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Also, I wonder if people who get addicted are just not that educated or intelligent specifically about health and medical issues. They may not realize that there is a serious addiction risk. They might not realize it is dangerous to take pain medications for every tiny physical and/or emotional discomfort one might feel. They might not realize that just because their doctor prescribed them two weeks worth of Percocet or Oxycodone they do not have to take the whole two weeks. They might even think they need to take the whole two weeks because the doctor prescribed it (and they didn’t actually read the label that said “take as needed.”) Etc., etc.
I think those of us who are medically “aware” and like to look at forums like this are unaware that there are quite a few people out there who are medically “dense.” And these people might actually be very knowledgeable and intelligent in other areas of their lives. I never realized this until I met my husband who is quite intelligent and highly successful, but for whatever reason, just uninterested in health, medicine and his body. I have been working on him for years now and he is definitely more of an active patient than he used to be, but he used to sometimes not even remember what he was diagnosed with or even the names of the medications he was taking. And he certainly never, ever did any research into his medications before popping them into his mouth and never ever questioned anything any doctor told him.
Most people blindly trust their doctors without even asking questions, let alone do their due diligence about their conditions or the medications prescribed. If their doctor tells them to take something, surely it can't be harmful......
And among that group are very bright educated people - just as there are bright educated people who have no issues, but become addicted. It only takes three days to become addicted to opioids, and yet ignorant people tend to blame those who become addicted to them.
No wonder addicts feel shame and don't ask for help.
After analyzing everything, cardiologist thinks most likely occasional mild SVT I've probably always had irritated a vessel enough to trigger a bleed, which lead to the clot. Every once in a while up to this point some MD would comment on the arrhythmia but no one suggested it was severe enough to treat and it wasn't disabling. Never had any signs of cardiovascular/heart disease or heart valve problems at all before and still don't. So why did it trigger bleeding at that moment? Possibly unusual stress/anxiety for the previous few months but there's no real way to know. Can't replay the past. I wore a Zio patch for 2 weeks a couple of months after the attack (but while using the new meds) which recorded the SVT in more detail. It occurs a lot more frequently than I realized but most of the time I don't even notice. No way to know whether its worse than before.
So, I continue to take the usual 2x daily 5 mg of Eliquis, low dose of metoprolol, magnesium and increased D3 supplements to help regulate heart rate. Cardiologist originally considered shifting to the low dose aspirin regimen instead of Eliquis after that initial 6 months but I suspect the SVT persuaded otherwise. No real issues with either medication other than bruising a bit more easily. One thing I do miss is grapefruit; my most beloved citrus !
Wow, SVT irritating a vessel enough to trigger a bleed, I guess when there isn't any other evidence one could point to, that's as good a speculation as any. Or it may have been a combination of factors that really never will be known, and hopefully will never happen again. They didn't consider microvascular heart disease as a possibility? In any case, hopefully the metoprolol, magnesium and supplementation along with the Eliquis will keep it from happening in the future.
You know, I don't really see where either the Eliquis manufacturer or the FDA make any mention of avoiding grapefruit when taking Eliquis, it's not listed as an interaction in either their package insert, or patient information, or in the FDA information on the topic (links below). I do see on some of the other websites, such as WebMD and some of the "everybody's an expert" websites instructions to either avoid grapefruit with Eliquis, or follow the instructions of the cardiologist on the matter. That's what you'd do, of course, but IMO it might be entirely possible you wouldn't have to give up on eating grapefruit!
On the topic of pain relievers for things like arthritis, or muscle pain from overuse, I've found that the Tylenol Arthritis ( 650 mg tabs) is very helpful. It's a 3x/day dosage if you need that much. I don't think I'd use it all the time, but it helps me when the joints, bursa or whatever hurts. I'm grateful I don't need anything stronger at this point. At this point I think I'd hold off on adding a single Aleve as an additive to the acetominophen, unless it gets really bad, but from what I'm reading it probably wouldn't hurt anything.
Last edited by Travelassie; 07-20-2021 at 01:27 PM..
Wow, SVT irritating a vessel enough to trigger a bleed, I guess when there isn't any other evidence one could point to, that's as good a speculation as any. Or it may have been a combination of factors that really never will be known, and hopefully will never happen again. They didn't consider microvascular heart disease as a possibility? In any case, hopefully the metoprolol, magnesium and supplementation along with the Eliquis will keep it from happening in the future.
It was unusual. Did all sorts of bloodwork looking for clotting disorders, genetic factors, nothing. They did several different scans, bloodwork, and during the ablation for heart disease. Just isn't any detectable level. The cardiologist commented that he wished he had arteries as clean/clear as mine. There's no history of cardiovascular disease, heart attacks or thromboses problems in my family either.
You know, I don't really see where either the Eliquis manufacturer or the FDA make any mention of avoiding grapefruit when taking Eliquis, it's not listed as an interaction in either their package insert, or patient information, or in the FDA information on the topic (links below). I do see on some of the other websites, such as WebMD and some of the "everybody's an expert" websites instructions to either avoid grapefruit with Eliquis, or follow the instructions of the cardiologist on the matter. That's what you'd do, of course, but IMO it might be entirely possible you wouldn't have to give up on eating grapefruit!
