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And they are currently soldiers in the front line of a war. We give free education to the armed forces...
Yes, as an offset for almost no pay. When I enlisted, the starting pay was $87 per month. That GI Bill was a big part of what I went in for. There is a difference between employment incentive and bailing out someone's loan after the fact. My previous post addresses the difference in the two.
There is always someone who doesn't want to pay back debt. They shouldn't borrow. These medical people, along with all other college debtors borrowed money so they could in theory get higher paying jobs than people who didn't go to college. That's no different than me borrowing money to invest in the market. If I did, and the market went down, would you repay my debt for me? Why should I share even the smallest amount in paying for someone else's education? I don't know them, thus I don't owe them. Let them make their own way in life.
Where does this debt forgiveness end? I am so tired of people expecting something for nothing. Now days every moron with a computer and camera phone thinks they are going to be a youtube star. If they borrow money for high end equipment then fail, do we bail them out too? How about the guy who works for a plumbing company then quits and opens his own business? If he fails do we pay off his debt too?
I think the main difference is that professional people with degrees (doctors, higher-level nurses, teachers, social workers, attorneys, business majors, techies/programmers etc.) punch well above their weight in economic output and should be granted a break of some sort.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miquel_westano
American tax payer should pay for the least amount of things possible to keep the country running. The tax revenues are not for loafers on welfare, failed businessmen, greedy politicians or losers that can't repay their loans after college!
Yet, when have we asked welfare recipients to pay back the money they've taken from the government? NOPE!
Do we ask the farmers with barren fields to pay back the government subsidies they've received over the years? NOPE!
Have we asked the bailed-out CEOs from the 2008 Recession to pay back the money they took from the government? BIG-FAT NOPE!
Do we ask guys who went into the military outside of wartime to pay back the GI Bill funds they get and (often) squander on courses without ever getting an actual degree? HELL NO! They earned the right to waste money in watercolor painting and pottery courses!
The government does all of that -- and asks for interest on top of it -- to college-educated professionals who keep the country afloat and keep the economy humming and institutions intact.
As thankful as I am for doctors and nurses on the front lines of this war against the coronavirus, I do not support forgiving the loans of highly paid individuals for just doing their jobs. Note, there are medics (doctors, nurses, etc.) in the military, too, who are always on the front lines (and who are dying in higher numbers than civilian doctors and nurses fighting this coronavirus . . . and let's not forget about the military in general, where many more members give the ultimate sacrifice, are maimed, and just on the front lines and in harms way more frequently, etc., yet their loans aren't forgiven), and their loans aren't forgiven by virtue of their position as medics in danger.
OK then should get rid of the G.I. Bill for the military? It kind of is the same.
How many doctors and nurses have died in the line of duty over the last 10-15 years? Or even in the last 75 years?
Nearly 7,000 US troops were killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, alone. And tens of thousands wounded in battle.
Nearly 60,000 US troops were killed in Vietnam and over 300,000 wounded.
WWII? Over 400,000 US troops killed and over 600,000 US troops wounded.
Fundamentally, military service is a more dangerous to body job than being a civilian medic. And military members sign up for the job knowing that they can be called into battle (and spend significant times away from home on deployment) and have volunteered to give the ultimate sacrifice due to the very nature of their job. That's why we get the benefits that we do. The same cannot be said for civilian medics.
Again, I am ever thankful for the job that civilian medics are doing today in combating this virus, and for the job that they do every day (they are heroes). But its not the same as military service, and the proposal for forgiving the loans of civilian medics is not the same as the GI bill for military service members.
Not to mention, military pay is generally FAR less than the pay for being a civilian doctor or nurse. The GI bill is part of our compensation package to make up for this.
It's not all about you either. You chose the field, you wanted the job, you wanted the loan and you went to the classes. Oh wait, it is all about you. So the bill should be too. Quit looking for something for nothing. You didn't pay my bills, and I don't want to pay yours.
Well, that poster specifically said he didn't want forgiveness on his student loans, but, hey, rant away
I think the main difference is that professional people with degrees (doctors, higher-level nurses, teachers, social workers, attorneys, business majors, techies/programmers etc.) punch well above their weight in economic output and should be granted a break of some sort.
Yet, when have we asked welfare recipients to pay back the money they've taken from the government? NOPE!
Do we ask the farmers with barren fields to pay back the government subsidies they've received over the years? NOPE!
Have we asked the bailed-out CEOs from the 2008 Recession to pay back the money they took from the government? BIG-FAT NOPE!
Do we ask guys who went into the military outside of wartime to pay back the GI Bill funds they get and (often) squander on courses without ever getting an actual degree? HELL NO! They earned the right to waste money in watercolor painting and pottery courses!
The government does all of that -- and asks for interest on top of it -- to college-educated professionals who keep the country afloat and keep the economy humming and institutions intact.
It's absurd and, quite frankly, unfair.
Professionals with degrees that "punch well above their weight" should be able to "knock out their debt faster!" The wages are more than adequate to payback the loans, the glitch becomes the "spending" side of the equation. Drs and lawyers love to overspend because after all they are drs/lawyers!
You then went on a tear of non sequiturs..........
How would someone on welfare be able to pay back if they are on welfare?
Farmers? Have you ever met a rich farmer? Do farmers have Bentleys and private jets? Usually the only windfall they get is actually selling the farm........to a huge corporation.
Military/GI bills are a benefit for after their service. Surely an educated veteran will be able to provide a better economic output than an uneducated veteran.
Bail outs? You do realize that all have been paid back in full with interest with the sole exceptions of AIG and partially CitiGroup. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troubl...Relief_Program
Scroll to the bottom to review the list.
I posted this as a reply in another forum but I think we should forgive the student loan debt of doctors and nurses fighting this crisis. Many especially in New York are making the last will and testament. One doctors even said it yesterday and added she was only 28. Doctors and nurses are being sent to potentially die due to constant exposure and lack of PPE to protect themselves and seeing constant death by not the day but the hour. This is a war and many are breaking whether it is getting sick and dying, getting fired for speaking out or using their own stock off mask or quitting due to unsafe work conditions. Tell me why they shouldn't forgive the student loan debts of nurses and doctors after this.
I think we should follow the idea of equality and not discriminate against those students who's loans have nothing to do with being a nurse or doctor.
The lack of PPE is down to logistics, demand totally out stripped manufacturing capacity and a shortage of certain raw materials. Tradesmen can't work on site without appropriate PPE, I suggest NHS staff with inadequate or no PPE, to go home. Or, take ownership of the possible risk of infection. We can't twist the arms of medical staff to work unprotected.
I think we should follow the idea of equality and not discriminate against those students who's loans have nothing to do with being a nurse or doctor.
The lack of PPE is down to logistics, demand totally out stripped manufacturing capacity and a shortage of certain raw materials. Tradesmen can't work on site without appropriate PPE, I suggest NHS staff with inadequate or no PPE, to go home. Or, take ownership of the possible risk of infection. We can't twist the arms of medical staff to work unprotected.
The problem with them walking off the job is that it would jack up the death rate. A number have left mind you, but most of these stories aren't often covered by the media. That said the media has done a good job of helping to support the hospital workers, well as good as the media can for anything... That said, I do think the healthcare workers will need for us to do something for them. What that is, I have no idea because everyone seems to hate this proposal
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