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Is it just me or does some of your argument read like "A Modest Proposal?" Of course, why would we have the illegitimate parents be responsible for any of their actions? Let's just make everyone get castrated, or if a woman gets raped, let her or the state foot the bill! I hope this argument was written in jest.
Nope. This is the OP's third or fourth thread on the same topic.
The easy solution would be to make all fathers responsible for their offspring per DNA testing, no matter what.
If the men went into sex knowing that any offspring that resulted was their responsibility, regardless of what a woman said or did - things would definitely change.
It's so easy to have spontaneous sex and then blame the woman for any consequences. So, let's take all of her power away. What do you say to that, guys?
No more defense regarding she lied, blah blah blah.
And if there's a kid, she hands it over to you to deal with. No matter what.
Then men who complain about how expensive child support is, can learn first-hand how expensive it really is to raise a kid in the right neighborhood and the right schools and how often they grow out of shoes.
Yep. I think that's the answer. The kid has your male DNA, it's handed over to you at birth.
Bingo!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Futurist110
You are aware that your proposal here can simply result in men exploiting safe haven laws en masse, correct?
Why do you assume that all men are as self-centered and irresponsible as you are? There are millions of fathers out there who are fathers to their children, both financially and/or emotionally, even if they no longer are or never were married to their children's mothers. Many would welcome the opportunity to raise their children even if you would dump yours on the nearest doorstep.
All you care about is that you might have to part with some dollars to provide some support for an innocent being that you are responsible for creating ... to the point that you claim you want to get yourself neutered. I think you should go for it. Humanity will somehow manage to survive without your contribution to the gene pool.
So, how about allowing legal agreements before consensual sex as well and making these legal agreements be valid in a court of law?
Let me see if I have this straight. YOU want to have sex with no consequences. Have you tried a blow up doll? Sorry dear but there are consequences to having sex with another person. Children are but one of them and once the child is here is becomes about the child not about the two people who had sex and made the child. That child being fed, housed, clothed, educated, etc, etc, etc,... is more important than you. If you don't want to take this risk then don't but if you're going to have sex with a woman you take the risk and it's yours and yours alone to deal with.
My story is one of where the system is so far slanted to protecting the custodial parents rights it's down right a disaster. My first ex wife (who has had one job for a year of her entire 40 years on this planet) was supported by me when we were married. We had two kids (only one is mine I'm sure of it, although she refuses to DNA testing) together. I left her when my daughter was 3 and the other kid was 5 months old. I immediately started paying her support by mailing her a check every month, I lived 18 hours drive apart from her and so seeing the kids was not a very viable option. But I moved on, got remarried, and she married the guy she was cheating on me with. He is an engineer and makes well into the six figures, they have a nice house, cars, clothes etc. Her birthday cake this year was a Louis Vitton design that said "Born to Shop" on top of it. His was shaped like a Ferrari.
After the first year and a half of paying her, I get a call that Texas Child support division is going to throw me in jail. I freak out, because I've been paying her and they tell me it doesn't count because I sent the checks directly to her and not through them. So, basically at this point a negative hit goes onto my credit report saying I owe 11,000 in past due child support. This is in like 2005, I can't buy a home, car, credit card, personal loan, or change jobs due to the being on my credit report.
Ok so in 2007, I have a really good year at work, I was averaging 14,000 per month that year. My child support with arrears at the time was $550 per month. I get a phone call one day from my ex and her "advocate" at the child support office stating that I made too much money for what I was paying her and that they were going to raise my support to the state requirements of 26% of my income. That's over 3K per month they were going to charge me. Now, I had just taken on a new mortgage, baby, car payment and was trying to put my new wife through college on my single income and so again I freaked out. I told them that if they tried to do that I would get a lawyer involved so they said, well, we can just work something out over the phone, so, verbally, I agreed to $1200 per month but I was assure that if and when my income went back down, all I had to do was call and they would adjust it accordingly.
