Just got an automated call. Huntsville Public may switch to school uniforms next year. (office, best)

[skinem]

As far as cost goes, what we found that a similar uniform code cost more for boys over the course of a school year, but it cost less for girls. Most guys just would wear to school jeans or shorts and a t-shirt, so the cost of khakis and polo shirts were more.
But, for the average girl, it cut down on the number of outfits required and costs were much more in line with what the average female student would buy any way. Your mileage may vary.

One thing that was funny was that of course there was wailing and gnashing of teeth from the students ("Your taking away my individuality!" Really? Clothes is what does it, huh?) and some parents--usually a mother who was waaaay too socially conscious and just horrified that little Tiffany couldn't wear the latest fashions and was going to be traumatized for life because of it. But after it was in effect I literally had students, mostly female, that would come up to me looking over both shoulders and say in a low voice--"Thanks. I like this better."

What they were referring to was the pressure, apparently big with some folks, again, girls mostly, to wear the right label, the right fashion. There was also quite a few who said it made getting ready in the morning much faster and easier because there was no question or pondering what to wear today. And one thing that surprised me, there were several that said they like having the pressure off to wear fashions that they felt were too revealing or trashy.

High school age kids obviously, and of course I don't want to give the impression that everybody loved it because they didn't. But it went better and was more accepted and easily accepted than anticipated. We figured much of that was due to the groundwork we'd laid before implementing the policy and actually listening to and using community feedback. And of course, more of the kids actually kind of welcomed it than I would have ever thought. Again, not all. Because, to teenagers individuality is very important. They all want to be different, just like everyone else...

One thing our district did to help offset costs was to set up a "store" where people who had bought uniforms didn't need them any more and would give them back to the school. We'd wash them, and sell them at a much, much discounted price. Personally, I kept waiting for the district to get sued over the entire thing as the supreme court has held in the past that each student is entitled to a free and public education. Key word being free. Mandating uniforms to attend that kind of makes it not free. To my knowledge, there's never been a case concerning school uniforms. A lot over dress codes involving free speech, but none over school uniforms.

[the_huntsville]

Originally Posted by 33458

There will be a poll conducted tomorrow evening, by phone, between 7:00-8:30 pm.

I am neither for or against. We are individualistic enough that I do not fear my daughter turning in to a number, simply because she wears navy blue for 6 out of 24...BUT, my gripe would be against a monopoly; when sources are limited to (only) buying through the school, as there seems to be a dramatic cost increase, while experiencing an equally noticeable decrease in merchandise quality.

Any opinions as to why Huntsville might be "considering" uniforms? I hadn't noticed the dress codes being so terribly broken, but I'm looking at Elementary.

Pants on the ground, much?

Most likely when HHA's plan of decentralizing poverty into middle class/upscale neighborhoods takes shape. Is the reasoning behind all of this. Are we ready for "kriss kross"(remember them?) styled clothes in schools in Jones Valley & South Huntsville, and soon Hampton Cove?

[hey teach]

A few years ago I worked in a system that required uniforms for all students. The uniforms varied from school to school in terms of color and some style. Basically it was slacks (tan, khaki, navy) and oxford button up or golf style shirts. Each school had their own color combos. The Catholic schools in our district chose the plaid jumpers, shorts, skirts. The schools would sponsor a uniform re-sell day so good quality uniforms could be sold or passed on to others when they had been outgrown or the student had moved on to another school. if If parents took care of the clothes they could get some return on their investment.

As a teacher I am at the top of the "yes" group. Some of the clothing my students wear is absolutely inappropriate, even though it is within the dress code. Too tight, too skimpy, offensive statements on the front, too big.

Uniforms will not remedy all of these problems. Only parents can prevent their child from dressing inappropriately.

[33458]

I never got that second call. No questionnaire, just the advanced warning. Did ANYBODY get polled either Thursday or Friday night?

[LCTMadison]

One thing to consider.....at least this is how it is in Madison. I just wondered how this would impact the HSV system....

Madison requires PE uniforms, and just like "free and reduced" lunches, the city has to offer free and reduced uniforms. Even though these kids would have to have some form of athletic clothing to participate in dressing out, when the system mandates a uniform, then they have to offer those who cannot "afford" that uniform the option to apply for reduced prices or even free uniforms. Of course, these costs are paid for by the taxpayers out of school/state funds.

I have not been in an administrative position in a school, but I am assuming that would be the case with school wide uniforms? Skinem...what is your take on this? Would this further hinder or hurt the HSV system's problems with their budgets?

[skinem]

Originally Posted by LCTMadison

One thing to consider.....at least this is how it is in Madison. I just wondered how this would impact the HSV system....

Madison requires PE uniforms, and just like "free and reduced" lunches, the city has to offer free and reduced uniforms. Even though these kids would have to have some form of athletic clothing to participate in dressing out, when the system mandates a uniform, then they have to offer those who cannot "afford" that uniform the option to apply for reduced prices or even free uniforms. Of course, these costs are paid for by the taxpayers out of school/state funds.

I have not been in an administrative position in a school, but I am assuming that would be the case with school wide uniforms? Skinem...what is your take on this? Would this further hinder or hurt the HSV system's problems with their budgets?

You've got it right...they'll need to offer the uniforms in that fashion or get sued...and lose. I'm still waiting for someone who has enough money to afford all that schools ask parents to supply to sue under the grounds that citizens are guaranteed the right to a free and public education, you know, just on the principle. But who wants to look that cheap?

I'm not familiar enough with their budget to know for sure, it could hurt, but maybe not. Their budget is large enough that this issue shouldn't impact it much. It also might be mitigated by the contract they reach with their uniform suppliers. It's possible, but not likely, that they could reach an agreement that the company supply a certain percentage of free uniforms, or discount them. Most school district contracts vary quite a bit. However, school uniforms in public school isn't the novelty it was 10 years ago, and it's been 5 years since I've been in that business. 5 years ago the clothing companies were getting more uniform (ahem) with their contracts and giving less away. Since the demand has increased, I don't expect they've gotten any more generous.

[friday13]

Originally Posted by skinem

It's possible, but not likely, that they could reach an agreement that the company supply a certain percentage of free uniforms, or discount them.

I can turn this around and say 'It is possible, even likely, the freebies or discounted come out of the full-paying parents wallet, one dollar at a time' . Who knows that that uniform set isn't $17.50 instead of $19 I'm being charged? Who is in any for-profit business to lose deliberately? No one, but the parents who would pay anything for their darlings' education (me included).

[skinem]

Originally Posted by friday13

I can turn this around and say 'It is possible, even likely, the freebies or discounted come out of the full-paying parents wallet, one dollar at a time' .

That's a given.

But, don't forget, not just the "full-paying parents" are carrying the freight, it's the tax payers, including those without children in the system.

[33458]

Was anyone here polled? Really, please, somebody answer me.

I think it's odd that the school administration would make a determination based on parental input, if the public were not actually polled as it has been presented.

I got the initial call, to tell me a second would be forthcoming. But I never got that second call.
I would like to know if anyone else was...accidentally...overlooked.

[skinem]

Originally Posted by 33458

Was anyone here polled? Really, please, somebody answer me.

I think it's odd that the school administration would make a determination based on parental input, if the public were not actually polled as it has been presented.

I got the initial call, to tell me a second would be forthcoming. But I never got that second call.
I would like to know if anyone else was...accidentally...overlooked.

If you have opinions you're wishing to express, don't wait for the phone call, call the central office and let them know what you think about it. If you don't know who to ask for, ask for the superintendent's secretary or office. That's the best way to get a message to the superintendent if you can't talk to them directly.