Growing Old(er) in Hawaii (maintenance, live, prices)

[Dreaming of Hawaii]

When one gets over 60 (or is it 62?), they can apply for the senior exemption to the property tax. This saves us a lot of money.

We installed solar panels to replace our $250 monthly electric bill with a $20 monthly bill. If total installation costs too much, you can start with solar water heater, which is a big cost saver. Oh, I think you already have that? (sorry I'm not sure what a "PV" system is).

We are retired and thus have more time to raise our own vegetables and shop the grocery store ads. Because our days are open, we can coordinate all of our shopping trips/doctor's visits and save gas money. And, we save gas money by not having to commute to work.

We don't use our cell phones for much more than making calls and sending texts, so we don't need high cost data plans.

[OpenD]

Originally Posted by PaliPatty

I might dodge rocks on this but we like our cell phones, our cable TV, our internet. We're not destitute, just looking for ways to cut costs in general.

The key thing is, look at your discretionary spending and look for alternative approaches, or other ways to do things than you have done them before. The more conscious you are about your current decisions the better.

Utilities and appliances and energy costs are big budget items for most people. If your refrigerator is more than about 7 years old it uses much more energy than the latest designs, and thus is quite a bit more expensive to operate.

Do you still have a conventional water heater? Is it on all the time? Do you heat your pool with gas or electricity? These are all areas where alternate approaches can save a lot of money. I just read that Heco has extended their $1,000 rebate for retrofitting a solar water heater. Even a conventional water heater can benefit from adding an inexpensive timer to turn it on when it is needed, and off in between times.

And carefully examine any small, regular expenses which add up to serious bucks over time. $5 a day doesn't sound like much, and is easy to dismiss as an insignificant expense, but it adds up to nearly $2,000 a year. So make sure that $2K annual item is actually something you feel is worth it in the big picture.

[hotzcatz]

"PV" is short for "photovoltaic" which are solar panels that make electricity.

Probably one of the best things we did in order to live well in Hawaii was to make a budget. A budget is going to be different for each person, but it is a really helpful tool. After we made a budget, we then had the paycheck (yes, a whole household living well off of merely one paycheck) deposited to savings with a portion flopped over to checking. We then try to live off of what is in the checking account and we usually manage it. The amount in savings gets mostly ignored where it just sort of sits and grows.

There are a zillion other daily things we do to save money. Right now I'm baking bread, it's a whole lot cheaper to buy flour and make bread than it is to buy the stuff ready made. It comes out to less than fifty cents a loaf if you make your own bread, but you have to buy the flour in twenty five pound bags and yeast in three pound bags. Most of making bread, especially if you have a KitchenAid mixer or a bread machine, is just waiting for the dough to do whatever it is supposed to do next, so even though it takes a long time from start to finish there is very little actual work time involved.

There are several small raised bed gardens in the yard, those provide an amazing amount of food. They are entirely fertilized by "bunny berries" which we get from the bunnies. Who eat garden trimmings, so it's a lovely circle. The gardens are planted with open pollinated seeds so we can save seeds from season to season. Saves on seed money and we can use the money to get new varieties instead of more of the same old thing. Heirloom and open pollinated varieties of vegetables taste wonderful! Avocados, lemons, oranges, bananas and tangerines are all "yard food", too. Several other "low chill" type of fruit trees have been planted, but they aren't mature enough to provide fruit yet.

We were off grid for a decade or so, now we are sort of on grid, but there's even more solar photovoltaic (PV) panels on the roof so the electric bill is $20 per month. There are also water heating panels on the roof, so hot water is solar with electric backup. We didn't used to turn the water heater on since the electric rates are so high, but with the PV system, we turn the water heater on when there are rainy days.

We buy almost everything from yard and garage sales. I'd guess that over 90% of the "stuff" we have is from yard sales. We even get food from yard sales, today's sales included a crate of stuff from Costco that they didn't want to ship to the mainland with them. They missed their relatives and were moving back in three days, so they basically gave us a whole bunch of stuff for $5.

We don't have a pool, but we do have a hot tub. We now use chlorine to keep the water clean instead of the bromine which is more expensive. The PV system was basically bought because of the hot tub, the electric bill wasn't so bad until that was installed. Now, however, the tub is available 24/7 and the electric bill is still only $20 a month.

Basically, I'd say making a budget and being extremely conscious about the monthly recurring bills is what lets us live well on very little.

[TGPILOT]

I've heard a lot of bad things about reverse mortgages.....

[KonaKat]

Reverse mortgages are fine for those who need the income and have certain circumstances. It was the difference for my mother in being able to stay in her home and have about $500 a month additional income so that in her last years she could be comfortable. When she passed, we sold the house, paid back the reverse mortgage amount and had money left over. But it's not for everyone, obviously.

RE PV systems, I just read something that I had not previously heard:

"Do PV Systems Add to the Value of Your Home?

