The Flood City (Houston, Austin, Mansfield: fit in, loan, tornado)

[Failed Engineer]

It’s a pretty simple explanation. Raised houses cost more, and one off builders don’t get their money back raising a home, no matter the neighborhood. You’ll only find raised homes where they’ve been flooded multiple time like Meyerland and the owner can afford it or a buyer specifically asks for it on their own lot.

Until the market has demand for and will pay a premium for these homes, it won’t happen. I think it doesn’t have much to do with whether people think they are ugly.

The other way raised homes will become common is if flood insurance premiums reflect actual risk. But I don’t see that happening . The current model disproportionately assigns risk to the government as it applies to Houston.

[Fight Red Light]

This one may have a future in Houston then:

[kemahkami]

Originally Posted by kittyhawk

Arguing that Miami is safer from floods than Houston is a fools errand. If you live anywhere on the US coast from Brownsville to North Carolina, you are going to be vulnerable to tropical weather systems dropping copious amounts of rainfall in a short amount of time. Houston has the recency effect of Harvey and some events that are fresh in everyone's mind. But don't think for one minute that New Orleans, Miami, Mobile, Tampa, Jacksonville are safer. This is part of the reason Houston is in the situation it's in now...they were major-flood free for 15+ years and everyone forgot that things should not be built in flood plains. Even now, developers are getting permits to built in flood plains which is pure insanity. All the coastal cities have the same problem.

That's the thing though, these Houston flood aren't just occurring with tropical cyclones, we're still seeing them from basic spring storms.

You also aren't accounting for the differences between flooding caused by heavy-rains and poorly-drained grounds vs flooding caused by sea-level spills.

Also, Houston's "drainage" is not any worse than these other places. In fact, it's probably far superior in most cases. However, if you drop 4 inches of rain per hour for multiple hours over any place in the US, it's going to flood. People who say that Houston floods all the time with very little rain are misinformed.

The comparison with drainage refers not to the built infrastructure, but rather the natural geologic challenges Houston has. With little area of large waterfront, and thick clay soils, heavy-rain flood events can prolong in this city compared to other areas.

[Fight Red Light]

Memorial residents may want to add another scenario: man-made disaster...

[gwarnecke]

In parts of the Buffalo Bayou watershed that were flooded by the reservoir releases, nearly all if not all teardown/reconstruction activity includes significantly elevated homes - whether or not the homes in question are located in the 500-year floodplain and thus legally require elevation (in the Buffalo Bayou watershed, an extremely small number of homes are located in the 100-year floodplain, unlike the case in, say, the Brays Bayou watershed).

Whether or not elevation is legally required, people spending $1+ million on their new homes are not willing to accept a substantial flood risk. Houston residents who are laying out their own $ have gotten the memo. I'm not sure if our city government has - they continue to approve ridiculous infill projects built in floodplains (Pine Crest golf course redevelopment, Stanley Park project, etc). I hope these scumbags don't manage to sell a single unit.

[cBach]

Originally Posted by gwarnecke

In parts of the Buffalo Bayou watershed that were flooded by the reservoir releases, nearly all if not all teardown/reconstruction activity includes significantly elevated homes - whether or not the homes in question are located in the 500-year floodplain and thus legally require elevation (in the Buffalo Bayou watershed, an extremely small number of homes are located in the 100-year floodplain, unlike the case in, say, the Brays Bayou watershed).

Whether or not elevation is legally required, people spending $1+ million on their new homes are not willing to accept a substantial flood risk. Houston residents who are laying out their own $ have gotten the memo. I'm not sure if our city government has - they continue to approve ridiculous infill projects built in floodplains (Pine Crest golf course redevelopment, Stanley Park project, etc). I hope these scumbags don't manage to sell a single unit.

My sister lives along Buffalo Bayou and got 4 feet of flooding. She tore her home down and rebuilt her new home 3 feet above the original grade. She slants the lot so basically her lot is higher than the others and it drains around the edges.

Just last week the street flooded again (chronic flooding here, not just tropical storms/hurricanes) and a neighbor that had flooded in Harvey got flooded again. She was high and dry, even her garage. Her garage is 2 feet above base grade, enough to be safe too, with a sloped driveway.

Her foundation is basically slab, it's just a very high slab, lots of concrete so it cost more. But she has the $$$. Both her and her hubby work in the O&G industry.

They were not going to take another risk...

I also advised them when they were going to rebuild. Originally she just wanted to elevate 18" but I said nope, go for 3'. I figured another Harvey level event of 4'+ is unlikely to happen soon and if it does, it's probably time for her to move from that neighborhood.

