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I dont think that is 100% the doing of men either though. Model shows are overwhelmingly watched by women, style mags bought by women, gossip mags bought by women, womens fashions, make up and fragrance made or signed off on by women......
What is all of that based on? I dont know the exact combination. But I seriously doubt it the general male populace fueling all of that.
As I said, that VS fashion show is watched more by men, i read it in a poll I beleive last year. That's all the men at work talk about the day after. But again, I'm making this up....
Well I didn't mean they are fueling all of it, but most of it, yes. What I see happening is they puts all of this pressure on average women to look a certain way and they do that by going on about how some women look. This causes an immediate reaction for average women to try and keep up with that the demands of these men's fantasies/wants, hence, the "how to satisfy your man in 4 minutes" articles or whatever, sexy clothes, etc.
Hmm, I wonder how height really affects attraction. If I had an identical twin, same size and build but 8 inches shorter, would she get the same, more, or less attention from men? I have to guess she'd get less. Even if the fashion industry disappeared, I would imagine a lot of men see very tall women as a novelty or something rare to be conquered or checked off their list. I think that alone would mean more attention than you'd get as a shorty, but only because it's something different from the norm. If the average height for women was 5'10 instead of 5'4, I imagine the rare petite woman would be the one getting extra attention at the bar.
Hmm, I wonder how height really affects attraction. If I had an identical twin, same size and build but 8 inches shorter, would she get the same, more, or less attention from men? I have to guess she'd get less. Even if the fashion industry disappeared, I would imagine a lot of men see very tall women as a novelty or something rare to be conquered or checked off their list. I think that alone would mean more attention than you'd get as a shorty, but only because it's something different from the norm. If the average height for women was 5'10 instead of 5'4, I imagine the rare petite woman would be the one getting extra attention at the bar.
The thing is, I get just as much attention from women as I do men when I'm out.
My husband always asks "So what comments did you get?" when I return from the ladies room.
This causes an immediate reaction for average women to try and keep up with that the demands of these men's fantasies/wants, hence, the "how to satisfy your man in 4 minutes" articles or whatever, sexy clothes, etc.
Do you think men came up with many of these "womens fashions"? And who is writing that "how to satisfy your man in 4 minutes"?
Yeah, I understand that a good deal of what many women do is "mancentric", but Im wondering how much of it is actually fueled by men, or just an industry that capitalizes on womens insecurities and brainwashes both men and women in to thinking a certain image is ideal, just the same way theyd sell them on toothpaste.
Seriously, just over 100 years ago, plump and stocky women were considered the most attractive body type. Did men some how evolve in to a different species between then and now, or did the media decide that image was "out", just as they decided the hippy, curvy Marilyn Monroe look was "out" about 40 years ago?
I have to admit that a lot of men including myself are attracted to Victoria Secret and other super model types but honestly what I notice about these types is that some of them are too thin and and in my opinion the garments they wear don't bring out their best features. Personally I find most supermodels and many Hollywood types pretty faces and somewhat attractive but not exactly what I would consider my ideal type of woman.
OK Ruth. Again, I don't know size well, but my ex-girlfriends have been 4-8 (and I thought 8 was too big) in range. But none have been taller than 5'5". You must be very tall.
OK, this makes sense. So you're basically dealing with petites. I'm not "very tall", more what I consider to be average (5'8"), but the feedback I've gotten is that I look best at a size 12. Anything smaller than that, and I lose my curves. Bone structure has something to do with sizing, too, I guess.
Do you think men came up with many of these "womens fashions"? And who is writing that "how to satisfy your man in 4 minutes"?
Yeah, I understand that a good deal of what many women do is "mancentric", but Im wondering how much of it is actually fueled by men, or just an industry that capitalizes on womens insecurities and brainwashes both men and women in to thinking a certain image is ideal, just the same way theyd sell them on toothpaste.
Seriously, just over 100 years ago, plump and stocky women were considered the most attractive body type. Did men some how evolve in to a different species between then and now, or did the media decide that image was "out", just as they decided the hippy, curvy Marilyn Monroe look was "out" about 40 years ago?
I used to work in women's magazines. I know that women are primarily writing the articles. I never said they weren't. What I said was: these things are of such importance to women because of the pressures men put on women to look a certain way. The women who rarely follow these types of trends and things get criticized, ostracized and ignored by men (and some women) in general. Go look at that weight/dealbreaker thread' and you will see examples what I am talking about. There is a demand for women to look a certain way as decided by men. Once again: What they say online, is NOT what I see IRL. I don't care how many times they "talk" about wanting the "nerdy, no make up girl" over the "hot one."
From being handed the "friend" card a few times over the years, I can tell you, women have this REALLY bad habit of pursuing and dating the EXACT same type of guy over and over and over again.
They then come to the conclusion that "all men are the same", when really, its just theyve actually never bothered looking for anything different than theyve always had. They never even venture out of the pool.
If you keep dating tatooed biker guy, dont keep being surprised when they slap you around and put you on the corner to make them money.
Hey now... my Dad is a big, tattooed biker guy who has been happily married to my Mother since just out of High School.
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The thing is, I get just as much attention from women as I do men when I'm out.
My husband always asks "So what comments did you get?" when I return from the ladies room.
Oh, I get PLENTY of attention but it's usually laced with negativity. Last weekend I had a girl come up to me and say 'wow, you're so tall! It must be impossible to get dates!' Or the ever present ' Why do you wear heels?? You're already a giant!'. I laugh and move on, but it seems to me my height (or my boobs) are always a topic of conversation and I seem well-liked, but romantically men simply aren't interested.
I did hit on a 5'2 asian guy last weekend who turned me down flat...haha.
I used to work in women's magazines. I know that women are primarily writing the articles. I never said they weren't. What I said was: these things are of such importance to women because of the pressures men put on women to look a certain way. The women who rarely follow these types of trends and things get criticized, ostracized and ignored by men (and some women) in general. Go look at that weight/dealbreaker thread' and you will see examples what I am talking about. There is a demand for women to look a certain way as decided by men. Once again: What they say online, is NOT what I see IRL. I don't care how many times they "talk" about wanting the "nerdy, no make up girl" over the "hot one."
Believe what you want and I'll do the same.
An interesting comparison is when you look at the gay community. With exceptions, of course, gay men wanting to appeal to other men are more body-, weight-, and fashion-conscious than many gay women who wish to appeal to women. If it was just about gender, and the men don't care about looks and women do, the gay men would be universally sloppy and the lesbians would be decked-out.
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