress out about other people and their net worth, including neighbors, relatives and coworkers. It does make me mad that other people would have anger or resentment towards us though. I feel like we are starting to see it, especially recently, with a few relatives following the deaths of a few other relatives. Stories and perceptions we never knew about, floating around.
Whatever. Like I said, we've always tried to "stay in our lanes" so to speak. It's really the best course of action.
I like your perspective.
My wife's parents were successful professional types. Most of her extended family were and are sod-busters across Kansas, Nebraska and Iowa nearly all virtually penniless at all times.
My parents were also successful professionals. Most of their/my extended family members ranged from perpetually broke to felons.
My wife and I agreed before marriage that our kids and their educations would be driver number 1. A sub-part of that meant working for a fair level of financial success so we could help nieces and nephews when needed/appropriate. We've done a good bit of that.
In all the scenarios you talk about people having or not having resources and if those resources are enough or not enough for those people or other people that they know.
I'm sure you've heard that money increases overall happiness until about $75k and then the law of diminishing returns set in and then, generally speaking, you can't expect your overall happiness to increase in relation to the amount of income so that the average someone making $100k isn't going to be substantially less happy than the average someone earning $700k.
I guess $75k is around the mark that most people feel like the lower levels of well-being and survival, things like personal security and food and housing are taken care of and then it's time to work on those upper levels of Maslow's hierarchy. But those things may, or may not, require a substantial amount of capital. For example, your dream maybe to start a business or a non-profit and that would require a lot of capital whereas someone like me just wants to read lots of books and garden, which requires very little financial investment. That's how and why you get the differences in how "successful" people FEEL at different income brackets. That's why and how you get the differences in how "successful" people FEEL about OTHERS at different income brackets.
I'm not the least bit successful by most people standards: I have no special or marketable skill or talent. I almost failed at getting a degree. I failed at properly using my degree. I failed to ever make more than $30k. I have no incentive or motivation to do anything widely impactful in my community. Relatedly, I've got a very weak social network.
However, I've maintained a strong and healthy relationship with my spouse for the last 18 years and whatever he's built, I've supported. Whatever resources he's brought in I took care of so even though 14 years ago we were just above the poverty line and the kids and I were on public assistance we are now probably only a month or two of cresting the $2,000,000 mark.
You could argue that's only my husband's success. And/or having luck.
Sure... but we're surrounded by people who've been given and earned more for a lot longer than us yet seemingly struggle because they want more.. more stuff or more "experiences"... or because they weren't attentive to the bottom line enough... It's easy to overspend on lots of things, especially eating out.. I see it all the time...
I really don't let others perceptions of my success or failure trouble me because I know in all likelihood I've got the resources to maintain my preferred lifestyle for the rest of my life and I have a few ideas on troubleshooting if something very serious comes up like long-term unemployment or my husband's death.
These are the reasons why I don't stress out about other people and their net worth, including neighbors, relatives and coworkers. It does make me mad that other people would have anger or resentment towards us though. I feel like we are starting to see it, especially recently, with a few relatives following the deaths of a few other relatives. Stories and perceptions we never knew about, floating around.
Whatever. Like I said, we've always tried to "stay in our lanes" so to speak. It's really the best course of action.
Yep. My mom was a stay at home mom and raised 3 kids. She considers her greatest success to be preparing us to take flight. She worked and still does to this day to decorate her home and to make it inviting to us for holidays. That’s her metric for success. She hasn’t made a “dime” of money.
I’m going to post this video again because it encapsulates my thoughts on success. Only the individual can determine what success means to THEM. We each have to determine what we value and how we will pursue that. You have to be strong enough to not care how others define success for you. Success is what it meaningful to you. It doesn’t even have to do anything with education, or work status, or money.
Totally agree. I feel successful myself. But for personal reasons no need to share. I am just happy and I enjoy my life and I don't feel I have stress from a financial POV....and I don't make 6 figures.
What I feel successful about:
-I don't fight with my wife
-I have plenty of leisure time
-never work weekends
-part-time job on the side I LOVE doing
-I recently found a passion for something new
-paid off my house
-own my own Toyota
-not a slave to the banks
If you Got poor white southern past
And you are living in a house in California - not a trailer -Lots of food in the frig and car less than 10 years old you feel a giant success
The mere fact that you posted this in the Economics forum means that you associate success exclusively with work and money.
It could, however, encompass very different things - an artist having his work known, a wonderful marriage, a slow satisfying honing of skills, a high degree of autonomy...
The mere fact that you posted this in the Economics forum means that you associate success exclusively with work and money.
It could, however, encompass very different things - an artist having his work known, a wonderful marriage, a slow satisfying honing of skills, a high degree of autonomy...
Your opening stanza is silly.
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