What is the best true "melting pot" city in America? (live in, restaurants)

[cBach]

Houston wins this by a mile. People may hate on Houston but they know what it's about. It's a diverse ethnic melting pot where the no zoning actually makes an environment where there is dispersing of the various ethnic groups, whereas in NYC or Chicago the ethnic groups are concentrated in various areas. In Houston, it's not uncommon to have a Buddhist temple next to an Indian grocery store next to a XXX sex shop next to an Evangelical church all in the same strip mall. Talk about bringing together different groups. That wouldn't be possible in any other city except Houston.

So people may hate on Houston, but it probably is the most American of cities.

[YIMBY]

Odd choice of cities.

[Gunion Powder]

Originally Posted by Spade

I can see if you look at that way. I would still put Miami and NYC over Houston with Latino's because they have more nationalities represented than Houston. Especially NYC. Houston is overwhelmingly Mexican. Miami is majority Cuban but it's not overwhelming and NYC has the most diverse with ease. However, the share of Mexicans within the Latino population is dropping because it has a fast growing Central American population from El Salvador and Honduras as well as a fast growing Colombian and Venezuelan population. Still Miami easily has a more diverse Latino population.

That's the realistic way to look at it. Only on paper is the Miami Latin community "far" more diverse than Houston's.

[NigerianNightmare]

I voted Houston on this list. MY view personally is while NYC in the city is more diverse the outer suburbs are extremely white. Queens in itself is the only place were the diversity reaches ridiculous amounts IMO in terms of people who live there. Houston for example because of no zoning creates an environment were a poor neighborhood bleeds into a wealthier neighborhood bleeds into a trailer park bleeds into Mcmansion ville and bleeds into the hood. With Houston having ghetto regions and wealthy areas in all parts of the city. Just the SW side has Westbury- middle class, Bellaire- upper middle class, West U- filthy rich. Greater Fondren- poor/hood, Sugar Land- asian ethnoburb, Missouri City- black ethnoburb etc. Although that region is ridiculously diverse and isn't the norm. The point is outside of Montgomery County and some of the larger hoods I don't think you can group an area of 100,000 people in Houston and find the area to be more than 90% one race. Houston is triracial even in some of it's outer suburbs, making it extremely unique.


Best Example are these towns about 5-20 miles out from suburbia/Houston.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brookshire,_Texas 20% White, 40% Black, 40% Latino (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conroe,_Texas 50% White 40% Latino and 10% Black (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeport,_Texas 35% White, 50% Latino and 15% Black (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty,_Texas 70% White, 15% Black and 15% Hispanic (rounded numbers)

In all cardinal directions, you can hardly a group of neighborhoods that are more than 80% of one race let alone 90%.

[l1995]

Originally Posted by NigerianNightmare

I voted Houston on this list. MY view personally is while NYC in the city is more diverse the outer suburbs are extremely white. Queens in itself is the only place were the diversity reaches ridiculous amounts IMO in terms of people who live there. Houston for example because of no zoning creates an environment were a poor neighborhood bleeds into a wealthier neighborhood bleeds into a trailer park bleeds into Mcmansion ville and bleeds into the hood. With Houston having ghetto regions and wealthy areas in all parts of the city. Just the SW side has Westbury- middle class, Bellaire- upper middle class, West U- filthy rich. Greater Fondren- poor/hood, Sugar Land- asian ethnoburb, Missouri City- black ethnoburb etc. Although that region is ridiculously diverse and isn't the norm. The point is outside of Montgomery County and some of the larger hoods I don't think you can group an area of 100,000 people in Houston and find the area to be more than 90% one race. Houston is triracial even in some of it's outer suburbs, making it extremely unique.


Best Example are these towns about 5-20 miles out from suburbia/Houston.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brookshire,_Texas 20% White, 40% Black, 40% Latino (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conroe,_Texas 50% White 40% Latino and 10% Black (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeport,_Texas 35% White, 50% Latino and 15% Black (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty,_Texas 70% White, 15% Black and 15% Hispanic (rounded numbers)

In all cardinal directions, you can hardly a group of neighborhoods that are more than 80% of one race let alone 90%.

But I think city proper is what we want to compare here, nobody is talking about Suffolk County when they say NYC.

Also, Brooklyn is extremely diverse too.

[NigerianNightmare]

I know but Brooklyn is a lot like Houston. It is diverse in large certain regions (SW Brooklyn/SW Houston), while the poorer/other neighborhoods are almost all one or two races (they may be ethnically diverse). While Queens would be more like SW Houston itself ridiculously diverse and mixed through out.

