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I lived in Seattle for a year in 08-09; I was born there, my mom's family is mostly there, and I lived there as a kid and in my early teens. My extended family and a few friends encouraged me to give it a try, so I left the Bay Area for it.
Awful, awful decision. Hated it. I ended up more depressed than I've been at any point in my adult life, went back to CA at the first opportunity, never looked back, and won't. I don't consider Seattle my hometown anymore, just a place I was born.
Incidentally, my Seattle native mom and Southern dad who lived there for nearly 20 years both have similar sentiments, but didn't want to spoil my opinion of life there when I gave it a go. I guess I'm glad I did because it taught me some lessons in life and essentially crossed the PNW off the list of places I would consider in the future, but that said, it would have been better for me to just ride it out in CA.
The Massachusetts and Seattle stuff has me thinking you have SADS. You say you work evenings. What is the lighting at work? Have you adjusted your lighting at home and arranged you life to be at south-facing windows? I’d bet your wardrobe after living in warm climates isn’t appropriate. I’d bet you have no winter-oriented outdoor leisure activities. I ski. I welcome the winter. By May 1, I have a deep suntan from spring skiing and a big smile.
I lived in Seattle for a year in 08-09; I was born there, my mom's family is mostly there, and I lived there as a kid and in my early teens. My extended family and a few friends encouraged me to give it a try, so I left the Bay Area for it.
Awful, awful decision. Hated it. I ended up more depressed than I've been at any point in my adult life, went back to CA at the first opportunity, never looked back, and won't. I don't consider Seattle my hometown anymore, just a place I was born.
Incidentally, my Seattle native mom and Southern dad who lived there for nearly 20 years both have similar sentiments, but didn't want to spoil my opinion of life there when I gave it a go. I guess I'm glad I did because it taught me some lessons in life and essentially crossed the PNW off the list of places I would consider in the future, but that said, it would have been better for me to just ride it out in CA.
The weather, culture, and people's behaviors of the PNW are just brutal.
The weather is miserable and gloomy west of the cascades most of the year which leads to depression and bad attitudes among people, and east of the cascades it's cold and snowy which is also depressing.
The culture is extremely homogeneous with no room for individuality, it's a giant white liberal bubble.
The people are standoffish, almost rude, they don't make eye contact or even smile (seattle freeze) and making friends is very difficult. Forget about humor or pop culture references because PNW people will make some preachy smug statement like "I don't watch TV" or "did you know the origins of that joke are racist? let me explain the history of why that's so problematic" ugh it's a damn joke! like why so serious? lol
I never understood why people often lump the West coast together as if it's all the same, it's so wrong, the PNW and California are completely different from each other in culture, lifestyles, people, behaviors etc. totally different worlds. It's like saying Vermont and Florida are the same.
The weather, culture, and people's behaviors of the PNW are just brutal.
The weather is miserable and gloomy west of the cascades most of the year which leads to depression and bad attitudes among people, and east of the cascades it's cold and snowy which is also depressing.
The culture is extremely homogeneous with no room for individuality, it's a giant white liberal bubble.
The people are standoffish, almost rude, they don't make eye contact or even smile (seattle freeze) and making friends is very difficult. Forget about humor or pop culture references because PNW people will make some preachy smug statement like "I don't watch TV" or "did you know the origins of that joke are racist? let me explain the history of why that's so problematic" ugh it's a damn joke! like why so serious? lol
I never understood why people often lump the West coast together as if it's all the same, it's so wrong, the PNW and California are completely different from each other in culture, lifestyles, people, behaviors etc. totally different worlds. It's like saying Vermont and Florida are the same.
King County Washington is 20% Asian. You make it sound like an unfriendly white bread Iowa. With the abrupt shift to a tech economy, it’s now full of white collar professionals who largely don’t watch much television so Survivor and The Voice aren’t going to be a conversation starter.
The weather, culture, and people's behaviors of the PNW are just brutal.
The weather is miserable and gloomy west of the cascades most of the year which leads to depression and bad attitudes among people, and east of the cascades it's cold and snowy which is also depressing.
