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Tail docking and ear cropping are purely cosmetic procedures. That is why people are against it. How would you like to have half your body parts cut off so you look better to someone else? How yeah I forgot, this is America where people do have plastic surgery all the time. Gotta make sure you look good to others even if it means major surgery. Dogs were born with all the parts they are supposed to have, leave them be.
The difference is....
Dogs are dogs, and humans are humans.
They don't care how they look.
We do... which is why we won't like it if it was done to us.
You ought to be ashamed if you want to do that to some poor pup just because YOU want his/her ears to look a certain way. If you want pointy ears, do it to yourself. Leave the dog's ears alone.
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I have watched one litter of nine Rottweiler puppies have their tails docked at...actually I think it was two days old. Maybe three. Anyway, they really did not fuss at all and definitely protested the most vociferously when being simply picked up.
I don't know that even a few minutes of squalling and screaming indicates some terribly cruel act...puppies scream blue murder about being put in a crate or corrected by an older dog or any number of things.
Anyway - my next Rottweiler will have a tail. I have a deposit on a future litter which will be left fully intact. And for the record, I would not crop a dog's ears personally, because I see no point to it unless I were to show a normally crop-eared dog in conformation. Which is highly unlikely to happen.
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Originally Posted by 2mares
The puppies tail in the video were banded not cut. I have to disagree about feeling no pain. I had several litters of rotties tails docked and they squalled and screamed and carried on for a few minutes. Reminded me of watching my nephew after birth when the nurse put him under that bright light and began poking and prodding him. He screamed bloody murder for a few minutes then was fine.
I could go find photos of horribly botched spays and neuters, too. In fact one feral cat I took in for a spay for the rescue never came out of anesthesia, she died.
But that would prove....what? That all surgeries and medications and treatments have side effects or can be screwed up. Yawn.
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Originally Posted by Venom
Oh look.
someone who goes searching for over-exagerated pictures of a procedure to promote their propoganda.
The first picture is exactly what ear cropping looks like, so no, it's not over exagerated! And if you disagree, take that picture to a vet that does ear cropping and ask. The second one is probably some poor dog that got an infection after having the procedure done.
It's not just one week out of their life! When you crop the ears, they must be taped up for weeks - plural! And some never stand anyway! I've seen people tape the dogs ears for over 8 months and they just flopped down as if they had never been cut.
And the fact that you didn't know picture #1 is what a normal ear cropping looks like and that you thought it is only one week out of their life just goes to show you know nothing about what you are talking about!
And dogs do care about having body parts cut off - it's painful! All animals care about being in pain, evidenced by the fact that they avoid it. Did you know that the dog's tail is used for communication? So when they can't communicate to other dogs properly, they get attacked because the other dog read their signals wrong. Which I have also seen.
Tail docking at a few days I am not totally against because their are some breeds that can break their tails when they aren't docked. So in that case it could be a medically necessary surgery. But I have not seen enough proof that all dogs in the breed need it done, probably because most have it done so it would be hard to gather stats. But ear cropping is purely cosmetic. And don't get me wrong, I used to love the look of a boxer with cropped ears - because it made them look meaner. But at some point people need to grow up and realize that just because they like something doesn't make it right to do. In particular when it causes pain to someone or something else.
And now that I have a floppy eared boxer, I love it. Her ears are so soft and silky I love running them through my fingers. She does have a cropped tail, but I rescued her at a year old so I didn't have any say in it.
The first picture is exactly what ear cropping looks like, so no, it's not over exagerated! And if you disagree, take that picture to a vet that does ear cropping and ask. The second one is probably some poor dog that got an infection after having the procedure done.
I know it was a regular ear crop. It doesn't look worst then any other normal cut you get stitched. Except the dog was knocked out and didn't have to feel the cut.
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It's not just one week out of their life! When you crop the ears, they must be taped up for weeks - plural! And some never stand anyway! I've seen people tape the dogs ears for over 8 months and they just flopped down as if they had never been cut.
Week Weeks, tomatoe tomato it's still a minute part of their life which they will never remember the week after they're removed.
