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I hope "everyone" does not know that as it is not true
INternet resources are very helpful with this kind of stuff. For example wikipedia explains all virgin olive oils are first press. The olives are ground up and no further oil can be extracted through pressing. After first pressing, oil can only be extracted thorugh chemical processes and it is then not virgin oil of any kind.
"The term "first press", sometimes found on bottle labels, is technically meaningless, as there is no "second" press."
The extra virgin oils have lower acid. It has nothing to do with first or second press.
These guys say the same things as the Wiki article. Which in turn says the same thing as many other articles (I chose Wiki becasue it is the easiest to understand, plus it is a very reliable source of information due to the constant review and correction process and it is not funded by any particular marketing interest). I see nothing in here about second press. It says the same thing the so called second press is chemical extraction and produces Pomace oil.
Nope. Noting in this one supports your position either. Did you read the articles before you posted the link? This one does say in Europe, they are considering regulations so that if a bottle says first cold press, it must be so. There is no mention of second pressing. The word "second" does not even appear in the article. Al they are saying is that if a bottle says "first cold press" it cannot be made by a heated extraction process nor through chemical extraction.
The "first press" on the lable is a marketing scam. It is all first press. Have you ever seen a bottle of oliv oil that says "Second press" or "heated chemical extration" I hope not because then it should also say "not fit for human consumption" according to your articles.
Sorry, you got taken by marketing hype. You are not the first to be so however. It happens a lot to people with wine, cheese and other elite products. The producers like to invent terms to make their products sound better than others and then spread rumours which are in turn picked up by people who want ot sound sophisticated and the marketing ploy takes on a life of its own. It is a marvelous tactic and a great study in human psychology.
Last edited by Coldjensens; 05-10-2012 at 03:26 PM..
Okay, first, there is a second press even nowadays. I am Italian and I know that every well.
Extra Virgin and Virgin Oil: both cold pressed, both first press.
Regular Olive Oil (like the stuff you get at Olive garden...) that is second press and refined. It does contain partially pure virgin oil but a) it is mixed to other oils and b) chemicals are added.
basically if it is cold pressed, of first press and does not contain any chemicals or refining product it is Virgin or Extra Virgin.
To determine if it is Virgin or Extra Virgin, is just the acidity:
official (per Italian Industry as regulated by the Agricultural Ministry): below 0.8% or lower = EVOO
up to 2% + VOO
However for those "Frantoi" where the production is in small scale, done in a very artisan manner, EVOO has to have acidity of 0/5% or lower. Those EVOO oils however are made in smaller quantities and not many are available for export so you won't see many of them in the USA.
If you buy EVOO, imported from Italy, to be 100% sure it meets all the necessary standards, check if it has the acronym "D.O.P." on the label (hint: for wines look for "DOC or DOCG" sometimes written in full as "
Denominazione di origine Controllata (DOC
Denominazione di Origine Controllata e garantita (DOCG). Unfortunately, only a few countries have such strict standards for wine and oil.
Oh, finally to answer to the last poster who said" The "first press" on the lable is a marketing scam. It is all first press. Have you ever seen a bottle of oliv oil that says "Second press" or "heated chemical extration" I hope not because then it should also say "not fit for human consumption" according to your articles.
"
It is not all first press. But you are right: if it is second press, it won't spell it out on the lable "this is second press oil". Like for everything else, they mentione something only if it's a positive. If it's second press, it just won't say "first press" on the lable.
But you can't say "it's all first press".
Same for wines. In Italy a wine "DOC" or "DOCG" offers some gaurantees of met criterias. However if it's not DOC or DOCG, the lable won't say "this is not DOC". It will just not make a false claim and most of times it will say "Indicazione geografica tipica" or form lower quality " Vino da tavola".
These guys say the same things as the Wiki article. Which in turn says the same thing as many other articles (I chose Wiki becasue it is the easiest to understand, plus it is a very reliable source of information due to the constant review and correction process and it is not funded by any particular marketing interest). I see nothing in here about second press. It says the same thing the so called second press is chemical extraction and produces Pomace oil.
Nope. Noting in this one supports your position either. Did you read the articles before you posted the link? This one does say in Europe, they are considering regulations so that if a bottle says first cold press, it must be so. There is no mention of second pressing. The word "second" does not even appear in the article. Al they are saying is that if a bottle says "first cold press" it cannot be made by a heated extraction process nor through chemical extraction.
The "first press" on the lable is a marketing scam. It is all first press. Have you ever seen a bottle of oliv oil that says "Second press" or "heated chemical extration" I hope not because then it should also say "not fit for human consumption" according to your articles.
Sorry, you got taken by marketing hype. You are not the first to be so however. It happens a lot to people with wine, cheese and other elite products. The producers like to invent terms to make their products sound better than others and then spread rumours which are in turn picked up by people who want ot sound sophisticated and the marketing ploy takes on a life of its own. It is a marvelous tactic and a great study in human psychology.
Actually, I buy my olive oil from a guy up the road with an olive tree farm, we planted our own trees and expect a harvest next year.
Not sure what your point is in the last paragraph, but I do believe it says more about you than it does about me.
What are you talking about? The regulations in Italy for olive oil are rigid and they are monitored like they do for wine.
You have no clue, don't you?
The expensive oils are not the only true EVOO. They might just be made by artisan companies so the cost are higher. Some taste better because they don't have an industrial approach.
California testing? California unlike France, Italy and Spain doesn't even have a serious regulation about wine...
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain
If anyone is thinking they are using olive oil for health reasons, please tell me which brand you are using that you are SURE is real olive oil, as the majority sold in this country is either mixed or contains no olive oil at all.
