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I bought my first home (condo in high rise) at 27 for about $460,000. I live in a very healthy housing/condo market and prices have at least been generally steady when they are not increasing. Yes, there are some challenges, but nothing beats the freedom I have with home ownership.
Now, given my experience with standalone houses, I knew that I wanted to live in a high rise, even with the higher HOA fees associated with such setups. I feel more secure and like living in a building with others. But to each his or her own.
30 years is just a marketing gimmick, anyone who ever bought a house knows it.
US is the only country in the world who puts this crap called "asphalt shingles" on roofs, which start to deteriorate within first 3 years from sun, wind etc. If you don't replace this crap every 10 years you are risking sudden and big water damage, which will screw up your artificial wood house big time, and will cost $$$$ to fix.
You probably live in area with lot of poverty, I have never seen a roof replaced for less than $10K, even in deep south, forget about north east or west.
Actually.... my father has been a residential contractor for over 30 years and I grew up building houses with him. Furthermore on the subject of shingles, my aunt has worked for GAF (one of the largest shingle manufacturers in the country) for almost that long. So I would stand to say I likely know more about this field than you think. I live in one of the largest and fastest growing cities in Alabama, which is diverse with Engineers, Scientists, and many other career fields that makes us FAR from a "poverty stricken" area. Sorry that we don't fit your idea of a lower cost of living.
30 year shingles when installed correctly and are not subjected to damage from storms can and often do last 25 years. There is no marketing gimmick involved. Certain manufacturers are better than others, but that is when having a little bit of knowledge plays into things. If you want maintenance free, one can easily pay a bit more and have a metal roof installed. But every type of building material has it's features and drawbacks. There is no one universal end all solution.
I paid a contractor to replace my old 3 tab shingles on my previous home in 2013 with upgraded GAF architectural shingles for $5,800. That included replacing all plumbing vent gaskets, and completely removing and replacing the felt and shingles. The house was built in 1991. That's 22 years. There were no issues with water leakage, but we had a round of tornadoes come through a year prior that caused some hail damage that I noticed one day while I was cleaning out my gutters. I chose to get it repaired before it became an issue. (That's the preventative maintenance I was telling you about)
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Originally Posted by civis
That's the deal with US built houses and US contractors - you never know when next big item needs repair and how much they will rip you off for it. Just to replace some windows/doors which suddenly lost thermal seal can run $5K+, then your AC stops cooling due to freon leak, another $2K to fix, and so on.
American contractors is another thing I would never want to deal with again - 95% have no skills, very low to no moral, and never want to compete and give you a reasonable price.
You should really move out of this country if this is how you feel about the way things are done here. Contractors charge a market rate. In a typical situation the cost is 50% materials, 50% labor. Contractors compete or go out of business. It's extremely competitive.
I got a few quotes to replace the windows on the home to upgrade from the older style wooden windows to Andersen Low E vinyl windows. The cost to replace 14 windows in a brick house (sometimes more difficult) was about $1,300. Luckily these were still functioning correctly and since we were selling it we left it be. I did, however have to have my HVAC replaced while we lived there and we upgraded from a 10 SEER 3 TON Heil contractor grade unit to an 18 SEER 3.5T Carrier Performer series for a whopping $5,800. The guys were professional and were in and out in less than a day. We also were able to realize about a $18 average per month savings over the new unit' efficiency.
If you have no knowledge of how things really work, you should avoid posting in these forums to spout nonsense. When people are looking for information that allows them to make an informed decision they need to see good information from both sides. Complaining about how much you hate American construction adds literally no value to the conversation.
You should really move out of this country if this is how you feel about the way things are done here. Contractors charge a market rate. In a typical situation the cost is 50% materials, 50% labor. Contractors compete or go out of business. It's extremely competitive.
I got a few quotes to replace the windows on the home to upgrade from the older style wooden windows to Andersen Low E vinyl windows. The cost to replace 14 windows in a brick house (sometimes more difficult) was about $1,300.
You should stop giving advice when no one asked.
Most of what you wrote is a lie, roofs don't last 25 years, 14 Anderson windows cannot cost $1,300, one can just take a look at HD web site to realize that you are a liar.
"market rate" is just BS used by a typical contractor to hide his greed and incompetence, most of them even refuse to give detailed estimate, because they don't want you to know the real cost of things.
My favorite trick with contractor is to give them my own estimate, which would include detailed labor and material cost freely available on the Net - 95% of will shy away immediately, because they hope for a "quick kill" - charge atrocious fees and run. God save me from dealing with this scum, called contractors.
Most of what you wrote is a lie, roofs don't last 25 years, .
Roofs do last 25 years or more and that's shingle roofs. My father has a shingle roof that has lasted longer than 25 years. When you buy a home they use that as a guideline and if roof permits were pulled then they can estimate how long the roof will last. A good inspector can also tell the age and condition of a roof. Tile and metal roofs last longer. I don't know how long flat roofs last, but those are not common in cold areas that get snow.
