[cfbs2691]

Originally Posted by StarfishKey

If this is really true, then I blame you for doing no research before dropping a ton of money down on a trip. Two whole weeks to go somewhere you know nothing at all about and are not at all suited for? How in the world was it too hot for you in the coldest or near-coldest time of the year?? Depending on when you came, it was somewhere between 60-82 degrees with plenty of breeze, sunshine, and low humidity. The rest of the US was freezing, you could have stayed in any location in the country and it likely would have been colder than here if you can't handle 75 degrees.

It's too "immoral" for you? Why didn't you just stay home and go to your building of worship? Why choose the Keys if you have such a strict moral code? Do you go to Las Vegas and then complain about the gambling and the strippers? Lots of families come to the Keys and have no problem whatsoever, so if you were unable to avoid unsavory elements while here then again, you did no research at all and put yourself in that situation.

Likewise, if it was too expensive to come down, no one made you book it. It should not have come as a surprise to you when you got here that you had to pay for your hotel.

I have compassion for a lot of people, but not people who cause their own problems. 2 weeks is a long vacation. Who has the money and the time to take one, but not the common sense to look up where you're going first?

Amen!

[Irishtom29]

Originally Posted by StarfishKey

If this is really true, then I blame you for doing no research before dropping a ton of money down on a trip. Two whole weeks to go somewhere you know nothing at all about and are not at all suited for? How in the world was it too hot for you in the coldest or near-coldest time of the year?? .....

It's too "immoral" for you? Why didn't you just stay home and go to your building of worship? Why choose the Keys if you have such a strict moral code? Do you go to Las Vegas and then complain about the gambling and the strippers? ...

Likewise, if it was too expensive to come down, no one made you book it...

Who has the money and the time to take one, but not the common sense to look up where you're going first?

Does all this mean the poster did like Key West? Or that he was supposed to? That he didn't think it was too cold for him? That he shouldn't think the way he does? Or what?

The person didn't like Key West and said so, and that's that.

[totsuka]

Does anyone have experience getting a home remodeled in KW? I have a friend that wants to buy a home there....I think it needs about 100k in updates, but not familiar with contractor costs in KW. Is it through the roof or reasonable and competitive?

Tks

[Madruga]

The Keys are chock full of degenerates, alcoholics, and bums. Today it's rich and poor. Very little middle class.

[Roscoe Conkling]

And Key West,despite its Margaritaville laid-back image,has the same problems just like anywhere else.
Last time I was there in a grocery store a gang of black kids no more than 12 years of age came in hassling everyone and being plain aggressive.

[Madruga]

Dad lived near Islamorada in the 90s, says "never again".

[StarfishKey]

Originally Posted by totsuka

Does anyone have experience getting a home remodeled in KW? I have a friend that wants to buy a home there....I think it needs about 100k in updates, but not familiar with contractor costs in KW. Is it through the roof or reasonable and competitive?

Tks

I don't think that's wise. I can't speak to a specific contractor, but generally speaking it is crazy expensive because they have a monopoly, everything you could possibly want to do will require a long and sometimes expensive permit process, and there is usually a big backlog for licensed people. Most will have "Keys Disease" and not show up when they say they will, or never finish, or do terribly shoddy work. There is no such thing as competition down here, you beg for qualified people and take what you can get, and you're going to pay through the nose for real quality. There is no such thing as a short-cut, unless you've lived down here for many years and have a lot of Conch connections. But even so, there are only so many quality people around, and all of the materials have to be shipped in from the mainland, so it is hard to get the materials you want, and when you get them they cost extra to ship them down.

Where did you get the 100k figure? Because if that was a quote based on work that would be done in Iowa, expect 200k in KW when all is said and done, and expect to be 6 mos - 1 year past schedule. Maybe I would be wrong and your friend would get a lucky break, and it all would sail through at fair prices. But that is not a common story down here at all, and is generally regarded as a miracle if it does occur. Permitting requires that you use licensed people, and neighbors are more than willing to call in code violations (in part because they're nosy, but in part because it's pieces of YOUR house that will hit THEIR house when the next hurricane strikes, so that makes sense), so you can't just do the work yourself to cut costs. Your friend needs to get a clear quote IN WRITING, with written time estimates for when the work would start and when it would stop, BEFORE buying the house. People get booked up way in advance sometimes and what you thought would start next month actually won't start for 8 months. And if there is a hurricane, forget it, contractors will be backed up with emergency work long before your project will be gotten to.

Note that any work that requires digging will be WAY more expensive than on the mainland, because the Keys are almost solid rock underneath and between the high salt water table and the huge coral boulders, digging to put in posts, a pool, or whatever else you have in your idea of a dream home is going to be very difficult, might cause damage to nearby homes from the ground shaking, and is then prone to total destruction in the next flood.

