What qualifies as desirable, "family-friendly"? (Houston, Austin: upper-class, cheap apartments)

[N. Olikee]

Originally Posted by houstonfan

I think a lot of people fall in love the concept of "master planned" community...where there everything is shiny new, there is uniformity in the development, lawns are manicured, man made lakes, fountains, golf courses, community club houses, new shops, new schools, etc. Think Stepford wives community. I don't blame them, I always think how nice these communities look when I visit eventhough I wouldn't live there. Also, I think part of the family friendly concept is that the majority of your neighbors are like you, young family with lots of kids to play with your kids. Add to it 'good' schools and safety.

These places appeal to some people. I remember when The Woodlands was just being developed and I thought, "Who in the world would want to live all the way out here?"

In the end, I think it's great there is something for everyone. I still don't "get" the gated communities that are far, far away from crime-ridden areas.

[houston-nomad]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

N. Olikee, obviously folks would rather finance their kid's schooling through their mortgage and tax payments than pay big chunks out of pocket. But the question is what characteristics of a school that forces the issue? It's not like every home buyer visits every school to experience it themselves. Is it just hearsay - most folks just hear that "oh, you can't send your kid to that school" and cross that neighborhood off their list? Or are they looking at specific school data - test scores, TEA rating, student body makeup?

I realize I risk prompting uncomfortable content with this question, but this is an issue that appears to play a huge driver in housing growth, location, and price in our region, with associated impacts to the location of retail and major employers. It is important to really understand it.

What part of this are you not getting? 10 people have said it's about schools. There are ratings of schools, you can view the scores online, you can visit and see the rundown facilities, etc. The tests are not hard. When a school can't get "recognized" status, there are problems at that school. It's not rocket science, and anyone with kids can pretty quickly figure it all out. Why would they make their biggest investment in a place where their most precious asset can't get a decent education in a safe environment?

And seriously, why do you keep asking the same question?

[LocalPlanner]

I'm not trying to repeat myself - I get that it's schools. I'm trying to find out what specific information people are using to decide whether they can live in a particular school zone or not. Again, is it hearsay / stories, are they looking up a particular statistic, all of the above...?

[N. Olikee]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

I'm not trying to repeat myself - I get that it's schools. I'm trying to find out what specific information people are using to decide whether they can live in a particular school zone or not. Again, is it hearsay / stories, are they looking up a particular statistic, all of the above...?

Exactly.

[JasonAndJulie]

LocalPlanner is using us as a focus group, except not paying us for it

As a Homeschool parent, schools DO matter to me. For one thing, good schools mean better home appreciation and resale. It also means you'll probably (generalization) get the "better" kids for your kids to hang out with. You'll also find more kid friendly activites like gymnastics, soccer, art classes, etc.

There are all socioeconomic classes that have parents that do drugs or other undesirable things, but in general, college educated parents typically bring way less "baggage" into their kids' lives. If it's not in their kids' lives, their kids aren't bringing it to school where my kids (or your kids, or whatever) might pick up some of the same habits.

I have no idea how you find out who is college educated and who isn't. All this college talk makes me sound like that's all I care about, but I don't. It's just the easiest way to judge a group in general. In general, college educated people live in safer areas than those that aren't. At the end of the day, for me, it's all about safety and education. If you're not safe, and you're not educated, nothing else matters.

All that said, we've decided we want property like 10+ acres, and when you get property often times schools are not as great. That is when it doesn't matter to us as much, that we homeschool.

[LocalPlanner]

You're on to me, JandJ

It seems that you are implying that schools not only represent the potential educational experience for one's children, but also are a proxy for many other aspects of the local community. Meaning, if a neighborhood is zoned to a "desirable" school (still would like to know how other posters define that...or perhaps more to the point how they define "undesirable"), then home buyers are assuming other "desirable" things about the nature of the community's residents and perhaps its real estate performance.

I realize I'm harping on things to which some folks will reply, "Well, duh!" But to engage in further, more "academic" research, like I hope to do at some point, you've got to try and draw out more specific measurements or markers that you could analyze quantitatively. Hence the pestering, so please bear with me.

[N. Olikee]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

You're on to me, JandJ

It seems that you are implying that schools not only represent the potential educational experience for one's children, but also are a proxy for many other aspects of the local community. Meaning, if a neighborhood is zoned to a "desirable" school (still would like to know how other posters define that...or perhaps more to the point how they define "undesirable"), then home buyers are assuming other "desirable" things about the nature of the community's residents and perhaps its real estate performance.

I realize I'm harping on things to which some folks will reply, "Well, duh!" But to engage in further, more "academic" research, like I hope to do at some point, you've got to try and draw out more specific measurements or markers that you could analyze quantitatively. Hence the pestering, so please bear with me.

MMMmmmm, you are "over-thinking" it. Essentially, people want to / need to be with "their own." It's called Human Nature.... It's not so much "measurements or markers."

[LocalPlanner]

Sometimes, "over-thinking" it is required, unfortunately. I would love to be able to help other folks in my professional world better understand why the home market and suburban growth is the way it is. Too many of them don't, but some of them also happen to be people that make public policy decisions that very well could affect people's lives, including yours.

Thus when you say something like, "their own", I have to be able to tie that to something, data- or information-wise. If that means dealing with something potentially controversial like income homogeneity (which I'm kind of suspecting you and others might be getting at) then so be it. I'm not here to criticize people's preferences, just trying to figure out how to best explain, from a somewhat "academic" perspective, why our land use markets are the way they are.

[N. Olikee]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

Sometimes, "over-thinking" it is required, unfortunately. I would love to be able to help other folks in my professional world better understand why the home market and suburban growth is the way it is. Too many of them don't, but some of them also happen to be people that make public policy decisions that very well could affect people's lives, including yours.

Thus when you say something like, "their own", I have to be able to tie that to something, data- or information-wise. If that means dealing with something potentially controversial like income homogeneity (which I'm kind of suspecting you and others might be getting at) then so be it. I'm not here to criticize people's preferences, just trying to figure out how to best explain, from a somewhat "academic" perspective, why our land use markets are the way they are.

Why in the world would "income homogeneity" be "controversial?".....since it EXISTS....and has for, I dunno, the beginning of time?

Then, there are people who have divided themselves into certain religious sections. Again, for eons.....so what is your point again?

[LocalPlanner]

In the planning world, you run into folks who can't fathom why people would choose to buy their home 25-30 miles from the Loop. In other, east-and-west-coast-type cities, it's often explained that it's people wanting to afford a single family house. That doesn't apply in Houston. Yet these other planners want to apply it here - because either they don't understand or aren't willing to understand that there are other things driving the housing market. The idea that vast masses of educated people might be willing to spend more on their house and commute farther - adding huge financial costs to their lives - in order to avoid having their kids in the same classroom as lower-income kids either doesn't compute to them or is so appalling to them that they won't consider it. Anything I could do to help them understand this via research (either anecdotal as I'm doing here or in a more "academic" form) would be helpful.