[annie_himself]

Originally Posted by NigerianNightmare

I voted Houston on this list. MY view personally is while NYC in the city is more diverse the outer suburbs are extremely white. Queens in itself is the only place were the diversity reaches ridiculous amounts IMO in terms of people who live there. Houston for example because of no zoning creates an environment were a poor neighborhood bleeds into a wealthier neighborhood bleeds into a trailer park bleeds into Mcmansion ville and bleeds into the hood. With Houston having ghetto regions and wealthy areas in all parts of the city. Just the SW side has Westbury- middle class, Bellaire- upper middle class, West U- filthy rich. Greater Fondren- poor/hood, Sugar Land- asian ethnoburb, Missouri City- black ethnoburb etc. Although that region is ridiculously diverse and isn't the norm. The point is outside of Montgomery County and some of the larger hoods I don't think you can group an area of 100,000 people in Houston and find the area to be more than 90% one race. Houston is triracial even in some of it's outer suburbs, making it extremely unique.


Best Example are these towns about 5-20 miles out from suburbia/Houston.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brookshire,_Texas 20% White, 40% Black, 40% Latino (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conroe,_Texas 50% White 40% Latino and 10% Black (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeport,_Texas 35% White, 50% Latino and 15% Black (rounded numbers)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty,_Texas 70% White, 15% Black and 15% Hispanic (rounded numbers)

In all cardinal directions, you can hardly a group of neighborhoods that are more than 80% of one race let alone 90%.

As far as I know West U and Bellaire aren't part of conventional SW Houston hoods. I've never heard someone from Sugarland say they live in the SW either.

[DavePa]

Originally Posted by cBach

Houston wins this by a mile. People may hate on Houston but they know what it's about. It's a diverse ethnic melting pot where the no zoning actually makes an environment where there is dispersing of the various ethnic groups, whereas in NYC or Chicago the ethnic groups are concentrated in various areas. In Houston, it's not uncommon to have a Buddhist temple next to an Indian grocery store next to a XXX sex shop next to an Evangelical church all in the same strip mall. Talk about bringing together different groups. That wouldn't be possible in any other city except Houston.

So people may hate on Houston, but it probably is the most American of cities.

Do they even have XXX sex shops any more in non-more rural of roadway/highway areas not near homes? Really the idea is discreet and not anyone can see you? LOL Living in Central PA I only saw them on a highway that has a lot of truckers and residential areas are in patches or in the hills out of sight.

But I can't imagine a neighborhood of goo reputation is going to have such a strip mall. Sounds more like a area some might see as less then desirable. Or up north more of the ghetto area of a city that the residents just want to not stir any notice of trouble. So they ignore it all.

Few non-ghetto area Evangelical INDEPENDENT storefront Churches would find any desirability in being next to a XXX shop. LOL. Unless they had far less choices and getting the word to someone whose life was that other shop? Might think there might be another way in them.

I always get a kick out of such post on greatness of no zoning. The last thing one thinks of zoning as is what is on a strip mall. Now putting it in a non-main street or not near a intersection certainly is no boast of better. Heck, my old depressed today small city/town. Had the city fight a what was basically a junk-yard of cars at a once gas station and garage. Of HIS RIGHT no matter what it looked like for residents. Their homes don't even look great anymore. But it certainly did not help the neighborhood or home values that were already vastly depressed. These old towns were built with no zoning anyway. But some things are common sense and my right and the hell with you.

Oh he won some battles in court. But eventually did build a wall around the vehicles.

But in the term - zoning we think mostly we think of - How a block is laid out and developed. So since I can't see all of Houston on visits and never lived there. Goggle STREETVIEW is a quick way to bring up examples of -- THE NEW INFILL DENSIFYING HOUSTON.

Let's call it - Invent your own street and alley in Houston and heck with a street-grid that adopted Chicago's system once to make sense and easier to find addresses? Now just build any kind of development wherever. So we add a 1/2 street of addresses and short alleys in some blocks that end abruptly?

I've seen some very nice new housing and developments (how well-built it is I'm not sure?)

But then I ask ... OK Houston. What cityscape are you trying to be game? I say, OK this -

- looks like it was taken from Chicago's layout and grid with alleys. 1910 era maybe?
- this looks like back East a older neighborhood somewhere?
- or I just not sure what city this was taken from?

Just some examples here I present for GREATNESS of NO-ZONING and add a street and alley monopoly.

1st - I call this view... quintessential Chicago in Houston. Brand spanking new (just forget the ditch).
https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8003...7i13312!8i6656

Any Chicagoan would TOTALLY AGREE - That sure is Chicago? Why does goggle say Houston?

The front of the LONE BLOCK is laid out as Chicago's pretty standard homes set-backs with green-space, then sidewalk, then green-space w/trees, curb and street.
https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8008...7i13312!8i6656

Just to prove the above is new - ^^above is 2015.
Now 2011. Just the trees are original.
https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8008...7i13312!8i6656

Don't expect that curbing like.. EVER across the street. DA DITCH WILL RULE. The Great city of Houston certainly won't do it. If your developer don't? As a New Yorker would say ---> Fa'geta'bout'it. It works for us. You gotta ditch �� and need no more from the city. NO STREET/SANITATION DEPT. HERE.