The culture is extremely homogeneous with no room for individuality, it's a giant white liberal bubble.
The people are standoffish, almost rude, they don't make eye contact or even smile (seattle freeze) and making friends is very difficult. Forget about humor or pop culture references because PNW people will make some preachy smug statement like "I don't watch TV" or "did you know the origins of that joke are racist? let me explain the history of why that's so problematic" ugh it's a damn joke! like why so serious? lol
I never understood why people often lump the West coast together as if it's all the same, it's so wrong, the PNW and California are completely different from each other in culture, lifestyles, people, behaviors etc. totally different worlds. It's like saying Vermont and Florida are the same.
What you describe is more a Seattle thing than a PNW thing.
People are very friendly in Portland. It's never been as wealthy or affluent as Seattle, so it's a bit more humble and down to earth. People that have lived in both generally say that community is much easier to find in Portland than Seattle.
King County Washington is 20% Asian. You make it sound like an unfriendly white bread Iowa. With the abrupt shift to a tech economy, it’s now full of white collar professionals who largely don’t watch much television so Survivor and The Voice aren’t going to be a conversation starter.
It's culturally White, despite having some ethnic diversity. All the Asians and other non-Whites in the PNW are basically whitewashed and absorbed into the local PNW White culture, this is what I saw while living there. That's what I meant by saying it's a giant white liberal bubble with no individuality. An example would be talking to Asians in Seattle about 88rising or Boba shops, they'd look at you with a clueless face, whereas Asians in California would get it.
What you describe is more a Seattle thing than a PNW thing.
People are very friendly in Portland. It's never been as wealthy or affluent as Seattle, so it's a bit more humble and down to earth. People that have lived in both generally say that community is much easier to find in Portland than Seattle.
I spent 3 months in Portland but to me it felt very much the same as Seattle, people and culture wise. I did really like Seaside, Oregon though. The Oregon coast is beautiful and the people there I found to be more down to earth.
The Massachusetts and Seattle stuff has me thinking you have SADS. You say you work evenings. What is the lighting at work? Have you adjusted your lighting at home and arranged you life to be at south-facing windows? I’d bet your wardrobe after living in warm climates isn’t appropriate. I’d bet you have no winter-oriented outdoor leisure activities. I ski. I welcome the winter. By May 1, I have a deep suntan from spring skiing and a big smile.
I haven't been formally evaluated or tested for SAD but assume I have it, however, I am an odd bird.
I am mostly a night owl, but left to my own vices, my daily sleep cycle is like this:
- sleep around sunrise
- wake up around 11-12
- do things until 4-6pm
- sleep an hour or two
- stay awake until next sunrise
This is the most natural and comfortable way for me to be. Most of my energy comes at night, and that's when I'm most active. I like sitting in dim light, and am actually totally fine in outright darkness. However, I do need to have some time up during the day, when it's bright; the brightness, I can go maybe a few weeks without, so long as it's not too cold... Gloomier stretches in the Bay Area, LA, and Guangzhou/Shenzhen/Hong Kong in China, I never found myself depressed, angry, listless, or otherwise down, and that is probably because those areas never got as cold as New England or Seattle did.
I don't think I can emphasize how much I hate the physical sensation of being cold, and just deleted a pointlessly long diatribe on it to instead type this out. I do not like anything about feeling cold, even for more than a few minutes. I've tried different winter outdoor activities, but they don't work, because I end up feeling so unpleasant, flustered, and discombobulated, nothing really positive comes of it. I tried skiing; don't remember much about it other than it being really cold. I love to draw, sew, and otherwise craft things, but the cold wreaks havoc on my digits, and I have a huge aversion to anything that hurts my hands or fingers because of past injuries that made it harder for me to do things I love. That is definitely a major part of it.
Wardrobe is a non-issue - I moved back to the US with two changes of clothes and re-bought everything here, including thermals, coats, parkas, gloves, and scarves. I started wearing that stuff late fall because I was already ill at ease over it. I don't like wearing that much clothing, and still know it's cold. Shoveling snow makes me angry - wasted time and effort in an environment I don't enjoy. Having to be careful how I walk to avoid slipping and hurting myself is frustrating because it's such a stupidly wasteful way to go about things.