[kittyhawk]

Originally Posted by ScrappyJoe

That's the thing though, these Houston flood aren't just occurring with tropical cyclones, we're still seeing them from basic spring storms.

You also aren't accounting for the differences between flooding caused by heavy-rains and poorly-drained grounds vs flooding caused by sea-level spills.



The comparison with drainage refers not to the built infrastructure, but rather the natural geologic challenges Houston has. With little area of large waterfront, and thick clay soils, heavy-rain flood events can prolong in this city compared to other areas.

If you're calling 10 inches of rain in less than 4 hours a "basic spring storm", then OK..many tropical cyclones don't have that kind of impact. That kind of rainfall rate is a significant event that would cause road and likely some structure flooding in any US city regardless of soil type or storm water drainage efficiency. Tax Day 2016 was one of your "basic spring storms" that flooded the area in and around Brenham. Brenham has less clay content in their soil and has no waterfront drainage. It flooded because it rained too hard, too fast. We are obviously seeing those kinds of events more frequently than we did for the last 50 years.


I'm not arguing that Houston doesn't have issues with flooding and needs to adapt or be left behind. But if you are saying that it's worse off than other places based on the amount of rainfall it can handle, I'd disagree.

[kemahkami]

Originally Posted by kittyhawk

If you're calling 10 inches of rain in less than 4 hours a "basic spring storm", then OK..many tropical cyclones don't have that kind of impact. That kind of rainfall rate is a significant event that would cause road and likely some structure flooding in any US city regardless of soil type or storm water drainage efficiency. Tax Day 2016 was one of your "basic spring storms" that flooded the area in and around Brenham. Brenham has less clay content in their soil and has no waterfront drainage. It flooded because it rained too hard, too fast. We are obviously seeing those kinds of events more frequently than we did for the last 50 years.

Brenham definitely still has that heavy clay fraction, more than enough to slow the drainage.

And as for waterfront, a small/non-existent presence is exactly what makes heavy-rain flooding worse. We can see this just with Houston's Buffalo Bayou: that dog park upstream will flood over for the nth time, whereas the wider downstream along the Ship Channel goes through little fanfare.

But if you are saying that it's worse off than other places based on the amount of rainfall it can handle, I'd disagree.

Again, not in terms of infrastructure. But definitely in terms of natural geography compared to some other areas.

[Justabystander]

Originally Posted by cBach

My sister lives along Buffalo Bayou and got 4 feet of flooding. She tore her home down and rebuilt her new home 3 feet above the original grade. She slants the lot so basically her lot is higher than the others and it drains around the edges.

Just last week the street flooded again (chronic flooding here, not just tropical storms/hurricanes) and a neighbor that had flooded in Harvey got flooded again. She was high and dry, even her garage. Her garage is 2 feet above base grade, enough to be safe too, with a sloped driveway.

Her foundation is basically slab, it's just a very high slab, lots of concrete so it cost more. But she has the $$$. Both her and her hubby work in the O&G industry.

They were not going to take another risk...

I also advised them when they were going to rebuild. Originally she just wanted to elevate 18" but I said nope, go for 3'. I figured another Harvey level event of 4'+ is unlikely to happen soon and if it does, it's probably time for her to move from that neighborhood.

I find all this interesting. We almost moved to Houston, my wife had a position waiting for her with a gas and oil company, but my job was the problem. This is no way to live, waiting for the next big flood and how bad it is going to get. Three feet higher than the rest of the neighborhood? This is going to look funny if every other house does this, with dire consequences for the ones that do not.

[Jack Lance]

Originally Posted by cBach

My sister lives along Buffalo Bayou and got 4 feet of flooding. She tore her home down and rebuilt her new home 3 feet above the original grade. She slants the lot so basically her lot is higher than the others and it drains around the edges.

Just last week the street flooded again (chronic flooding here, not just tropical storms/hurricanes) and a neighbor that had flooded in Harvey got flooded again. She was high and dry, even her garage. Her garage is 2 feet above base grade, enough to be safe too, with a sloped driveway.

Her foundation is basically slab, it's just a very high slab, lots of concrete so it cost more. But she has the $$$. Both her and her hubby work in the O&G industry.

They were not going to take another risk...

I also advised them when they were going to rebuild. Originally she just wanted to elevate 18" but I said nope, go for 3'. I figured another Harvey level event of 4'+ is unlikely to happen soon and if it does, it's probably time for her to move from that neighborhood.

There were houses flooded by Buffalo Bayou last week ? Really ? I guess your sister really likes Houston and feels whatever comes her way is worth it...