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Old 06-20-2017, 03:13 PM
 
56 posts, read 37,683 times
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ok as i am speaking with a system designer and trying to get my head on strait about all of this stuff lol. i am planning on using AGM batteries. do i have to worry bout them freezing up if there in a shed along with the inverters and charge controllers if there out in a shed
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Old 06-20-2017, 03:16 PM
 
56 posts, read 37,683 times
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Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
In 600 ft^2? How?
i am in a larger place now, i will be down sizing when i move.
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Old 06-20-2017, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,461 posts, read 61,379,739 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dragon_slayer View Post
ok as i am speaking with a system designer and trying to get my head on strait about all of this stuff lol. i am planning on using AGM batteries. do i have to worry bout them freezing up if there in a shed along with the inverters and charge controllers if there out in a shed
At one point in our designing phase, we were looking at constructing a separate shed for our batteries. However the infrastructure needed to heat and ventilate that shed would have outweighed the benefit of having solar power.

One of our neighbors allowed his batteries to freeze, that ended those batteries.
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Old 06-20-2017, 07:37 PM
509
 
6,321 posts, read 7,042,755 times
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Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
Systems in Washington DC have a payback pf about 5 - 7 years.

Your silliest argument is that the government shouldn't subsidize energy technology. The government has been subsidizing all forms of energy for the past 100 years. ......................... Oil and gas get below market leases from government land................., coal get a free right to pollute, nuclear has government supplied insurance and tax credits. Complaining the renewable technology gets subsidies is laughable.
As a former government employee that worked with all those subsidies. Oil and gas does not get below market leases. Those are up for bid at auction.

However, telecommunication companies pay fees at HALF of market values by law. Ski area payments are at below market rates. Summer cabins are at below market rates. Timber sales are at market rates, except small business firms get a subsidy. And so it goes...pretty much everybody is feeding off the government. Oops forget about ranchers.

Anyway, oil and gas companies are one of the few business operations paying market rates.
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Old 06-20-2017, 08:07 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,461 posts, read 61,379,739 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dragon_slayer View Post
yep solar panels are the cheapest part of the system!!! it's everything else the cost's out the
It is not so bad when you can shop around online.

The real mark-up is when the installer is an equipment dealer insisting that all components must come from him. Every licensed installer in my state, are dealerships. None of them will touch components sourced from anywhere else.

That is why off-grid systems are so much less expensive than net-metering systems. I can see it among the quotes that I got, as easily as looking at the systems of our neighbors.
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Old 06-21-2017, 04:27 AM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 7,989,240 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 509 View Post
As a former government employee that worked with all those subsidies. Oil and gas does not get below market leases. Those are up for bid at auction.

However, telecommunication companies pay fees at HALF of market values by law. Ski area payments are at below market rates. Summer cabins are at below market rates. Timber sales are at market rates, except small business firms get a subsidy. And so it goes...pretty much everybody is feeding off the government. Oops forget about ranchers.

Anyway, oil and gas companies are one of the few business operations paying market rates.
That's such silly nonsense. Texas charges twice the royalty rate on oil and gas properties compared to federal leases.
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Old 06-22-2017, 12:16 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
7,251 posts, read 5,123,089 times
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Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
That's such silly nonsense..
Why don't you let members decide what's silly? Your personal editorial opinions are not needed to guide intelligent readers along in the discussion.
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Old 06-22-2017, 05:14 AM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 7,989,240 times
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Originally Posted by guidoLaMoto View Post
Why don't you let members decide what's silly? Your personal editorial opinions are not needed to guide intelligent readers along in the discussion.
It probably isn't needed for intelligent readers.....
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Old 06-22-2017, 05:37 AM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 7,989,240 times
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Originally Posted by dragon_slayer View Post
yep solar panels are the cheapest part of the system!!! it's everything else the cost's out the
Balance of system costs are being reduced as well. Overall residential costs are less than 1/2 what they were in 2009.

www.nrel.gov/docs/fy16osti/66532.pdf
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Old 06-22-2017, 07:06 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
7,251 posts, read 5,123,089 times
Reputation: 17747
https://www.solarchoice.net.au/blog/...ices-june-2017
Installed Price of Solar Photovoltaic Systems in the U.S. Continues to Decline at a Rapid Pace | Berkeley Lab

Residential solar installations produced electricity at a cost of $0.147/kW-hr in 2012 and $0.132 in 2017-- a fall of 9%-- Great! But will it continue to fall?

Grid power costs $0.09 per kW-hr, but taxes bring it up to ~$0.15-- so PV is very competitive IF your system lives up to boiler plate specs-- and they usually only produce at <50%-- unless you live in AZ, NM, etc.

You'd need to spend ~$32,000 to install a system capable of giving you the American average use of 900kW-hr /m. If your system keeps producing for 20 yrs, you'd save $0.132 x 216,000 kW-hr = $28,000.

But even at 5%/annum cmpd interest ROI, you'd have accumulated initial capital + interest- grid power cost= $32,000 + $45000 - $28000 = $49,000 after 20 yrs. So by foregoing a solar installation, you'd be $21,000 ahead after 20 yrs.

By installing PV now, after 20 yrs you'd be not only $21,000 behind, but you'd have to re-invest another $32,000 to renew your power source.
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