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While I believe the intent behind Affirmative Action was good, it has, in fact hurt some minorities, depending on what minority group glasses through which you were viewing the world of course.
As mentioned on CD before, in the mid 80's I was in charge of HR for the largest department store in the country at the time. The company sold to government entities which is why we were bound to affirmative action quotas. Simply put, I was unable to hire a more qualified black woman as I had to fill the quota for a Pacific Islander instead. How is that fair? I guess it all depends on perspective, however, from mine Affirmative Action doesn't work because it penalizes the qualified employee in favor of one who isn't. Having said that, why do you believe it levels the playing field?
Affirmative action has and still does work because minorities would be worse off today if didnt exist. It forced people who make the hiring decisions to take a look at minorities for job openings. If they weren't forced to do so, whites wouldnt have even looked at minority candidates for job positions, and wouldn't even if they were more qualified. you can't tell me minorities would be better of today without affirmative action than with it. Libertarian goverment would just turn back the clock.
Originally Posted by LordBalfor
What makes you think I've not heard of the 1920 Depression?
Did you not even bother to read the link I posted?
Apparently not.
Well here's another that you'll probably not bother reading either:
Both articles essentially say the same thing - that folks like you take away from that event the lessons you WANT to take away from it without really bothering to look at the FULL picture - highlighting what you want to highlight and IGNORING the facts that "spoil your theory".
The fact is, economics is a SOFT science - one where very little is "proveable" and virtually everything is just "theory" - that's WHY there are two main economic "camps". If economics was "proveable" there wouldn't be such disagreement between the Keynesian and Austrian economic camps - but it isn't "proveable". No one can rewind history and say "lets try this approach this time - as compared to that approach last time". Recessions/Depressions are like children in the same family - they all have things in common but no two are exactly alike so comparing one to another is "suspect" at best.
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I can't let the above go by without commenting. Has Lord Balfor ever heard of or looked at any of the writings of the scholars of the Mises Institute as far as discovering that Austrian Economics has INDEED been PROVEN? I doubt it when he thinks some blogger's ideas carry more weight than Tom Woods or any of the other experts on Austrian Economics. For his info, Austrian Economics was PROVEN during the Forgotten Depression of 1920 when rather than do what Keyenians like FDR and now Obama would do during during depressions to "fix them" by having the government spend money it didn't have and bankrupt the country making people even WORSE off than before, President HARDING did what any Austrian Economist would do and let businesses fail; gave no hand outs; cut taxes; cut back on government spending and VOILA! The Depression which started out worse than the worst of the 1929 Depression, was over in a matter of months!
Economics isn't ROCKET SCIENCE. It is COMMON SENSE! You don't spend money you don't have and you don't allow bad debt to get worse and worse and make it someone else's responsibility. If a business owner fails, he fails. Let someone more competent take his place. He shouldn't be given a pass and not be forced to suffer the consequences like all the banksters and clutzy corporations like GM have been given with the taxpayers bailing them out.
You can't have a level playing field when the most of the hiring decisions are made by mostly 1 race. Thats why affirmative action was created in the first place. If whites make up 80% of the people who make hiring decisions, minorites are going to be at a disadvantage. A libertarian government brings us back to the 50's and 60's and puts minorities back into the same situation my grandparents and parents had to fight to change. If there wasnt any affirmative action, minorities would be even worse off today than we would be with it. If 100% of the jobs are going to go to white people because they are white, people like me are screwed because we have no shot.
Affirmative Action requires you hire based on race rather than qualifications. You are saying whites will only hire whites today? Does the same go for blacks only hiring blacks, or any other minority group hiring only within their minority?
Affirmative Action requires you hire based on race rather than qualifications. You are saying whites will only hire whites today? Does the same go for blacks only hiring blacks, or any other minority group hiring only within their minority?
Affirmative action has and still does work because minorities would be worse off today if didnt exist. It forced people who make the hiring decisions to take a look at minorities for job openings. If they weren't forced to do so, whites wouldnt have even looked at minority candidates for job positions, and wouldn't even if they were more qualified. you can't tell me minorities would be better of today without affirmative action than with it. Libertarian goverment would just turn back the clock.
I can tell you that based on my own experience. Did you read the part in my post about the more qualified black woman I wanted to hire but was unable to because of race quotas? Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I am talking about 2012, not 50 years ago.
Maybe I misunderstood you, but I thought you were saying that AA ONLY includes race as a factor.
Quote:
1967. President Johnson amended E.O. 11246 to include affirmative action for women. Federal contractors now required to make good-faith efforts to expand employment opportunities for women and minorities.
Affirmative action has and still does work because minorities would be worse off today if didnt exist. It forced people who make the hiring decisions to take a look at minorities for job openings. If they weren't forced to do so, whites wouldnt have even looked at minority candidates for job positions, and wouldn't even if they were more qualified. you can't tell me minorities would be better of today without affirmative action than with it. Libertarian goverment would just turn back the clock.
Here's what it did as I said before. If forced employers to lower standards for the less qualified minority candidates in order not to exclude them even though they weren't as competent. A Brief History Of: Affirmative Action - TIME
Are you saying that Minorities TO THIS DAY still haven't taken advantage of any of the opportunities that are widely available to better themselves and learn new skills and STILL NEED Affirmative Action programs?
I hope the answer is "no".
BTW there are things called "public libraries" where minorities are FREE to go and EDUCATE THEMSELVES. We had public libraries back before Affirmative Action too. Back then the libraries had books that are even more edifying than they have now.
If certain minorities WANTED to better themselves on their own without a hand-out or special treatment, they could have done so ON THEIR OWN and still can today. They don't NEED the GUBMINT. They can do it on their own. All it takes is thinking a little closer to the perimeters of the box. It doesn't even require thinking outside the box. : )
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