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And the fact that you didn't know picture #1 is what a normal ear cropping looks like and that you thought it is only one week out of their life just goes to show you know nothing about what you are talking about!
Look at my response to your first quote.
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And dogs do care about having body parts cut off - it's painful! All animals care about being in pain, evidenced by the fact that they avoid it. Did you know that the dog's tail is used for communication? So when they can't communicate to other dogs properly, they get attacked because the other dog read their signals wrong. Which I have also seen.
It's painful if they feel it. They're knocked out.
Dogs with cropped ears can still cower their ears.
Dogs with cropped tails can still wag.
And why would you fight your dog?
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But ear cropping is purely cosmetic. And don't get me wrong, I used to love the look of a boxer with cropped ears - because it made them look meaner. But at some point people need to grow up and realize that just because they like something doesn't make it right to do. In particular when it causes pain to someone or something else.
Stop with the pain excuse. There is very little pain involved.
People need to grow up and realize there's bigger things to worry about that actually involve suffering.
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And now that I have a floppy eared boxer, I love it. Her ears are so soft and silky I love running them through my fingers. She does have a cropped tail, but I rescued her at a year old so I didn't have any say in it
I don't know that even a few minutes of squalling and screaming indicates some terribly cruel act...puppies scream blue murder about being put in a crate or corrected by an older dog or any number of things.
I agree. I had all my litters docked. I was comparing the squaling to newborns who are placed under the bright light, pricked, poked and otherwise manhandled. They scream for a few minutes then are just fine after being given back to their mother. No big deal.
My first rottie I rescued when she was 4 months and had her tail docked as well. She kept slaming it against the appliances and door facing till it bled. Good luck with those tails.
I have a good friend who has owned (not bred herself) a few show Dobermans and have spent time around two of her pups while their ears were taped. After the first few days, they pretty much forget about this strange contraption on their ears and play, eat, sleep etc as usual - if there is discomfort of failure for weeks or months, it's almost always because the taping and posting isn't being done correctly or the vet did a poor job.
Sure, it's uncomfortable for a few days. So is crate training a puppy, they almost always are very distressed by this at first before they come to accept and like their crate. All my dogs are crate trained - although they spend little time in crates, I do working/competitive dog sports and for travel and trial safety, are crated sometimes. I've never, ever had a dog or puppy like being shut in a crate at first, they howl, whine, scratch and whimper piteously. But I make a game out of crate training so now they all willingly go in when asked.
Sort of OT but my point being - just because something causes discomfort for a few days, doesn't mean it's cruel in the long run. (Google super-puppy program if you want to understand how stress actually makes for a calmer, happier and more resilient dog.)
Since long floppy ears are not "natural" in dogs and many floppy-eared dogs suffer a lifetime of ear cleanings and ear infections - rare in prick-eared dogs - I can see the utility in cropping. And do what if it's just for "cosmetic" reasons, anyway? What is wrong with that?
Well I also have a failed foster Labrador, so I'm getting used to the tail thing. Yikes! I did have a GSDx a long time ago who had an unfortunate incident leading to her needing about half of her tail amputated at about eight years old. Poor girl, it was not a pleasant time for her.
This is where I hope to get my next puppy from. I've got quite a wait! Almost all my dogs (and all cats) are either found strays/rescues/failed fosters; about once a decade or so I figure I can get a well bred pup. I hope to add Schutzhund to my dog sport addiction, I mean hobby. I sought out breeders who left tails in accordance to the ADRK.
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Originally Posted by 2mares
I agree. I had all my litters docked. I was comparing the squaling to newborns who are placed under the bright light, pricked, poked and otherwise manhandled. They scream for a few minutes then are just fine after being given back to their mother. No big deal.
My first rottie I rescued when she was 4 months and had her tail docked as well. She kept slaming it against the appliances and door facing till it bled. Good luck with those tails.
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I have a deposit on a future litter which will be left fully intact. And for the record, I would not crop a dog's ears personally, because I see no point to it unless I were to show a normally crop-eared dog in conformation. Which is highly unlikely to happen.
I sought out breeders who left tails in accordance to the ADRK.