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So please stop derailing the topic with "fighting black on black crime." That's called changing the subject.
Bull. This is EXACTLY the subject. The only reason this guy is dead right now is because he was another young, black male caught up in crime.
Saying "let's ignore black on black crime" while on the other hand talking about police interactions with young black males is complete, utter nonsense.
It's the protesters (and apparently you) who don't seem to care about dead black males, unless a nonblack person was involved in their demise. This wouldn't even be a news article if the officer were black. There would be no thread on C-D. No Al Sharpton, no news cameras, no looting.
The reason there's this controversy is because it's a white cop, so it fits neatly into people's biases, and it's much easier excusing the state of young black males by blaming everything on racist cops rather than looking within and asking why so many young males get themselves in such predicaments.
If we magically eliminated racism to zero, it probably wouldn't mean a thing for young men like this. They aren't doing strongarm robberies against hardworking immigrants because of racist cops, they're doing it because they're personally messed up, and their family and community finds every excuse on the book (but the cops were racist, but this was a good kid, but he was just hanging out with his buddies, but, but...) rather than looking in the mirror.
Last edited by Oldhag1; 08-17-2014 at 06:36 AM..
Reason: Language
They are nothing but criminals... and some opportunists
ats
I hope that you differentiate between those who are peacefully exercising their right to express their views from those who used that opportunity to engage in burglaries and robberies under the guise of being frustrated. The problem is that most of us aren't sure that the Ferguson police are, which is why others have been sent in to resolve the problem.
Bull. This is EXACTLY the subject. The only reason this guy is dead right now is because he was another young, black male caught up in crime.
.
The police commander said that the police who shot Brown did NOT know that he was ALLEGEDLY involved in a petty robbery. The cop saw two kids walking in the street and for some reason shot at them.
I suggest that you hold judgment against the specifics of this case until further information comes in. But also understand that many blacks, who are hard working people and parents, are tired of being harassed by cops who assume that they are black, so must be guilty.
Moderator cut: -It is clear that you have no idea that frustration against the cops isn't just limited to the criminal element. Many cops just adopt a very rude attitude when ever they encounter a black person. This behavior creates stress as they have both a gun and the law behind them, and people like you who will gobble up every thing that they say.
Last edited by Oldhag1; 08-17-2014 at 06:38 AM..
Reason: Please read forum guidelines
You do know that the people who took over handling the situation were very upset about how the police released the information. The time to justify the actions of their police man is in the COURTS, not the streets!
So the blame still goes to the Ferguson police force, and they aren't winning too many friends, even among those who have had to take over to solve the mess that they made.
I have no idea what any of this means.
You claimed that people were only looting/beating nonblack people/shooting at police because of heavy handed, militaristic tactics, yet they stopped that three days ago, and surprise! people are still looting/beating nonblack people/shooting at police.
The police commander said that the police who shot Brown did NOT know that he was ALLEGEDLY involved in a petty robbery. The cop saw two kids walking in the street and for some reason shot at them.
Michael Brown had just committed a strongarm robbery, was running away, and was confronted by police, and now you claim "let's ignore black crime". Huh?
The issue of black crime is central to this case. A thug was killed by a cop with a perfect record, and even commendations/awards for community policing. Now you are saying "let's ignore the facts and pretend this cop magically transformed that night into a racist murderer and just magically happens to come across a black felon fleeing from a crime, and executes him for no reason". Technically possible, but extremely unlikely scenario.
We don't yet know what exactly happened between the two, but it's clear that the deceased was in this situation specifically because of his very poor choices in life. He had just finished beating the store-owner, and I think it's reasonable to think that he wasn't thrilled to be stopped by a cop. Could it be that he resisted arrest and fought with the cop? The autopsy will shed light on this. If so, there is no crime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny
I suggest that you hold judgment against the specifics of this case until further information comes in. But also understand that many blacks, who are hard working people and parents, are tired of being harassed by cops who assume that they are black, so must be guilty.
I agree with all this. But the best way to fight racial profiling is to fight black crime. The reason that young black males are so heavily stereotyped is because they commit a disproportionate amount of crime. Note that police brutality complaints are often even higher in majority black police forces (indicating that it isn't racism, but police behavior driving police misconduct). When the crime drops, the racism/stereotyping will eventually drop.
I know racists, but not too many young ones. The old folks will die, and younger people generally don't care about race, so if crime drops, the profiling will drop. No one I know my age gives a damn about black-white stuff (which is so lame anyways in a country where Asians and Hispanics will be the majority). If I heard someone my age talking badly about someone because of race, we would look at them like they have three heads.
I know racists, but not too many young ones. heads.
So how does the police fight black on black crime if they look at blacks as a group and assume them all to be criminals. If blacks within these communities fear the police and so do not provide information that they should.
Is it not in the best interests of the police to integrate into these communities, and win the trust of the honest people? Should be if their role is to protect and serve, and not to act as an arrogant and rude occupying force which many perceive them to be.
In fact isn't it a good survival tactic for the police themselves. Being rude, and criminalizing honest people isn't going to solve the problem. Crime drops when the police and the honest people work together, and this isn't going to happen if the police are so arrogant that they even beat up journalists, most likely because they wanted to intimidate them from reporting what was happening.
What part of this don't you understand. AT THE TIME OF THE ENCOUNTER THE POLICE MAN DID NOT KNOW THAT HE WAS ALLEGEDLY INVOLVED IN A ROBBERY. So the police did NOT act based upon a robbery. He acted based upon two boys walking in the street, which to me requires him to order them off, and not to have to shoot them. A proper investigation hopefully will uncover why he felt compelled to shoot them.
Having said that the protests aren't because of one isolated incident. This is just culmination of how large swathes of this community feel.
You should take note of the fact that many of the people involved in protest are also attempting to protect the businesses against looters. That should tell you something.
In any case the PEACEFUL demonstrations (not the robberies and burglaries used under the guise of protest) represent a generalized frustration with the police, this incident being a catalyst to mobilize people. Many people, including Rand Paul have condemned how the police have handled this. Even the man selected to fix the mess created, Johnson, has expressed frustration about how the Ferguson police are behaving.
Don't let me get started on this nonsense that racism is absent among young people and that they don't think of race. They live in a nation built on racism and some of those attitudes have sunk into their very pores whether or not they understand this. Their worlds are only slightly less segregated than those of their parents. There have been too many racist incidences on college campuses for me to buy that hype.
I must use your phrase to concur. I have no idea what your premise is. The proportion of the United States Population that was African American reached all-time lows in the 1930s. That was just after the zenith of the U.S. being flooded by European immigrants and the height of organized crime. This was followed by a "Baby Boom" after WWII of all of the immigrants now assuming a "white" identity. Since immigration laws were liberalized in the 1960s and the U.S. black population percentage has seen an uptick due to VOLUNTARY immigration of African and West Indian immigration (largely "brain drain" migration) particularly since the 1980s the overall crime rate in the United States has been steadily going down and crime rates among yes, blacks, have declined precipitously:
There is nothing to suggest that black crime is increasing and any special policy or criminal justice treatment is warranted by this population. The militaristic actions of the Ferguson police in this whole ordeal are unexplainable based on national (and global) trends.
Moderator - Diabetes and Kentucky (including Lexington & Louisville)
Last edited by Oldhag1; 08-17-2014 at 07:39 PM..
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