Well, not 4 months later the bubble popped and I went from 14K per month down to 2500 per month. I stood to lose my home, cars, and basically everything I had. So, I call the child support folks, and they said all they needed to do was to have my ex come in for an appointment, and we could talk it out over the phone, so they set the appointment and I thought everything would be okay.
I then lose my job and take what I could get at $1090 per month. I call in the day of my appointment and she's a no show, so I ask what I need to do and they said they would reset the appointment for 60 days later. So we set it, and in 60 days I call in for the appointment, my ex is a no show. This goes on for 2 YEARS! All the while, I'm not able to send her more that $200 per month, so that's what I sent her, what I could you know?
So, after many attempts to get her to show up at the appointment, I finally call the District Attorney of Texas (somehow he answered my call) and he told me I should be represented by a lawyer. I ask if they provide one for low income people and he replied, well, if you're a woman yes but not usually for the father.
At this point I owe over $35000 and they are talking jail time, all because she no shows my hearing to lower my support and because she lied to them about receiving personal checks from me for the first year and a half.
So I set a court date, which the "advocates" that work for the TX Child Support Division said I should have done in the first place, and the day before I'm to travel to TX for the court hearing I get a call that my ex wants to settle things out of court. So after a lengthy discussion, I get them to cut the arrears in half to 17,000 and my support went down to $775.
Here's the really sad part of all this, my ex is completely evil....She has not allowed me to speak to, visit, send Xmas cards, or have any part of the children's lives. I haven't seen my daughter in 14 years. My daughter hates me because her mom tells her how bad of a person I am. I tried to get the law involved, and their answer was that on my visitation days, I would have to show up at her home, if she refused to let me see them when I showed up, I was instructed to call the cops and have a report written up on her. I was to do this for around 6 months and then based on her not allowing me to see the kids, I could take her to court over it.
At the time I lived in SC and she lived in TX. I couldn't afford the child support, so how am I to afford bi-weekly flights to TX?
My gripe at this point is this, she lives comfortably, golf course lot, indoor swimming pool, two story home in an upper middle class neighborhood. I live in a single wide, can't buy a car/home/credit due to this back child support for kids I haven't seen in 14 years. When is enough enough?
If I could afford a lawyer, I'd fight her. But I've had lawyers tell me it's no use because the district my court case would be held in is the absolute worst judge in TX for siding with the custodial parent. I have had several lawyers tell me until that judge dies, I can forget about winning a child support case in that district.
I am okay with paying my support, I have been current on payments since 2009, I have paid the arrears down from 17,500 to less that 6,000, but I still have a judgment on my credit.
I cannot get a passport. I can't buy anything on credit, my score is in the low 500's due to this judgement. I cannot get a job that checks credit as a pre-employment tool. The lists of how this crap has ruined my quality of life goes on and on.
My ex tells me (in writing and verbally) that she only continues to "punish" me because she hates me. Meanwhile, I watch my kids grow up on facebook, watch my support money go to pay for indoor pools and vacations, and suffer in poverty.
So yes, I am for child support reform on every level.
I think people who legally get a divorce should be absolved from the responsibility of paying child support, personally. When I think of child support, I think of deadbeat dads who have never been involved with their children and wanted their girlfriend to get an abortion or give up the child; I don't think of hardworking men who just moved on. You really shouldn't be under such an obligation in those circumstances. I agree that perhaps the law should be amended. Perhaps child support should have a three or four year lifespan if the couple gets legally divorced. After that, the girl's financial situation should be re-examined, and if she's remarried and financially stable, the ex should be off the hook.
I think people who legally get a divorce should be absolved from the responsibility of paying child support, personally. When I think of child support, I think of deadbeat dads who have never been involved with their children and wanted their girlfriend to get an abortion or give up the child; I don't think of hardworking men who just moved on. You really shouldn't be under such an obligation in those circumstances. I agree that perhaps the law should be amended. Perhaps child support should have a three or four year lifespan if the couple gets legally divorced. After that, the girl's financial situation should be re-examined, and if she's remarried and financially stable, the ex should be off the hook.
