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I worked in MR/DD. Incest. Two of our Middle Aged Consumers were from a Teenage Brother and Sister Incest. Severe mental and physical disabilities. The family put them up for adoption as babies but they never were adopted.
When the woman had a life threatening condition, her older sister was contacted. She wrote back to the Agency, "Do not contact me again until she is dead". I suppose the family did not want any reminders of a very horrible situation.
Very sad but what is the solution? Abortion in this case of incest would have been the kindest solution.
So.. This is a serious question and not directed at you, just.. Your post brought this to mind for me... If you support abortion for incest.. How can you not support it for other genetic reasons? Is not the reason that incest is taboo because of the higher likelyhood of genetic issues?
And.. Where is the 'incest' line drawn? Third degree relatives, which would be first cousins or a half-aunt/uncle.. Would those count? The first cousin relationship varies throughout the world. In the US it's generally still considered taboo, but more on an 'ewww' scale than a freakout scale of reaction such as would be the case of parent-child or sibling relationship
But.. At the end of the day.. Aren't we doing the exact same thing here? Genetic testing shows the child will have Down Syndrome.. Allowing abortion there, is there any difference in allowing it with incest. or, probably better to flop that. If it's banned for genetic reasons, why make an exception for incest, which is.. a genetic reason?
I can certainly say that I don't like the thought of abortion for genetic reasons, but.. I've always just nodded along when incest was brought up.. Never really considered it.. Now I am, and the above is what is going through my head.
So.. This is a serious question and not directed at you, just.. Your post brought this to mind for me... If you support abortion for incest.. How can you not support it for other genetic reasons? Is not the reason that incest is taboo because of the higher likelyhood of genetic issues?
And.. Where is the 'incest' line drawn? Third degree relatives, which would be first cousins or a half-aunt/uncle.. Would those count? The first cousin relationship varies throughout the world. In the US it's generally still considered taboo, but more on an 'ewww' scale than a freakout scale of reaction such as would be the case of parent-child or sibling relationship
But.. At the end of the day.. Aren't we doing the exact same thing here? Genetic testing shows the child will have Down Syndrome.. Allowing abortion there, is there any difference in allowing it with incest. or, probably better to flop that. If it's banned for genetic reasons, why make an exception for incest, which is.. a genetic reason?
I can certainly say that I don't like the thought of abortion for genetic reasons, but.. I've always just nodded along when incest was brought up.. Never really considered it.. Now I am, and the above is what is going through my head.
I too find it odd some people are ok with abortion if it was rape or incest but if the woman engaged in sex for recreation, abortion shouldn’t be an option.
Dumb kids result from Sex Ed classes that practice social engineering instead of teaching kids what they need to know to stay out of trouble.
Not sure what you mean by 'social engineering.' Sex education usually works if the kids use some form of birth control. For example, Bristol Palin was an advocate of abstinence, but got pregnant twice out of wedlock. Should have used real birth control, and should have learned that in sex ed.
Based upon some of the parental comments here, I'm so glad I raised my daughters to be pro-choice. If they get an abortion, they know I won't judge them or hold anything against them for making their own choices.
I too find it odd some people are ok with abortion if it was rape or incest but if the woman engaged in sex for recreation, abortion shouldn’t be an option.
I just want to point out that I am never "OK" with abortion. It's a gut wrenching choice - or at least it should be. I just think that if we limit abortions to rape or incest or actual, true danger to the life of the mother, we would cut way down on abortions and that's a step in the right direction.
I just want to point out that I am never "OK" with abortion. It's a gut wrenching choice - or at least it should be. I just think that if we limit abortions to rape or incest or actual, true danger to the life of the mother, we would cut way down on abortions and that's a step in the right direction.
Yes it is a gut wrenching decision, at least For most women who face a choice with an unintended pregnancy. The one problem I see with rape as an exception, I fear there will be an increase in fake rape accusations. It seems there is a percentage now that happens because a you g girl is worried her parents will disown her if they knew it was consensual. I can see trouble as well with incest exception. I don’t know how far along in pregnancy you have to be to determine who the father is, but if We can’t figure that out within the first trimester or so I can’t see that being timely enough. To truly help the victims. It’s a difficult issue for sure
So.. This is a serious question and not directed at you, just.. Your post brought this to mind for me... If you support abortion for incest.. How can you not support it for other genetic reasons? Is not the reason that incest is taboo because of the higher likelyhood of genetic issues?
