Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I have searched the forums and I have searched the Internet and it seems that Air Conditioning systems is one of the few products that I have found a complete lack of credible information, reviews and concrete information on. I have remodeled homes, built new and have always found myself able to research just about all products associated with I have needed to buy.
Last year in advance of having to replace our AC unit after 14 years (ocean enviorment) I did a lot of research and even though we had no problems with our Lenox during that time I decided to go with Trane, an XR 13.
The AC went out this week and I now find that a good number of Dealers are now a year later are not recommending Trane as they say parts are hard to come for and they have been having problems with leaks a year out.
Comfortmaker, Bryant, Carrier (which is associated with Comfortmaker) and Amana seem to be the prevalent units for installations in our area. Google searches of these units are turning up reviews that are both evenly terrible and great.
I don't understand so much negativity, are the contractors not matching the units up properly as far as square footage?
If you do a search on these forums you will see that there is also a vast amount of varying advice.....with no clear leader in terms of satisfaction in regards to longevity and durability.
I am looking to spend 4k and I have no problem with that as long I am getting reliability and durability.
This is probably the first time I have ever solicited advice about home related issues.........this honestly has me baffled on the lack of clear information.
My current system is a Lennox and has been in service for 14 years. It has kept the house like an icebox (my wife's preference) I have 2.5 ton unit in a 1250 square foot home, with not a lot of windows and those that face the east and west are tinted. The unit has had no maintenance other than cleaning the coils in that time. I am a block from the beach. Lennox has seemed to fade away as far as sales in this area.
Again sorry about the recurring type thread but no one ever seems to all agree on a good product. I know what I need to spend.......I just want to install a unit with confidence that I can turn my back on it for the next 10 plus years other than maintenance. I have several known and trusted dealers in the area that have been here a while but they all differ in their advice on what unit they would like to put in, so I have confidence in having a reputable dealer to install.
You should be more concerned about who and how it will be installed, serviced, and warrantied. The brand is not that important- considering most brands fall under two corps.
As far as "which system"; you have two choices. Conventional A/C&Heat or A/C-Heatpump w/emergency heat. The big question is "sizing it properly". That can be achieved by performing a Manual-J worksheet. If the companies are not doing the Manual-J then move on until you find someone who will. All of those things (and more) you mentioned go into calculating the system through the Manual-J.
So, as you can clearly see I haven't endorsed any product/system- Fernandina Beach falls in a unique area; it's zone 2 like the northern 2/3 of FL. Yet, it's far enough north for freezing temps, and moderately more humid because its coastal.
Personally, I'd go Heatpump. And if NG is available, I'd use that for my emergency heat. As for a brand, in the almost 25yrs of residential construction I've been involved in I've used one HVAC contractor. He's brand is Carrier. Although my involvement is only the first year I can report no failures or major problems with equipment. And what little feedback I've gotten from him about homes that I built 5-10yrs ago results are pretty good- but he only retains a little over 50% of those homes for extended service (owners find other contractors for service).
I suspect that over 50% of the success rate of systems depends upon proper installation, especially with the scroll types of compressors. There are annoyance problems, such as undersized contactors that require periodic replacement, wiring and thermostat issues, fan motor failure. Those can be fairly easily addressed and even handled by a competent homeowner if the issue repeats.
The two serious issues are compressor failure and corrosion/restrictions in coils. Both of those have everything to do with care of installation, proper obsessive purging, and proper handling and protection of the copper refrigerant lines. Insist on a single run and no splicing, protection of the lines from contact with concrete or places where the line can abrade or vibrate, and at least twenty minutes more purging than the tech wants or feels is needed, to allow anything that will contaminate to boil off fully.
One other thought is to have some sort of surge/spike protection such as a whole house surge protector and, if possible, brownout protection or dropout.
What I have noticed in authorizing repair of commercial rooftop units is that a unit that has had compressor failure once is about four times more likely to have another failure, and that some locations had far fewer problems than others even though they were the same specced units. That indicates to me three primary possible issues - installation, power, and lightning.
Thanks for the input so far........I am seeing a lot of problems with components a few years in with leaks. The new Puron refrigerants are operating at higher pressures and it seems that the components are not being manufactured with that in mind.