Any oil that says it comes from various countries or is a blend is probably phoney.
Because some areas not only have regulations (like the US) and actually inspect and penalize cheaters (UNLIKE the US), there is a higher probability that their oils are heart healthy and pure olive oil. Oils from California, Australia, Crete, Greece are more to be trusted. The true olive oils are expensive, about twenty dollars for maybe seventeen ounces.
Some oils sold as olive oils are actually bad for your heart.
This is well known in the industry, but a secret from most of the public, who think they are doing good by using a lot of olive oil in their diets. They could actually be harming themselves.
so who are we to believe? does higher price guarantee the real stuff---does lower price mean it is fake--is there anything on the label which will tell us which is best? all very confusing.
I use mostly evoo in frying and recipes except baking cause the thought of olive taste in baked good seems wrong. am i wrong?
What are you talking about? The regulations in Italy for olive oil are rigid and they are monitored like they do for wine.
You have no clue, don't you?
The expensive oils are not the only true EVOO. They might just be made by artisan companies so the cost are higher. Some taste better because they don't have an industrial approach.
California testing? California unlike France, Italy and Spain doesn't even have a serious regulation about wine...
Please don't get insulting, as I certainly DO have more than a clue.
There has been information published in the papers regarding the olive oil scam. It is no secret. If you watch your newspapers you will see such an article.
A Journal of Food Sciences study found olive oil as the food most subject to fraud.
The most common fraud involves diluting extra virgin oil with a lesser grade — such as lampante, or lamp-oil, judged unfit for human consumption because of its high acid content.
Goldengrain, you take a piece of news that has truth in it but transform it in something different. It's the little errors and omissions that might totally change the meaning of what one says.
the Italian olive oil industry reveals it to be the most corrupt business in the food world That is the opinion of one person, who is in constant back and forth writing some La Gazzetta Economica of Italy and has already been recognized as a support of California oil (he is American after all) and a trasher o0f Italian oil). Mueller by the way doesn['t specify how it comes up with the fact that Italian olive oil industry is the most corrupted in the wrold other than mentionibng a conversation he overheard in a bar between some individuals he thought were "mafiosi".
The best part is that Muller first tells in a letter to the Director of la Gazzetta Economica that "even in California 99% of producrers are tired of this situation (of lack of control in Italy and Spain); however in anotger note he himself admits that "there is no control in the USA either because the FDA doesn't care..."
Oils from California, Australia, Crete, Greece are more to be trusted And you know that how?? Greece is a big producer of oil, like Italy and Spain. Understand one thing: when you buy Greek (or Italian or Spanish) oil in the USA, you are very lijely to buy oil from a different country than the one you think. Big producing countries tend to sell the their oil at home or to countries with a "passion" for oil. Unfortunately to export to countries where they think people don't know or care much about a product, they import oilve oil from minor producer countries, re-label it and resell it.
Take Bertolli, to use an example you made yourself. They import 80% of the oil they sell particularly for export purposes, so odds are in the USA when you buy Bertolli you might buy oil from North Africa (which is where Bertolli gets most of the oil). Bertolli probably random test what they get, which mean if in Africa someone adds other oils they might not get caught. Now, that happens in everything, it is unfortunate, but that's how the markets are (think about the USA being a serious exporter of raw oil/petroleum and at the same time a major importer: why not just use what we have at home? because companies makes more money exporting that selling it here).
However, the issue with oilve oil from big producer is worldwide, not like you made it seem, an Italian problem. Sure, they don't catch everything, but it's every misleading to say controls are made in California (??) instead of Italy, where Italy has extensive controlsd made by a branch of the Agricultural Ministry to determine the quality/claims of oil. Should they do a better job? Yes. Can they check all the oil? No.
So, you need to be precise when making claims, because someone who has no clue and reads your post would think Italians are all crooks tempering with their olive oil.
In a recent test of oils sold as Italian ev olive oil, only one in 31 contained the promised product.
Are you talking about the German guy who said he bought - in 2004! - 31 different bottles of Italian oil in a German supermarket, sent them to Florence to examine and determined that one of 31 was real EVOO?
If that's the case, the way you present the case is again misleading. First, recent is relative...2004?? Then in the article from which you picked those lines, there is no info on who were those brands (that would have been gret info to have...) or anything else. Just a mention to support the rest of the article.
The bottom line is that:
- yes, if you buy very cheap EVOO you are risking that it might not be top quality or pure EVOO. Like in anything else, if it's too cheap, there's a reason.
- the main risk is probably with those oils - from anywhere - sold in big containers in places like Costco etc.. Those (Carapelli etc..) are produced industrially and again, those companies have the hateful tendency to "import to re-export".
Most of olive oils you can find in regular store, not Costco, Sam's, in 1 liter or smaller size bottle, should be okay, or at least there is no reason to believe they are fake (or you could fell like that about anything).
For the other poster who asked, I would stay away from those 5 gallons containers of Carapelli, Bertolli and maybe Berio and buy instead small bottles especially if you see the name FRANTOIO or FRANTOI, which means it's not produced in large industrial scale, and if you see a note in Italian saying "prodotto ed imbottigliato"...followed by the name of a place in Italy.
Olive oil doesn't have to be extremely expensive but if it's too cheap something is wrong (same with wine).
Finally, my tip for is not to use EVOO to fry. It's a waste of money, it loses all the flavor anyway, and it has a low smoking point, so it's not a great idea. EVOO is meant to be used raw on top of food, or you can use it to pan fry or saute something (for those application a Berio EVOO is fine, I would use the more expensive small bottle from Tuscany or Puglia only raw).
All right, I said my piece, I am done with this.Peace.
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