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It is the lack of regulation that caused the sub-prime loan run up of real estate, the lack of regulation that will have caused the pending credit card market collapse, as well as all the Enrons and most of the other financial mess in the country. These regulations that came about as wise consideration after the Last Great Depression were started to be pulled off during Reagan-moronomics and the US has been heading into debt since. It was perfected during the Contract on America and the idiot MBA-class have sunk the country for short-term profits.
As much as this may upset some people, it's a pretty accurate observation. If only we had Sarbanes-Oxley BEFORE Enron, MCI and Arthur Anderesen, etc.
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Originally Posted by KevK
America and the American way have always been in change. We have changed since we began. We went from being a nation of farmers to being a nation of factory workers and then from being a nation of factory workers to being a nation of service workers. We went from being largely rural to being largely urban. We change and we are changing all the time. As for living, we may end up having to live "smaller" but we will be living "smarter" at the same time. We are Americans after all. And this is not our first "oil shock". We had one in the 70s and we all started buying smaller cars such as the Gremlin and Pinto. Cars that were a piece of crap but got good MPG. Today's small cars- like the Corolla are much more comfortable and reliable. We will be fine. No matter what America goes though- oil shocks, disasters, depressions, wars, terrorist attacks we ALWAYS come out STRONGER in the end.
Overall I agree. Only difference is the generation that has to deal with these crises is pretty ignorant to our previous crises as you have mentioned above. That's what's a little scary. I recall my parents talking about gas lines and "gas days," but many of my friends would argue that this is a first - LOL! This time, the pain will be felt more so than decades ago, IMO, because people aren't used to sacrificing anymore. At least in the 70s, you had some people who lived in the Great Depression. I think we'll be okay, but it will make many uncomfortable in the process...although better in the longrun, IMO.
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Originally Posted by Wild Style
I think they need to start regulating mortgages and rent as well. Other wise greedy and absurd people will price out the much needed lower and middle classes in many metro areas. We live in some crazy and messed up times.
Totally agree. The gap between the haves and have-nots is way too wide, IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gardener34
...the people who grew up not knowing what that was like... and taking the cheap gas for granted, they're in shock.
Also, the option for people to move closer to where they work is a joke. Companies lay off when their bottom line hiccups, so people find themselves out of work more often. The days of working for a company for 30 years and living in a house that is 15 minutes away are gone. Why would you move to be near your work to save gas $$, when you may not be working there next year?
My case in point, I was laid off in 1997, in 2002 and now again in 2008.
Yup, on the working near your job and the cheap gas for granted (myself included) .
I'm sorry to hear about your job loss, but it is something of a 21st Century phenomena that being "laid off" no longer has a negative connotation. Indeed, these times may be more reminiscent of the 1930s and 1970s than most realize. A lot of people really are in the same boat.
Last edited by Jaded; 05-23-2008 at 10:54 AM..
Reason: minor corrections
In a world of limited and dwindling resources, it is ultimately of concern to everyone when some people consume more than their fair share of a crucial commodity. Or when they look for a bailout to soften the repercussions of their own stupid decisions. When what you do affects others, it stops being your business and becomes theirs, too. Unfortunately.
But whatever. My McMansion is paid for, I telecommute, have a bicycle and drive a Prius. So I'm merely offering a global perspective.
In a world of limited and dwindling resources, it is ultimately of concern to everyone when some people consume more than their fair share of a crucial commodity. Or when they look for a bailout to soften the repercussions of their own stupid decisions. When what you do affects others, it stops being your business and becomes theirs, too. Unfortunately.
But whatever. My McMansion is paid for, I telecommute, have a bicycle and drive a Prius. So I'm merely offering a global perspective.
I really don't see urban america coming back.It does not have the infrastrusture to come back and many businesses have already moved. Most light rail planned in the sountry are for moving peole from suburbia to the city and mostly the out-lyinbg areas.Many only extend into a city center because of funding. Besides many of the busnesses are no longer manufacturing but busnesses that require new space and area to grow. The population has already been following the jobs if you look at a growth maps. There are however many smaller cities that attract more and more comapnies everyday becasue thay ahve space;reasonable cost and raes for workers to build . Most of these places have enviroments that attract the more high skilled workers to the area. Good schools;less crime and family type communties are the areas with the lifestyle these people value.Along with them these areas are attracting more retirees who want to leave the same problems behind when the retire.There will always be areas in the central cities that will attract the rich but then most of them will have more rural areas that they own a second home.
I have a feeling that the real trend will be a return to cottage industries/working from home, producing and consuming locally, and bartering with one's neighbor. It makes a lot more sense, particularly in view of technology, if only the American workplace can get past its mindset of having to SEE people at their desks every day to believe they're productive.