I don't want to rain on your parade, but I think it's better to warn you of the reality of how it really is down here. Then if your friend is lucky, fine, it will just be a blessing. But if not, there will be no shock about it. 100k worth of necessary work is a big concern down here. I would get in at LEAST 2 inspectors to be sure that's the total amount. When so much work needs to be done, usually there are a lot of things that were missed too, like termites, mold, code violations that will need to be fixed immediately to avoid exponential fines, liens on the property, shoddy electrical, rats, bee infestation... and on and on. You only find out once you've gutted the place what's wrong underneath that couldn't be seen before!

I know of a lot of stories to back up what I've said here. Maybe this will be better than what I'm saying. But maybe it will be worse. I have stories about "worst case scenarios" too. This was just the average Keys contractor/remodel situation that I am mentioning here.

Double and triple-check that this place is really a great deal. Then be prepared to take 2 years to get all the permits cleared and get everything actually done. And know someone local, or at the very least someone not local you can fly in, who you know for sure does safe and lasting work, to oversee what is being done at each step. A local person is better because there are a lot of things that are specific to the Keys that are not true of even living in Miami, and we have our own code process completely. Your friend needs to plan for where they will stay while all of this work is going on. They can stay in the house while the work is happening, if it doesn't make them sick or drive them crazy (but I know people who've done this and it eventually depresses you to constantly be living in construction that never seems to be over). But it is illegal to stay in the yard in a trailer or tent (or car/van), so that idea is out. Neighbors will call code.

Still, if it's really nice and legal after, and your friend could afford it, that place might be worth a ton not only in property value, but in rental potential (assuming they don't mind renters trashing the place). But if a bad hurricane comes by, you might lose it all the second you just fixed it up. Everything is a gamble here. Make sure the plot is worth something, so if the house gets wrecked you can still sell it for a decent amount, or rebuild. Note that everything you permit for automatically gets sent on to tax code, so your taxes will go up if it improves the value of the house in any material way. Your friend should expect that if the previous owner has owned the house for more than 2 years, the taxes will jump above what they were last year when it changes hands. That's because most people take advantage of the Homestead Exemption, which puts a cap on tax increases more than 3% per year. If they've owned the property for 20 years, that means they might be paying on something assessed at 110k, that today will be reassessed when the property changes hands at 800k. Be prepared for a huge hike in the taxes, and be prepared to pay to hook the house up to sewer immediately if it is not already on the new owner's dime, plus penalties in arrears if there are any from the previous owner not hooking up. Also expect that whatever the hazard insurances are quoted at before purchase, might increase every year thereafter, as has been the case for a while. Flood, wind, and homeowner's are mandatory if you have a mortgage. Stay away from pre-FIRM (built partially or fully below-flood before 1973) properties, they will bankrupt you over time with increasing flood costs, and eventually they are likely to revoke the flood insurance eligibility altogether. If the house is all or mostly above flood, wind insurance will be the biggest cost.

Buying a Key West house is like gambling in Vegas. If you play your cards right, you could walk away very rich. But there is a greater chance of the house winning and you walking away with empty pockets and your spirit drained. Study the local market and codes for a year or two FIRST, before plunging in. The stakes are too high, unless you can really afford to lose it all. Key West houses in particular are usually outrageously expensive and really dilapidated, because they are often so old and have been through many floods and bug infestations. Great caution is needed, especially if you have never owned in Monroe County before. This is unlike owning anywhere else in the world.

[Madruga]

Dad says "you could not pay me enuff money to live in the Fleas (the Keys) again!". Lol

[totsuka]

Starfishkey - Thank you for a very informative post. I talked to a realtor today and he confirmed everything you mentioned. Too bad, but that's life. I see Key West as being a rich man's city now and will encourage my friend to forgo his plans on buying that home. It would have been an interesting challenge but perhaps Panama City would be a better location.

Once again, thank you!

[jghorton]

Apparently the OP is not coming back, but, for the many others who want to move to Florida to simply "be near the beach", let me say this:

Having lived in Florida for over 40-years, I would advise new residents to stay away from the tourist traps, such as Key West, whether beach towns or not. The trick to successful living in Florida is the same as everywhere else. Figure out what one REALLY wants (and will be happy with over the years) in a place to live.

There are a lot of options in Florida, including about 40 Beach towns. The ocean is great, but, simply living near or on the ocean will quickly become less of a reason for living somewhere, than it was when one was still living in Michigan or Indiana.

What do you really want? One cannot determine whether Key West, or anywhere else, will provide that ... until you first define what it is, beyond palm trees and sand!