And.. Where is the 'incest' line drawn? Third degree relatives, which would be first cousins or a half-aunt/uncle.. Would those count? The first cousin relationship varies throughout the world. In the US it's generally still considered taboo, but more on an 'ewww' scale than a freakout scale of reaction such as would be the case of parent-child or sibling relationship
But.. At the end of the day.. Aren't we doing the exact same thing here? Genetic testing shows the child will have Down Syndrome.. Allowing abortion there, is there any difference in allowing it with incest. or, probably better to flop that. If it's banned for genetic reasons, why make an exception for incest, which is.. a genetic reason?
I can certainly say that I don't like the thought of abortion for genetic reasons, but.. I've always just nodded along when incest was brought up.. Never really considered it.. Now I am, and the above is what is going through my head.
You brought up some excellent points. I too have wondered why incest is lumped in with rape. Often, incest IS rape, so that would already be covered. But if the incest is consensual, I don't understand why some people think abortion is ok for that but not for other consensual sex. It's not like *every* incest pregnancy results in birth defects. And as you say, in other pregnancies where the fetus is known to have genetic or medical abnormality, many people say abortion is not acceptable. Several states have pending legislation that would ban abortion if the reason is the fetus has Down Syndrome. So....abortion for healthy fetus=legal, abortion for genetic problem=not legal.
There is a lot of inconsistency in people's beliefs (which is why I'm glad we have a place here to debate and discuss.)
Well, all I can tell you is that when my daughter made a stupid decision when she was 18, and ended up pregnant, I am glad she was already solidly pro-life and never considered having an abortion.
She also didn't compound the problem by marrying the father, which would have been a disaster.
She did consider adoption, but she decided against that and decided to raise the child on her own. We helped her get an apartment (she had already graduated from high school and was in college and already planning to move into an apartment so that wasn't really a change, just upped the time frame a bit because we didn't have an extra bedroom and frankly, I wasn't about raising another child, considering I worked full time and was in my forties!) She was always independent and always strong, and strong willed, so there was no doubt in my mind that living close by but on her own was do-able. Though we were not RAISING her child, we were very involved with her child.
The great news is that two years after she had her baby, at age 21, she married a great guy. That was fifteen years ago and they are still doing great. And eventually the bio dad gave up parental rights and my son in law adopted our oldest granddaughter, who always considered him her daddy anyway, so now she has the same last name as everyone else in the family, which is nice.
I am so so so grateful that my daughter gave life to this beautiful child. I'm also glad she didn't give her up for adoption, though I would have supported that choice. I even had good friends calling me asking if she'd let them adopt the baby in an open adoption scenario. Honestly, there was a waiting list of good families and good people willing and eager to adopt her baby.
Get this - she was actually working as a receptionist for the LOCAL CATHOLIC DIOCESE when she was pregnant and unmarried. You'd think there would be disapproval (she wasn't even Catholic, but that's another story) from the priests and nuns, but instead, they babied on her, coddled her, loved on her, etc. She was heroic to them, because she chose life instead of abortion. That was an unexpected benefit and place she found support.
Hi Kathryn. I'm glad your daughter's story had a happy ending. I'm sure you know that, for thousands (if not millions) of unwanted pregnancies, children are born into situations far different (and less happy) from your granddaughter's.
Of course you love your granddaughter. Of course you are happy she is in your life. BUT....if your daughter had chosen abortion or adoption instead, then it is quite likely that at some point down the road, she would have had another, a different, baby. And you would have loved THAT other baby.
Yes abortion (like birth control) prevents a particular baby from being born. But in many cases, it allows a future baby to be born at a time when the mother's circumstances are better (because most women intentionally "max out" at two or three children in their family). That's how I look at the "big picture."
Hi Kathryn. I'm glad your daughter's story had a happy ending. I'm sure you know that, for thousands (if not millions) of unwanted pregnancies, children are born into situations far different (and less happy) from your granddaughter's.
Of course you love your granddaughter. Of course you are happy she is in your life. BUT....if your daughter had chosen abortion or adoption instead, then it is quite likely that at some point down the road, she would have had another, a different, baby. And you would have loved THAT other baby.
Yes abortion (like birth control) prevents a particular baby from being born. But in many cases, it allows a future baby to be born at a time when the mother's circumstances are better (because most women intentionally "max out" at two or three children in their family). That's how I look at the "big picture."
Again, happy it worked out well for your family.
kayanne
Thank you.
I can't imagine life without my oldest granddaughter. I can't imagine her light not being in this world. I am incredibly grateful to my daughter for her decision at age 18 and single, to keep and nurture this child, who is now a young woman.
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