A well respected appraiser called me the other day to discuss this topic. She was invited as a panel guest to an upcoming symposium hosted by a local real estate agent group. PV systems and their impact on home values will be one of the topics, as PV systems are the rage in our state. Firsthand, I have seen homeowners spend $20,000 to over $100,000 on a system. In both purchase and refinance transactions, the homeowners are shocked that all that money they spent does not flow to the bottom line of what the house is valued at by the appraiser.

It seems that PV systems bring up all kinds of questions and problems for appraisers. The government, through their lending arm Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, usually mandate how every aspect of a home’s features are to be accounted for in an appraisal. The government has been uncharacteristically quiet on this topic. Not to sound conspiratorial, but the current administration in Washington is the big cheerleader for alternative energy. If more homeowners realized that spending $40,000 on a PV would equate to $5,000 in appraisal value, they might not be so quick to fork out the cash.

As it stands today, PV systems are classified as personal property and NOT a fixture of one’s home. This is a very important designation. Personal property is generally not considered by the appraiser when determining value. Personal property is something that the homeowner can take with them when they leave. Good examples of this are refrigerators, washers, and dryers. Hawaii is unique where unlike the mainland, when someone sells a home, oftentimes the homeowner will take these appliances with them. That is why a $10,000 Sub Zero refrigerator doesn’t add to the value, even if it is being sold as part of the home. As a weird quirk, the $10,000 Viking Range/Oven is considered a fixture and is counted in the valuation.

Another wrinkle in our ever evolving world of PV systems is the lease option. Many homeowners unable to fork out thousands for a system go the leasing route. The company that leases the homeowner the system will in almost all situations record a lien against the home. This brings up all kinds of questions about failure to pay, or when the home is sold and the new buyer doesn’t wish to continue the lease.

The last aspect I would like to cover is life expectancy. The panels being installed today have warranties ranging from 5-10 years. PV systems are so new to the marketplace; no one really knows how long these panels will hold up in Hawaii’s harsh middle-of-the-pacific-ocean environment. I openly wonder how many of the companies installing these systems will be around in 5-10 years after the tax credits are gone. You also have to hope that the companies installing them are using quality materials when mounting them to our roofs. I am curious how many homeowners jumped up on their roof to see the installation job the company they hired did.

This article is not to slam PV systems. In fact I opine no personal bias on the merit of these systems. I hope this article is a launching pad for honest and frank discussion of how PV systems will integrate into the real estate market and their true impact on home values. Until the government sets standards as to how appraisers are to value these systems in relation to overall value, it will be left to the opinion of the individual appraiser, and the lender’s underwriter reviewing the appraisal."

[hotzcatz]

Well, we went up on the roof to look at the panels and the attachment system. They did a lovely job and when you pay that much for something you want to admire it. We also like to watch the electric meter go backwards, too. I guess we are easily amused.

Should we decide to move we can take them with us? Kewl! It hadn't ever occurred to me that we could. Still, I'd expect that most folks installing them on their house are doing it for reasons other than to increase the value of their home. Lowering the monthly electric bill is a huge plus towards making life affordable in Hawaii, no matter what age one is.

[whtviper1]

Every house I've dealt with - buying or selling has listed solar as an improvement when they do the report and list out the comps.

[OpenD]

Originally Posted by KonaKat

The last aspect I would like to cover is life expectancy. The panels being installed today have warranties ranging from 5-10 years.

I'm a big fan of photovoltaics, and I'm glad to see them finally becoming more mainstream in Hawai'i.

One thing to be aware of, though, is that they lose efficiency over time. As a rough guide, the power output of current technology panels will drop about 5% per year, which loss compounds, meaning that they will have lost about 1/3 of their generating capacity after 10 years. I would figure that into my budgeting.

Also, if you use a battery storage system, you'll also need to factor in the cost of the batteries, which can need replacing after 3 or 4 years, or less if you don't maintain them carefully. With a grid-tie system (connected to the power grid) you won't have that expense unless you want backup for night-time power in case the grid goes down.

So yeah, having a PV system can complicate the both the sale and appraisal processes. But Heco and Helco prices are not going to get any cheaper, and anything we can do to offset burning fossil fuels is a win for everyone. Just be sure you do your research thoroughly.

[whtviper1]

Originally Posted by OpenD

Also, if you use a battery storage system, you'll also need to factor in the cost of the batteries, which can need replacing after 3 or 4 years, or less if you don't maintain them carefully. With a grid-tie system (connected to the power grid) you won't have that expense unless you want backup for night-time power in case the grid goes down.

Since we always have to call out lately what does that have to do with the OP (which has gotten silly - and you wonder why people get annoyed on here??) - the OP lives on Oahu and we are all on the grid and don't deal with batteries.

[hotzcatz]

If your system is connected to HECO or HELCO, I don't think you can have battery back ups. Legally, anyway.

I know some off grid folks on Oahu! They live on boats, though.