The most direct truth is that I just really, sincerely don't like the cold, and it's not for lack of exposure to it since I'm an ethnic Scandinavian who grew up in the PNW and New England. It's just the wrong environment for me. I've tried all the tricks to get used to it, and none have worked. Seattle was a bust because of all this, and because I didn't like the social culture there; I like the people in MA, I just feel out of sorts with the environment. This stint in MA was my last attempt; trying again is just wasting time. We will be moving to the Southwest this winter, and I doubt I'll attempt to live in any cold/northern climate ever again.
It's culturally White, despite having some ethnic diversity. All the Asians and other non-Whites in the PNW are basically whitewashed and absorbed into the local PNW White culture, this is what I saw while living there. That's what I meant by saying it's a giant white liberal bubble with no individuality. An example would be talking to Asians in Seattle about 88rising or Boba shops, they'd look at you with a clueless face, whereas Asians in California would get it.
I remember some time ago on the Seattle forum here, someone opined that the reason that the "Seattle Freeze" seemed to exist was because of its Scandinavian and Asian roots. As a Scandinavian who lived in Asia, was closely attached to Asian communities growing up, and is married to an Asian, I can tell you that it's not true. It's just Seattle; it's what Seattle became when people move there with an idea of what it was, an aesthetic and an ideal and really not of a caricature, and gradually manifested that place into reality.
I have to bite my tongue when it comes to my critiques of the social climate in Seattle, because I dont want to get sucked into the negativity around my experience there. My opinions have softened overall with time. Going back to visit and see family and friends, and then go back to sunny Socal a few days later, certainly was more pleasant than staying there all year round. But, I'm still well aware of how incompatible I am with it, and invoking the bad times I had there just gets me remembering things I don't like, and opens the door to more disagreements.
I'm glad Seattle works for many people and that they've found a place where they feel they fit in, are accepted, are in their element. Everyone should be able to live in a place where they're happy. I feel some sadness that, to me, my hometown no longer exists - it's a place in time, as much or moreso than a place physically, and we can't go back to that à time. This could be the case with anywhere, but Seattle changed in ways that rendered it unrecognizable past a superficial level, and that, to me, made it a disorienting, disappointing, depressing place. They can have it; it's theirs now. And that's fine. I've got other places now that make me happy, that feel like home.
I'm glad Seattle works for many people and that they've found a place where they feel they fit in, are accepted, are in their element. Everyone should be able to live in a place where they're happy. I feel some sadness that, to me, my hometown no longer exists - it's a place in time, as much or moreso than a place physically, and we can't go back to that à time. This could be the case with anywhere, but Seattle changed in ways that rendered it unrecognizable past a superficial level, and that, to me, made it a disorienting, disappointing, depressing place. They can have it; it's theirs now. And that's fine. I've got other places now that make me happy, that feel like home.
As a relatively newer resident, I've been interested in what the older, pre-tech Seattle was like, and looked through a number of history articles on different neighborhoods. There's definitely a more working-class, industrial, less overtly liberal vibe in places like Everett and Tacoma, and I've heard from locals that those places now feel a lot like '90s Seattle. My current neighborhood (Lake City) is the same way, lots of low-skill immigrants, old-school auto body shops, and stuff like strip clubs that would never fly in a more progressive part of the city.
It's culturally White, despite having some ethnic diversity. All the Asians and other non-Whites in the PNW are basically whitewashed and absorbed into the local PNW White culture, this is what I saw while living there. That's what I meant by saying it's a giant white liberal bubble with no individuality. An example would be talking to Asians in Seattle about 88rising or Boba shops, they'd look at you with a clueless face, whereas Asians in California would get it.
It’s culturally college educated white collar. That socioeconomic class doesn’t listen to Hip Hop as their principal music genre. To me, it sounds like you have socioeconomic class envy. And you can get beverages with a big straw and tapioca balls in any Lilly white affluent people cafe along with the fancy espresso coffee drinks. I’m in the most non-Asian place on the planet and anywhere upscale has bubble tea these days.
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