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It hasn't been that long. I have only been retired and out of the cities for the last eight years. I traveled and visited a lot of cities from the late 1970s to the late 1990s and witnessed the decline in Downtowns. Sometimes the best way to see change is when you go back to revisit a place after 20 years. When I did that I saw most of the vibrancy was gone from downtowns. Downtowns that were once filled with department stores and bright lights of movie theaters are just shells of their former selves. Restaurants and bars are about the only business that seem to have survived in downtowns and you can find these anywhere. You don't need to go downtown to find those.
Just search this forum for "Downtown" and the city of your choice. I bet the search results will be 99% negative. For example this thread.
I think college towns in most cases are doing well. I was down in College Station (Texas A&M) and San Marcos (Texas State U) and central areas are very vibrant, although SM is also the county seat so it has that added benefit and far enough from Austin (30 miles) to have its own identity. Its a great looking town.
I live near Denton (University of N. TX). Doing great.
New Braunfels, about 30 miles north of San Antonio, is about 85,000 people, is doing well when you know Whole Foods opened there.
Midtown Manhattan is livelier than ever. Streets are packed with people to the point that my walk from the office to the train is frought with pedestrian congestion.
It hasn't been that long. I have only been retired and out of the cities for the last eight years. I traveled and visited a lot of cities from the late 1970s to the late 1990s and witnessed the decline in Downtowns. Sometimes the best way to see change is when you go back to revisit a place after 20 years. When I did that I saw most of the vibrancy was gone from downtowns. Downtowns that were once filled with department stores and bright lights of movie theaters are just shells of their former selves. Restaurants and bars are about the only business that seem to have survived in downtowns and you can find these anywhere. You don't need to go downtown to find those.
Just search this forum for "Downtown" and the city of your choice. I bet the search results will be 99% negative. For example this thread.
Because this forum has a number of folks who insist their perception whether routed in experience from visiting once many years ago, or more likely what they have heard is somehow most accurate.
These are all vibrant, bustling and have shoulder-to-shoulder people walking consistently during rush hours, and a good clip of people out on the streets throughout the day:
Brooklyn
downtown
Williamsburg
Dumbo
Queens
Long Island City
Flushing
Manhattan
financial district
midtown east
hell's kitchen
west village
east village
soho
lower east side
chinatown
flatiron
nolita
kip's bay
penn station
chelsea
upper east side
Arguably, I think the quieter areas that are still down in foot traffic and have more vacant stores than a large part of Manhattan, are Tribeca and the Upper West Side. These are slower to recover but getting slowly better over time.
It hasn't been that long. I have only been retired and out of the cities for the last eight years. I traveled and visited a lot of cities from the late 1970s to the late 1990s and witnessed the decline in Downtowns. Sometimes the best way to see change is when you go back to revisit a place after 20 years. When I did that I saw most of the vibrancy was gone from downtowns. Downtowns that were once filled with department stores and bright lights of movie theaters are just shells of their former selves. Restaurants and bars are about the only business that seem to have survived in downtowns and you can find these anywhere. You don't need to go downtown to find those.
Just search this forum for "Downtown" and the city of your choice. I bet the search results will be 99% negative. For example this thread.
The majority of downtowns around the 60s and the auto boom started tearing down buildings in masse to put in surface parking lots
Example:
The areas marked in yellow are surface lots and parking garages. Every single last one of them used to be buildings, streetfront shops, restaurants, etc.
This map is just one example, as you can find maps of several other downtowns that were almost completely gutted and turned into asphalt craters that were once thriving, happening areas. Walkability, density, and vibrancy of the olden days is gone in many downtowns. The loss of historic structures sucks too.
Wish I was around in the 50s and 60s to experience what being in a downtown felt like vs today. I also agree that big box helped to kill off smaller businesses and random mom & pop thrift stores in downtown areas that once lined the streets.
Last edited by Calesacult; 10-04-2023 at 06:28 PM..
San Diego is exactly the opposite, there used to be all kinds of parking lots downtown (though, not that ^ ridiculous amount), enough so there used to be a concert series, Street Scene, that utilized these as band venues in the ‘90s. I would say 90% of those are gone. All mid-to high rises today with the remaining few larger parking lots very soon to be developed. It is a quite dense, vibrant, compact, safe and walkable downtown.
It’s not perfect, we are working through our homeless issues, but we are only big city in CA to have made it illegal to sleep on the streets and parks (per available shelter beds). My partner and I were down there today walking throughout and it was a fantastic day, massive new developments everywhere. We can walk dt from our streetcar suburb neighborhood, 1200 acre park behind our house. We wouldn’t live anywhere else.
San Diego is exactly the opposite, there used to be all kinds of parking lots downtown (though, not that ^ ridiculous amount), enough so there used to be a concert series, Street Scene, that utilized these as band venues in the ‘90s. I would say 90% of those are gone. All mid-to high rises today with the remaining few larger parking lots very soon to be developed. It is a quite dense, vibrant, compact, safe and walkable downtown.
It’s not perfect, we are working through our homeless issues, but we are only big city in CA to have made it illegal to sleep on the streets and parks (per available shelter beds). My partner and I were down there today walking throughout and it was a fantastic day, massive new developments everywhere. We can walk dt from our streetcar suburb neighborhood, 1200 acre park behind our house. We wouldn’t live anywhere else.
Whoops, that's Tulsa, OK, one of if not the hardest hit downtown grids in the country.
Some cities such as SD and Houston have been working on infill over the years and have gotten back on track or close to. I love when I hear about different downtowns restoring life to their urban cores and creating infill over their scars. That's what surface lots in a downtown area is. A scar. A burn mark. Underground parking is ideal, but even parking decks with ground floor retail help to bring vibrancy to once dead areas and restore density.
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