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Point taken on the CO monitors. I wondered about the moisture problem since it is a basement, but since it would be used as a space heater on a limited basis and not the primary heat source I'm not sure if that would be a significant problem.
Thanks for all the input. I'll keep looking into it.
Regarding wall mounted gas heaters - can you explain the difference? Is that not a blue flame heater or is it just that its not using "logs"?
With gas logs, you want the appearance of real fire. Good clean combustion is difficult if you want flame movement. Blue flame heaters are a step above this, more like a gas cooktop with the gas jets lined up instead of in a circle. The radiant heaters use the heat of the flame to bring the temperature of a refractory brick to a level where combustion occurs, and has the gas flow through this area.
One way to conceptualize the difference is to imagine a pot of water on a stove that you want to boil. If the sides of the pot are kept cold by bringing ice up to them, the water near the sides won't boil and will be cool and unchanged. If, however, the sides are heated to boiling temperature or above, the water will boil evenly. With gas jets, you depend on the design and hope that stray currents of air (acting like the cold sides of the pot) don't interfere. With the refractory or ceramic blocks, once the block is up to temperature, the gas cannot avoid being in a zone where combustion occurs, so it burns completely. The analogy is crude, but I think you can understand the basic idea from it.
I was interested in getting thoughts on natural gas fireplaces - particularly the ventless kind - in terms of how efficient and safe they are (or aren't). I was considering getting one for my finished basement because there just aren't enough radiators down there. We already have a gas line in place because the former owners had a stove down there at one time.
I've heard some mixed reviews on them - particularly the ventless kind - some people say that they are more efficient and safer than the vented kind, but of course, others say that it increases nitrogen, and increases indoor air pollution.
Thoughts? Comments? Personal experieces?
Thanks!
Take a look in Northern Hydraulic's catalog, if you are willing to forgo the "look" of a fireplace you can get some excellent unvented heaters. Not as pretty to look at but very efficient, and they do glow so you have that radient effect.
My parents have an unvented natural gas heater in their basement as a backup to gas forced-air central heat, since the GFA won't work without electricity. They don't use it much, but they did use it during a day-long power outage and it did heat the house effectively.
With you living in the Worker's Paradise of New York City, check and check again about the building codes though. You don't want to get on the wrong side of the Dear Leader (Bloomburg)...
Some of the unvented gas fireplace "logs" have serious odor issues. None of them burn as cleanly as a wall heater. Wall heaters are also less expensive and take less space. FWIW, the blue flame heaters are less clean burning than the glowing panel heaters.
You'll find that when you mention "unvented" you'll start a religious war. There are some folks who are adamant that unvented means filthy, dangerous, and a threat to life. They are not, when used properly. Byproducts of combustion are water vapor and CO2 when the burn is clean. In general a candle is FAR more polluting to the air than the output of an unvented heater. If you stick an unvented heated in a sealed room, then yes, it'll have problems and either shut off or kill you. Fill a room with water and it'll do the same thing. If you use common sense they are reliably safe.
If you had said you wanted a propane heater in a basement, I would be mildly uncomfortable. Propane gas sinks, while natural gas from pipelines rises. I'd keep propane appliances out of a basement. In any event, you are depending on sensors CO, depleted oxygen, gas, etc. to verify that conditions are safe. CO and gas alarms are available at the home stores.
We have a propane wall unit that I had installed primarily as a backup for power outages, but also to help on the really cold days when the heat pump isn't efficient.
Sorry, can I ask what sort of a heat pump you mean?
Thanks
"Sorry, can I ask what sort of a heat pump you mean?"
Electric, air to air. Works like a central AC unit in the summer, and the flow of the freon is reversed in the winter, so it essentially cools the outside by moving the heat in that air to the inside. They work fine down to about forty degrees outside, then the efficiency drops off. At about twenty degrees they don't work well at all, and most of the heat in the system actually comes from resistance heat in the auxiliary "electric furnace." That jacks up the power bill. Using propane to heat the place in the early morning, and only cranking the heat pump up two degrees at a time prevents the electric heat strips from cycling on.
A ventless gas fireplace is 100% efficient . I wouldn't do it.
They make vented ones that are like 96% efficient,very expensive. Slightly cheaper Rinnai is 84% efficient. We have a $1000 Rinnai in the basement, works pretty well, but a bit finicky. E.g. Wind blows through exhaust and blows out the flame sometimes, returning an error code resulting in me having to manually turn heater back on.
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