Producing and consuming mostly local goods keeps costs down as food and such does not have to be transported cross-country. It also keeps manufacturing jobs in the community and gives people a connection with what they buy and who makes it. Obviously, that's not possible for every industry but we should be doing a lot more of it than we are now. When I wanted steel skirting for my home, I didn't mind waiting a few extra days for the local company to custom roll my order. I was glad my money was staying in the community.
I'm often impressed by how entrepreneurial people can be when life throws them a curveball, how people can turn hobbies, talents, skills, and ideas into a cottage industry. Right now, it seems to be centered around moms who need to earn money but want to stay home with their children. I expect this will expand and we will see a plethora of little businesses and unique services offered. Heh, a few months ago, I saw a flier posted by someone who is offering a "poop scoop" service -- he contracts to come once or more per week to clean up doggy poop from people's yards. Odd, but creative!
Out here in the country, bartering and exchanging goods is big, too. Neighbors are planting different vegetables in their gardens and exchanging with each other. A gentleman offered to haul an old appliance away for me and wouldn't take money for doing it but he did accept a vacuum cleaner I was no longer using because he needed one.
I see a return to a simpler, more community- and neighborhood-centered existence.
Seek out the movie "End of Suburbia". I touches on a lot of what you are talking about. I would add, while some communities will do as you said, I think some may not be viable moving forward.
I hope to see this become more commonplace. It only makes sense as developers "master plan" communities in rural areas where the people who live there have to drive way out to have basic needs and services met.
This is the idea with Fresh & Easy. It's more of a neighborhood store, not a lot of "stuff" on shelves, but it's convenient for smaller towns and cities. Not sure how much they will expand, but it's a nice concept.
Seek out the movie "End of Suburbia". I touches on a lot of what you are talking about. I would add, while some communities will do as you said, I think some may not be viable moving forward.
I will, sounds interesting! Is it a feature film, documentary-style, or what?
By choice, I've mostly lived in predominantly rural areas since graduating from college. Maybe it's because I grew up in a city and area predicated on steel/manufacturing and I saw the devastation it wrought when the steel industry left. First, I lived and worked in New Hampshire and then I moved to Texas.
While these sound like places that are polar opposite from each other, they're not. There's a fierce independence and ingenuity in both, from generations who had to fight the elements and rely on their own hard work and smarts to survive. The investment, corporate and political capitols are far removed from us and we put all of our energy and thought into solutions when trouble hits. We don't look elsewhere.
And that's the way the whole country is going to have to learn to be. People and areas that can adapt quickly and get to work will always survive, if not thrive. Those who wait and waste time looking for markets to reverse or Washington to step in will not.
I hope to see this become more commonplace. It only makes sense as developers "master plan" communities in rural areas where the people who live there have to drive way out to have basic needs and services met.
This is the idea with Fresh & Easy. It's more of a neighborhood store, not a lot of "stuff" on shelves, but it's convenient for smaller towns and cities. Not sure how much they will expand, but it's a nice concept.
Jaded, we don't need that sort of thing. We have our own gardens and a farmers market open three days per week! We also have local, family-owned grocers who sell the basics plus locally raised meats and locally produced dairy products. Oftentimes, folks I know will give me a package of venison from their most recent hunt, too. Typical suburbanites everywhere can easily live a more self-determining life by simply putting in a family garden in the backyard and planting some fruit trees. They just haven't had the impetus to do so.
It sometimes amazes me how far from the basics Americans have become. Folks complain about food prices, professionals warn about how fat and sedentary kids are now, but no one considers that having family gardens would go a long way toward addressing several problems! Urbanites can even do container gardens! I think 4-H needs to expand, LOL!
I will, sounds interesting! Is it a feature film, documentary-style, or what?
By choice, I've mostly lived in predominantly rural areas since graduating from college. Maybe it's because I grew up in a city and area predicated on steel/manufacturing and I saw the devastation it wrought when the steel industry left. First, I lived and worked in New Hampshire and then I moved to Texas.
While these sound like places that are polar opposite from each other, they're not. There's a fierce independence and ingenuity in both, from generations who had to fight the elements and rely on their own hard work and smarts to survive. The investment, corporate and political capitols are far removed from us and we put all of our energy and thought into solutions when trouble hits. We don't look elsewhere.
And that's the way the whole country is going to have to learn to be. People and areas that can adapt quickly and get to work will always survive, if not thrive. Those who wait and waste time looking for markets to reverse or Washington to step in will not.
its a documentary with a lot of interviews. You will thank me later. I lived in Texas for awhile, Euless to be exact. Did you know Austin is one of the "greenest" cities in America?
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Cottage Industries - Community Services