That's the deal with US built houses and US contractors - you never know when next big item needs repair and how much they will rip you off for it. Just to replace some windows/doors which suddenly lost thermal seal can run $5K+, then your AC stops cooling due to freon leak, another $2K to fix, and so on..
Lol no..
There's no way freon costs $2k. Mine went out last summer and needed a part - and the total cost for it, labor, and topping the freon off was $200.
Life requires work and costs money. If you're not willing to work on your home, then you're not ready to bear the responsibility of owning a home, and should rent instead. If your thought process is that as a renter you don't have to worry about paying for a new roof or hvac unit, I can assure you that you're wrong. You're paying for it with your rent, and at times rent increases at time of renewal. If you're not willing to pay it, then pack your stuff and find a new place to live. The difference is who's new roof are you paying for - yours or someone else's?
The idea that American homes are garbage, is one that needs to be better understood. Are they like the European home that was built out of stacked stone and have been around for 300 years? No. But do they have a cold stiff wind blowing through them every December? No. Are they like the houses in say India, or China, or Japan for instance? No. They're better built than that.
To the point of using artificial wood. Like the floor joists. If the particle wood used for a floor joist is capable of doing the same thing as a solid piece of wood, which it is, then what's wrong with saving a tree or two in the process? If every home being built now had to use solid wood for the floor joists, then we'd be deforresting a lot faster than we already are (unfortunately).
The complaint about having to spend money on your home to maintain it properly ties to my first paragraph. If costs of maintenance are an issue, then rent a tent, buy some duct tape, and drive a Corrolla.
OP, buying a home is a responsibility, a big one. But at the end of the day, you're buying one anyway. The difference is between buying your home, or buying someone else's.
I've been renovating my current home for the past year. In the wash of contractors for this that and the other via Angie's List or other assembly lists of contractors out there (Home Advisor), I've actually had the best luck with just using Home Depot. Fairly priced, great customer service, and not real hassles.
Remember. You don't work for free, so you can't expect someone else too either. Our economic engine doesn't function that way. To assume so, is wishing for a hand out.
You should stop giving advice when no one asked.
Most of what you wrote is a lie, roofs don't last 25 years, 14 Anderson windows cannot cost $1,300, one can just take a look at HD web site to realize that you are a liar.
"market rate" is just BS used by a typical contractor to hide his greed and incompetence, most of them even refuse to give detailed estimate, because they don't want you to know the real cost of things.
My favorite trick with contractor is to give them my own estimate, which would include detailed labor and material cost freely available on the Net - 95% of will shy away immediately, because they hope for a "quick kill" - charge atrocious fees and run. God save me from dealing with this scum, called contractors.
No lies here. You should really educate yourself. And I believe the OP WAS asking for advice. Otherwise, why are you here?
If you are looking at the big box stores you pay more. Look at your local dealers and you can negotiate much better rates. Not my fault that you cannot find a better deal. That has nothing to do with a lying contractor and more to do with a lack of knowledge of the construction industry.
I believe we have beaten the roof to death and it has been repeated that they do in fact last as long as we say.
Your "estimates" are likely ridiculous seeing as how you know nothing about construction, so I don't blame them from shying away. It has nothing to do with an easy kill but more that a contractor isn't going to take a loss on a job just to get business.
A small point about engineered floor joists: 1860's houses in Cincinnati have 3x10 first-growth oak floor joists. Each one is capable of supporting the whole house on a cantilever. However, they have all sagged. Wood is plastic and will deform, over time, under its own weight. I don't know if particle-board I-beams have been tested for long-term deformation; I doubt they've been around long enough for results in the field. Beam strength is not the only requirement.
If I were building a new house, I would frame it in steel.
A small point about engineered floor joists: 1860's houses in Cincinnati have 3x10 first-growth oak floor joists. Each one is capable of supporting the whole house on a cantilever. However, they have all sagged. Wood is plastic and will deform, over time, under its own weight. I don't know if particle-board I-beams have been tested for long-term deformation; I doubt they've been around long enough for results in the field. Beam strength is not the only requirement.
If I were building a new house, I would frame it in steel.
Ehh..... Steel would be twice as expensive in terms of material costs, added design elements (more support for added weight of the beams) and labor. It would also add to the time required to frame up a home. You also have to take into consideration running wiring through steel as care has to be taken not to nick a wire. Yes, it can be done and people use it, but no it isn't economical and necessary.
LVL (Laminated veneer lumber) is better than conventional lumber in that it will not shrink, twist, crown, warp, or split. It can also be had in any length you desire and can come pre-cut as needed so the installation time is cut down. Plus you reduce the need for joints over long spans. It's a bit more pricey than wood but since less work has to be done to true it up you save on install costs. It will support more weight than conventional lumber as well.
Some care has to be taken with hole placement to route plumbing and electrical but that is also true to some extent with conventional lumber as well.
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I live in one of the largest and fastest growing cities in Alabama, which is diverse with Engineers, Scientists, and many other career fields that makes us FAR from a "poverty stricken" area. Sorry that we don't fit your idea of a lower cost of living.