Unless I am looking in the wrong avenues I am not finding any industry leaders as far as durability and performance.
Link below talking about higher operating pressures....which plenty of reviews talk about leaks just a few years in with new equipment:
The big question is "sizing it properly". That can be achieved by performing a Manual-J worksheet. If the companies are not doing the Manual-J then move on until you find someone who will. All of those things (and more) you mentioned go into calculating the system through the Manual-J.
Not true. I have seen repeatedly salesmen that do a manual J and heat loads are skewed upwards by 1/2 ton or more.
The OP says he has had a 2.5 Ton Lennox for past 14 years that has worked well. What on God's green earth do you need a manual J calculation for in this situation?
The manual J heat load calculation is a tool. But can be easily manipulated. You can fool just about anyone into buying a bigger unit... because they all think bigger is better. Until the swamp fog clears that is.
If the ac is undersized much better easier problem to fix than oversized. Manual J is an estimation, best guess because many times this is what you are doing when applying R values to insulation levels.
If someone is doing a manual J that comes out to be a bigger unit than you currently have be very wary.
I saw a home last year 1500 SQ FT with a 5 ton unit. I couldn't run away fast enough.
I have searched the forums and I have searched the Internet and it seems that Air Conditioning systems is one of the few products that I have found a complete lack of credible information, reviews and concrete information on. I have remodeled homes, built new and have always found myself able to research just about all products associated with I have needed to buy.
The short answer is you won't. Each manufacturer make multiple models. When people refer to "their" model they just say the brand name.
It would be like going to a board and griping about Ford. Other people would say Ford? Ford's are great you are off your rocker, some others might chime in and say yeah Ford's are crap.
Some one may pipe in and say what kind of Ford. You say "PINTO"
You don't have this exact match with AIR CONDITIONING.
How much did you spend on the pinto? xxxx? I paid more... because I bought a mustang and this thing rocks!
$4k is closer to the pinto. This doesn't mean it's not capable of doing the job... but if installation & system design is not done properly... well you know. Or you'll find out... take your pick. The installation & design part is just as important with higher end equipment. Higher end equipment has better controls and features that typically extend equipment life. Most people don't choose the high end... the ones that do are typically the very few ones who chime in and say so and so brand is great.
Then we have the HACK market in Air Conditioning. Better known as home warranty. But people don't say I had my home warranty put in this POS and it breaks every year even though it's new. WHY?
Because the home warranty blames it on the manufacturer. How convenient huh? So people complained on the boards about XYZ manufacturer by brand name only.
As an example one of the Brands I offer has 16 DIFFERENT MODELS all under the same brand name.
As other said, almost all hvac units have the same parts - they all get their parts from the same wholesalers. What sets one apart from the other, is the warranty. Having said that, you need a good installer. period.
HA, HA, HA.... He's in Canada! Yeah he should know a lot about air conditioning. How long is his summer?
3 weeks? A month? LOL.
GOOD ONE.
It was one of the most Informative articles I found and 410A is 410A whether it is in Canada or the US, correct? I could not find anything else legitimate about higher operating pressures of the 410A.
Obviously there seems to be a problem with a lot of these units and the breakdown of the equipment so soon, and the majority of the those troubles divided between instillation issues and leakage, with leakage a leading cause.............and I am finding it is because of the higher pressures.
You are definitely right on the numbers of models..............I am just having a hard time grasping that as a consumer I am finding that I have to either put my blind trust in a dealer or become a rocket scientist to understand the AC units out there to make a definitive choice.
Comparing AC units to the auto industry..........I don't see the comparison. At least with autos I have a much better opportunity learning about the models through word of mouth and research. I am finding out that it is one big black hole when it comes to the air conditioning industry.
There are going to be a lot of consumers in the US pretty upset this summer when they learn that their R22 units are obsolete and the cost to add a few pounds is pretty close to a weeks wage for those working for minimum wage.
I was never one to quibble about price as long as I was paying for quality, but I sure as heck don't want my buying experience to be equal to betting on the roulette wheel in Vegas.........luck of the draw!!!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