The next block is pretty normal. A occasional curb a short way one side and nada da other. BUILD YOUR OWN if you want it.
https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7998...7i13312!8i6656

ok a 1900/1910 era Chicago wood-frame block.
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9588...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9444...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9217...7i13312!8i6656

Old workers-cottage homes on left and brick bungalows on right. Same street-grid

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9217...7i13312!8i6656

^^ Can you imagine that neighborhood had a city in 1900 and 1920s. Tell the builders.
- they MUST have STANDARD Set-backs for the homes from the streets
- put in a sidewalk and the city would actually BUILD a curb and street
- you won't dare try to put something other then residences in the blocks
- our standard sized lots will prevail and don't alter the pattern
- make way for a alley. Cause its getting one.

Maybe they knew by the 21st century? Newer Sunbelt cites would TRY TO FIX past mistakes in building their city and developers try to imitate something similar? BUT THEY HAD ZONING THEN, GOD FORBID.

OK let's go 1800s wealthier neighborhood. Including today. I wonder why?? OMG SAME STREET-GRID.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9229...7i13312!8i6656

Now across CHICAGO for mid to late 1950s "MID-CENTURY MODERN HOMES" neighborhood. Waaaay across on the Southside of the city. Last growth of DA CITY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7880...7i13312!8i6656

Yep SAME STREET-GRID A Bit more frontage maybe? But then homes were not as long. Same alleys in back and NO POWER-LINES in front. THEY are in the alleys.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7880...7i13312!8i6656

Lets find the ALLEYWAY. There it is. The Chicago standard alley with CITY FURNISHED TRASH BINS. OH and the POWER-LINES AND POLES STRUNG THERE. Of course they pay. In taxes. But STANDAIZED IS LIKE ZONING? ALMOST UN-AMERICAN. But I think these neighborhoods WILL BE AS DESIREABLE AND HOMES BUILT TO LAST. FOR YEARS TO COME.

Will HOUSTON'S new infill do the same LAST being built?

OK back to Houston new Infill. More that pass for Chicago. Minus the ditch. Made to look MUCH OLDER.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7992...7i13312!8i6656

Talking about a development made to look OLD? they forgot the yards?

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7986...7i13312!8i6656

Another. Bit mismatched? Would NEVER think its new? 2015 streetview

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7996...7i13312!8i6656

Certainly no uniformity street front? But in 2007 it was this.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7996...!7i3328!8i1664

Certainly, trying to look like SOME OLD IN THE NORTH NEXT?

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7986...7i13312!8i6656

OK Isn't this quaint. NOT THE DITCHES and power-line poles. But LOOKS OLD NO? I don't think it was built before 2000?

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8056...7i13312!8i6656

Now THESE ARE ODD? No it isn't some STRETCHING ILLUSION OF HOMES LOL.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8081...7i13312!8i6656

Going around the corner is a WHOLE other perspective. Like a gated community? Oh look too. The developer put in curbing.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8078...7i13312!8i6656

I think New Orleans when I see these homes? 2015 street-view.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8058...7i13312!8i6656

2011 street-view of above.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.8058...7i13312!8i6656


** All kinds and more in one area and neighborhood alone. But WHAT ARE YOU ----> REALLY TRYING TO BE HOUSTON? When all is completed. Will ALL THESE ASPECTS OF HOMES, added partial streets and short alleys ALL MESH WELL?

* Guess its HOUSTON AND TEXAS. "DON'T MESS WITH IT" HOUSTON KNOWS WHAT IT IS ND WANT. ��

�� SO HOUSTON? WHAT REALLY OR WHAT CITIES ARE YOU TRYING TO BE? Only a small variety of styles getting built I showed. Some are quite nice. Some quite odd?

Really. I know Houston better now..... DON'T GET ME STARTED ON DOWNTOWN and my PET PEEVE of HUUUUGE Parking garages with nothing street-level. UGGGGGLY.

It's the Sunbelt. WE LUV AND NEED OUR BIG GARAGE DECKS. ---> get over it.
Looong post I know. (But I WONDER WHAT HOUSTON WILL LOOK LIKE IN 20 YEARS)??

[cBach]

RE post above:

I'm not sure what you're trying to prove. Your Chicago homes look nothing like the Houston homes to me. I can tell in an instant which city it is.

The infill with townhomes to me is more of a California type style and not trying to "be like Chicago".

I do agree that portions of Houston attempt to look like New Orleans. The Woodlands looks like something in the Garden District in parts:

https://www.google.com/maps/@30.1628...8i6656!6m1!1e1

The fact is that Houston doesn't really try to be anything and doesn't care what others think of it. It's always been that way and always will be and I think that really irks yankees' behinds...

[NigerianNightmare]

Originally Posted by annie_himself

As far as I know West U and Bellaire aren't part of conventional SW Houston hoods. I've never heard someone from Sugarland say they live in the SW either.

It depends if your in the loop, you might here someone refer to their region as SW Houston (But when they say Houston they only mean inside the loop or immediately outside of it). When that indian dude shot 7-9 people in West U, all the news sources said SW Houston. I hear people say FBC is SW of Houston or they are from the SW burbs of Houston but mostly they will say their suburb. Point is while SW mostly refers to the middle class neighborhoods and Greater Fondren area, even Chinatown and Sharpstown. All of those places are SW of Houston.