Gun Control and Mass shootings - Hard Facts

[katygirl68]

Originally Posted by Pennies4Penny

Oh please. That is a NRA scare tactic. No one has ever mentioned an outright ban on all guns
ever. They say that to scare people from doing ANYTHING.



Drunk driving deaths have been cut in half since 1980 due to increased laws. Just because there are two problems doesn't mean we should ignore one.

Read the article I posted on about the 5th page on the other thread. It addresses black market sales. Also, please show me proof of a county where guns are completely or almost banned that has a skyrocketing black market of gun sales as well as very high gun violence and death.




Laws don't prevent people from doing things? Lol. Then let's have no laws shall we and see how that works. Read that article I suggested for Todd.

Yes, the NRA is to fault for a lot of this. They have spent over $30 million in politician pay offs. People get slaughtered, the government does nothing, because that is what they are paid to do.



I meant to quote the mention of Brazil. You can not compare the US to Brazil. They are completely different worlds with very little in common.

I was the one who posted about Brazil, and I think you are dead wrong about that. People from Latin America are coming here in droves. Do you think they leave their culture behind? And we have the same gun culture anyway.

There is no way a ban could happen because no one would just give up their guns in this country. It would be an all-out war, and the ones who would have to do it support the 2nd Amendment.

And why do people keep saying no one has ever mentioned banning guns? Of course they have! And short of banning and confiscating all weapons here, none of the gun control laws would work. And 3 to 4 million guns would not just disappear. They would end up on a black market. And black markets work. Look at the drug trade. No amount of law enforcement, education, imprisonment or legalization has made one iota of difference in that trade.

I think it's funny you asked to show you proof of any country where guns are completely or almost banned that has a skyrocketing black market of gun sales as well as very high gun violence and death, and then later say my post about Brazil isn't valid because the two countries are so different. I gave you the very thing you were looking for, and you dismissed it outright!

I will say it again. Both Mexico and Brazil have very strict gun laws, and very high murder rates. Brazil's murder rate in 2014 was 56,000! It's so bad there that the government is considering lifting their gun ban so ordinary citizens can protect themselves against the criminals.

[Ted Bear]

Although not labeled as such, the NRA does a pretty good job of instilling terror in the citizenry in order to get their industry positive legislation (think money and profits) pushed through our Congress.

Any discussion of the daily "news" of gun deaths must include ALL deaths, not just those defined as "mass shootings". Death from a gun shooter is death, whether it comes by the dozen or from a lone shot from a single gun.

[katygirl68]

Originally Posted by Redraven

Since hunt-and peck typing is all I can do after getting a finger tangled up with a circular saw, I will just cut and paste from another thread:

"Did you conveniently forget that nearly every one of these recent mass shootings occurred in a "GUN FREE ZONE"? Even if some of the victims had been legal gun owners, they were FORBIDDEN the right of self defense! So naturally, being law abiding citizens, they did not have a gun! The shooter(s), however, NOT being law-abiding, had no qualms about bringing guns into such a zone! I find it interesting that there has never been a "mass shooting" at a POLICE STATION!
Did you also forget that in nearly every one if the cases, the shooter PASSED the FEDERALLY MANDATED (NO, the background check is NOT a state-by-state law, it is a FEDERAL law!) background check when he purchased the weapon(s) used?
Did you also forget that when the attempt on Reagan was made, the perp bought the pistol THREE MONTHS before the shooting? Evan the celebrated Gifford shooter had purchased the weapon long before the shooting!

It seems to me that trying to apply the "Rule Of Law" to CRIMINALS is an exercise in futility!"

It doesn't quite match this thread, but it is close enough...

Good post! And don't forget the guys with guns are the ones who usually stop the shootings. Heck, remember the guy in Oklahoma City who beheaded the receptionist and was about to behead the next lady when the boss shot and killed him with his gun? I know a knife isn't the same as a gun, but that guy had a knife used to cut bones in the back of the food packing plant and was a lot stronger than the clerical staff. He could have easily killed two or three of those ladies before the rest were able to run out the back. And if there was no back way out of there, those ladies would have been dead as doornails unless one of them had a gun.

[Army_Guy]

Originally Posted by mollygee

So........when we are face to face with someone with an assault rifle; I will remain calm and realize that this is a lie? Why do we need assault weapons sold on line and at gun shows. I am not a "liberal," I am a person, that has concern for guns in the WRONG hands. Bow and salute to the wonderful NRA, that is running our country into the ground.

I am so sick of greed and monsters controlling everything. Innocent people are dying every single day, sadly in our back yards. I hope whoever the next president is has the gumption to DO SOMETHING!!!!!!

You don't even know what an assault rifle is and you're trying to talk about them? I would safely guess you have never seen an assault rifle. What you see are semi-automatic rifles, they're not assault rifles capable of burst or cyclic fire. Have you seen a belt fed weapon?

You can not just buy any ATF controlled weapon online and have it shipped to your house. It has to be shipped to an Federal Firearms License (FFL) who will then have you fill out a 4473 and do a background check on you.

Background checks are also done at gun shows. Now if I run into NHDave at a gun show and we talk about him buying my gun, that's a personal sale. It is MY responsibility to ensure he is a law abiding citizen with a bill of sale, it is NOT the responsibility of the government.

What do you want the president to do? Remember, those guns and magazines are banned in California. Isn't it strange how the places with the most restrictive gun laws has the most gun crime. Law abiding citizens follow the law, criminals do not.

Instead of using ALL CAPS and multiple exclamation marks and yelling like a child with emotion, start acquiring some knowledge about the matter before you start spouting your opinions and try to spout them as facts.

Originally Posted by NHDave

Yeah, it's all the NRA's fault
I bet we could pin global warming on them if we try hard enough.

Let's look at the recent California shooting;

1. They didn't use assault rifles (by definition). Yes they were big, black, and scary looking, but they were not assault rifles.

2. They did use a rifle that was illegal in CA, so a law to prevent its use was in place, they ignored it. It's illegal to murder someone, they did it anyway. Do we need another law to make it illegal to ignore those laws?

3. If we had a law in place to prevent those on the terror watch list from purchasing weapons, it wouldn't have helped as IIRC the 2 terrorists were not on that list.

4. Laws don't exist to prevent people from doing things, they exist to provide for punishment after the fact. What law would you enact that would solve the problems without trampling the rights of law abiding gun owners? And that would not be broken by those who want to do harm?

Stop speaking with logic, those who move their lips based on emotion instead of filtering it through their brain will always be that way.

[Jeo123]

There's already a thread on this topic. We don't need a second.