Of course I checked the package inserts and various drug info about grapefruit too as I hated to give it up, but from what I read it is more of an issue with metoprolol. Some Eliquis info mentioned grapefruit might contribute to bleeding risk and yes, the one dietary aspect the cardiologist mentioned was grapefruit. Maybe the combination of those meds matters. Again, it probably isn't all or nothing. An occasional treat won't kill me, just don't know where the threshold might be and it might be expensive to find out!
Wow, SVT irritating a vessel enough to trigger a bleed, I guess when there isn't any other evidence one could point to, that's as good a speculation as any. Or it may have been a combination of factors that really never will be known, and hopefully will never happen again. They didn't consider microvascular heart disease as a possibility? In any case, hopefully the metoprolol, magnesium and supplementation along with the Eliquis will keep it from happening in the future.
It was unusual. Did all sorts of bloodwork looking for clotting disorders, genetic factors, nothing. They did several different scans, bloodwork, and during the ablation for heart disease. Just isn't any detectable level. The cardiologist commented that he wished he had arteries as clean/clear as mine. There's no history of cardiovascular disease, heart attacks or thromboses problems in my family either.
You know, I don't really see where either the Eliquis manufacturer or the FDA make any mention of avoiding grapefruit when taking Eliquis, it's not listed as an interaction in either their package insert, or patient information, or in the FDA information on the topic (links below). I do see on some of the other websites, such as WebMD and some of the "everybody's an expert" websites instructions to either avoid grapefruit with Eliquis, or follow the instructions of the cardiologist on the matter. That's what you'd do, of course, but IMO it might be entirely possible you wouldn't have to give up on eating grapefruit!
Of course I checked the package inserts and various drug info about grapefruit too as I hated to give it up, but from what I read it is more of an issue with metoprolol. Some Eliquis info mentioned grapefruit might contribute to bleeding risk and yes, the one dietary aspect the cardiologist mentioned was grapefruit. Maybe the combination of those meds matters. Again, it probably isn't all or nothing. An occasional treat won't kill me, just don't know where the threshold might be and it might be expensive to find out!
I understand totally. I hadn't thought of the metoprolol interacting with grapefruit ( or vice versa), I've taken it for tachycardia control for more years than I care to remember ( not such a low dose now). I also take diltiazem for heart rate/ blood pressure control, and assumed that interacted with grapefruit, but see it isn't on that list either. It's the simvastatin I take that
has the warnings about the grapefruit interactions, and that's the specific reason I avoid it.
But this all involves competitive inhibition with an enzyme involved in the metabolism of these drugs, and there are genetic variations among individuals with drugs ( making them fast metabolizers, slow metabolizers etc) so individual interactions vary too, I'd suppose.
I hope you could enjoy that occasional grapefruit treat ( especially if you get a really good, juicy grapefruits), but I sure could undrrstand your reluctance to do so.
FWIW, the only pain medicine I've taken in the last 20 years is aspirin. Big Pharma uses aspirin as the 'gold standard' in pain relief. Like if they are developing a new drug they need to achieve efficacy at the level of aspirin to get the drug approved. Which asks the question, why...not... just take the aspirin? Probably because you can buy a truckload of generic aspirin for what it costs to buy a single oxycontin tab on the street.
I also find that low doses are just as effective as larger ones, and without as many side effects. The big downside is that I cannot take it for long periods of time because it promotes bleeding.
Most people blindly trust their doctors without even asking questions, let alone do their due diligence about their conditions or the medications prescribed. If their doctor tells them to take something, surely it can't be harmful......
And among that group are very bright educated people - just as there are bright educated people who have no issues, but become addicted. It only takes three days to become addicted to opioids, and yet ignorant people tend to blame those who become addicted to them.
No wonder addicts feel shame and don't ask for help.
Source for the bold? I've been hearing numbers like that tossed around in recent years but never seen an authoritative source for that extremely short period of time. I find it highly unlikely that a body can become addicted that quickly, which doesn't negate any of your other valid points.
Source for the bold? I've been hearing numbers like that tossed around in recent years but never seen an authoritative source for that extremely short period of time. I find it highly unlikely that a body can become addicted that quickly, which doesn't negate any of your other valid points.
Agree that sounds like alarmist baloney and of course there's always individual factors (genetic, age, other health conditions, other addictive substance use) that contribute to a person's susceptibility. Maybe some people can become dependent that fast. Others never do.
Agree that sounds like alarmist baloney and of course there's always individual factors (genetic, age, other health conditions, other addictive substance use) that contribute to a person's susceptibility. Maybe some people can become dependent that fast. Others never do.
And most wouldn't, one would have to have an awfully addiction-prone physiology to become dependent OR addicted in 3 days. Maybe 1 in a few million, but I still haven't found evidence for even one.
Source for the bold? I've been hearing numbers like that tossed around in recent years but never seen an authoritative source for that extremely short period of time. I find it highly unlikely that a body can become addicted that quickly, which doesn't negate any of your other valid points.
Many years ago I had my thyroid removed (cancer) and was given a morphine pump in the hospital that I could control, but obviously it had an upper limit on it. I tried hitting the button a few times but whatever the dose was it didn't really do much and gave me an odd perception that the pain was somehow further away but not really lessened. I didn't like that and stopped using it. Didn't use any from the script they gave me either but I've always had a high tolerance for pain during dental procedures, etc. so not really surprising for me.
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