Spokane Or Coeur D Alene (Coeur d'Alene, Sandpoint: versus, stats, moving)

[LIDALA]

We moved from Southern California to the Northwest to get away from crime (or so I had thought). Sadly, the number of violent crimes (rape) in Spokane, Coeur d'Alene, Portland, Boise, Seattle, etc. are ASTRONOMICALLY high compared to similar sized communities in Orange County (CA). Why is this? Are the laws not tough enough and people feel they can get away with these types of crimes? Do the police not make protecting women and children a high priority? It's very scary...

[Sage of Sagle]

Interesting comment on relative crime rates...I just pulled some stats online for a bunch of cities that are hot topics on this forum...

In rape, the PNW large cities are indeed very high. But let's compare other stats that affect perceived quality of life....the overall violent crime rate among cities....per 100,000 population...since being shot, stabbed, or actually killed should be of equal or greater threat that forcible rape, as bad as that is of course....

Anaheim: 249
Fontana: 269
Fresno: 373
Fremont: 128
Garden Grove: 190
Huntington Beach: 96
Irvine: 34
Lancaster: 494
Long Beach: 347
Los Angeles (city): 374
Oceanside: 266
Palmdale: 344
Riverside: 340
Sacramento: 628 (no, this isn't a typo)
San Bernadino: 519
San Diego: 245
San Francisco: 442
San Jose: 194
Santa Ana: 271
Santa Clarita: 124
Simi Valley: 79
Stockton: 776 (wow!)

So let's compare some other cities....

Boise: 193
Seattle: 345
Spokane: 290
Portland: 336

So bigger cities still have crime, but you are PERSONALLY not at an extremely high risk of violent crime compared to SoCal cities per se...

Now let's look at smaller cities in OR and WA:

Eugene (OR): 90
Bellevue (WA): 82 (better than even Simi Valley!)

Let's look state by state:

ID: 247
WA: 348
OR: 287
CA: 523
NV: 606
AZ: 513
TX: 529
US average: 463

So if you're looking state by state, combining major cities with all the little towns we all live in that bring the crime average down, the PNW area is still VERY low compared to not only the US average, but other western states....

I understand that women would have a high degree of concerns about their safety in that regard, but equally important to women should be their odds of being shot, stabbed, or beaten, etc. And in that regard, the PNW area still rates pretty well...

[LIDALA]

Sage:

I realize there are many types of crime, but (rape) is a horrific crime that affects over 50% of the population, not to mention innocent children. As I stated before, I am from Southern California (Orange County) and I moved to the Northwest to get AWAY from crime. I was BEYOND SHOCKED to read the rape statistics for many cities in Washington, Idaho, and Oregon!!! I've listed a few statistics for cities that I'm familiar with (in Orange County, CA) compared to well known cities in the Northwest:


Coeur d'Alene, Idaho (population 39,375) - 32 rapes
versus
Aliso Viejo, California (population 41,743) - 3 rapes


Bremerton, WA (population 36,454) - 80 rapes
versus
Brea, California (population 38,778) - 2 rapes


Vancouver, WA (population 157,152) - 111 rapes
versus
Irvine, California (population 179,501) - 17 rapes
Orange, California (population 134,708) - 2 rapes
Mission Viejo, CA (population 96,892) - 3 rapes


Walla Walla, WA (population 30,682) - 64 rapes
versus
Laguna Niguel, CA (population 65,377) - 2 rapes


This is truly shocking!!! Why is this type of violent crime more prevelant in the Northwest? Are the laws not tough enough? Are there more s*x offenders lurking about the Northwest? What is being done (if anything) to put a halt to this??? I would love to get input in regard to these questions...

[mejaka]

what the difference is, but I'd consider a couple of things before accepting the stats at face value.

First, these aren't the figures for the number of rapes. They are the figures for the number of *reported* rapes. This can be meaningful in a few different ways.

Second, size isn't the only comparison between cities. Other things factor in. Demographics, level of tourism, any number of things can affect the crime level.

Can you link to the site or otherwise reference where your stats are coming from? I'd like to look into this a little.

[Sage of Sagle]

As a retired peace officer from LA, who grew up in south OC, I too am interested to know why the rape stats are high in the PNW region. More being reported? More predators? Or just a lot more date rape or reports of unwanted sexual contact? If "sexual assault" is being included in this stat versus a narrow definition of "unlawful penetration" that also skews stats state-by-state. For example, if CA separates the two, it would have a lower "rape" stat while having the same risk per se. I'll try to look further into it at my old department...

But LIDALA, I do hope you don't feel that I am in any way glossing over the issue of a woman being violated. But my time in law enforcement taught me that in a VERY GENERAL sense, there are very few actual sexual predators who will commit forcible rape, but an awful lot of people who will commit date rape, sexual assault in lesser forms, child molestation, etc. My point is that I'm VERY MUCH skeptical of seriously imbalanced statistics until I'm sure each state is reporting apples-to-apples which doesn't always happen.

In the area I worked, for example, over a couple year period we were really working with community watch in some bad parts of East LA to take a zero tolerance approach to letting crimes go unreported. But with this push came a reported skyrocketing of part 1 crimes (specifically vehicle burglary, grand theft) and a serious bump to reported vandalism crimes in this area that for 2-3 years really looked like an odd statistic.

So...in the PNW, are females raised to absolutely not tolerate even minor sexual misconduct and thus everything gets reported? Are the girls who go to Mexico on Spring Break from USC and UCLA who get raped not reporting it where the family unit support in the PNW region allows young women to have the confidence to report being victimized more readily?

My point is, there are a lot of factors at play about why the stats are that high in the PNW states, and it may not be what you think, or it COULD be. I certainly cannot make an assumption either way at this point. But the OVERALL violent crime index, which includes all methods and manners of crimes against the person, is a good indicator of the true "threat" to your person and well being and again, it's not scary compared to most states out west.

What I CAN tell you is that in Coeur d'Alene, for example, girls from families we know seem to feel just as safe walking down the streets even at night as they did in south OC. And in Sandpoint, you will see teen girls walking around after dark unmolested and not acting fearful. If someone in this town was accosting a young woman here, any one of us would give that person a beating they wouldn't soon forget.

[LIDALA]

SAGE:

I can only speculate as to why the violent crime (rape) rate is so high in the
Pacific Northwest. Maybe more women in the PNW report crimes or maybe these numbers are just the tip of the iceberg? It may have to do with a less educated (male) population in the PNW - compared to a more educated (male) population in Orange County, California? It could be that politicians and police departments in Orange County do not tolerate this barbaric type of criminal behavior and for (whatever reason) it is tolerated in the PNW? Who knows... Regardless of the reason, for the sake of the women and children of the Pacific Northwest - something needs to be done and SOON.

[Sage of Sagle]

We're in agreement there. Much in the way that sentencing enhancements are added to bangers acting in collusion with their gang, I think that rape needs to be something so far outside the "acceptable" behaviour (in the realm of criminal activity, of course), that it's socially unacceptable even for the criminal element to consider.

[LIDALA]

Sage:

Very well said!

[mejaka]

Still no reference for the stats?

[Sage of Sagle]

I was pulling some of my stats from:

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/prelim06/t4co_id.htm (broken link)