So the abused wife who finally gathers the strength to leave her abusive husband with children in tow should not be awarded funds to ensure those children are clothed, fed, and educated?
The scumbag who leaves his stay at home wife and children for the hot secretary du jour should not be made to ensure his children are left destitute?
Seriously?
If these "hardworking men" bring children into the world and then decide to "move on" to the next thing, oc COURSE they should continue to support their children. They are HIS CHILDREN, for crying out loud!!
Did you ever stop to think that some of the students who give you the hardest time may not have involved fathers in their lives?
If these "hardworking men" bring children into the world and then decide to "move on" to the next thing, oc COURSE they should continue to support their children. They are HIS CHILDREN, for crying out loud!!
So if I donate a kidney to some poor child, then should I be forced to pay child support to this poor child afterwards?
Let me see if I have this straight. YOU want to have sex with no consequences. Have you tried a blow up doll? Sorry dear but there are consequences to having sex with another person. Children are but one of them and once the child is here is becomes about the child not about the two people who had sex and made the child. That child being fed, housed, clothed, educated, etc, etc, etc,... is more important than you. If you don't want to take this risk then don't but if you're going to have sex with a woman you take the risk and it's yours and yours alone to deal with.
Please do all of us a favor and tell pro-choicers to likewise stop whining and complaining about it when pro-lifers tell them to "keep their legs closed," will you?
Also, is getting surgically castrated not "taking responsibility" for you?
Why do you assume that all men are as self-centered and irresponsible as you are? There are millions of fathers out there who are fathers to their children, both financially and/or emotionally, even if they no longer are or never were married to their children's mothers. Many would welcome the opportunity to raise their children even if you would dump yours on the nearest doorstep.
So, do you believe that women who utilize safe-haven laws should likewise be criticized and shamed?
Quote:
All you care about is that you might have to part with some dollars to provide some support for an innocent being that you are responsible for creating ... to the point that you claim you want to get yourself neutered. I think you should go for it. Humanity will somehow manage to survive without your contribution to the gene pool.
I hate to break it to you, but unlike you, I myself am certainly not filthy rich and have a family history of living in poverty due to being stuck in that Hellhole known as the Soviet Union! Indeed, like it or not, but money certainly makes the world go round! While I certainly wish that we lived in a cornucopian society, we certainly don't live in such a society! Indeed, how about I take several tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of dollars from you and see how you like it?
Also, I would like to point out that I certainly plan to get my sperm frozen before I will get surgically castrated. Thus, it appears that you are thankfully not going to be successful in keeping my genes out of the gene pool.
Please do all of us a favor and tell pro-choicers to likewise stop whining and complaining about it when pro-lifers tell them to "keep their legs closed," will you?
Also, is getting surgically castrated not "taking responsibility" for you?
I'm not the one with the issue here. You are. I'll be surprised if you find a doctor to castrate you but do go right ahead.
My point is simply that once the child is here it is about the child and not about you anymore hence there should be no opt out for the sperm donor. If YOU do not want to take responsibility for a child then don't have sex. It really is that simple. YOU will have solved YOUR problem. It is not up to me to solve YOUR problem. It's YOUR problem. You just don't get that YOU are not the important one once a child is here. The child is. No you don't get the right to tell the child to starve because you didn't intend for them to come into being.
Castration is rather extreme but it'll kill you sex drive so your problem will be solved. I would suggest you try chemical castration first to see if that is what you really want before making it permanent.
So if I donate a kidney to some poor child, then should I be forced to pay child support to this poor child afterwards?
Super simple for you....don't donate your kidney. Or sperm.
I would find it uproariously funny if you ever met a woman who you really clicked with, wanted to settle down with, and you both wanted a child together, but then found you had a 0 sperm count. Now that would be hilarious!
In the meantime, get a blow up doll.
The most disturbing part of the OP, however, is that he finds Hilary attractive....
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Indeed, like it or not, but money certainly makes the world go round! 
Thus, it appears that you are thankfully not going to be successful in keeping my genes out of the gene pool. 
