WTF?!?!?! Undocumented immigrant students will be eligible for California aid (drivers license, birth)

[HappyTexan]

Originally Posted by Eleanora1

They'll be given amnesty along with their criminal parents. That's the whole point of this bill: to allow illegals primarily from Latino countries to get American citizenship so that Jerry Brown and his ilk can pander for votes.

Well, Jerry Brown cannot grant citizenship; only the Fed Gov can.
And Obama just doesn't have the support in Congress.

So they do nothing and support "stealth amnesty" instead.

If I recall, the only way illegals can get "instant" citizenship is to serve in the military.

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by Eleanora1

I prefer not to hand them out to people who skip the immigration laws and cannot get a job here. That's what I prefer. I prefer not to tell the world that if they wait around long enough we'll give them handouts. Worse, we'll shortchange our own citizens in order to do so.

That's what I prefer.

They are not residents. And if they're eighteen or older they're criminals fully capable of going back home.

We can argue the semantics of whether they are illegal or unlawful or deportable and that.

But by any dictionary and normal meaning of the word they are residents. And they are almost certain to remain that.

What bills?

Illegals cost most middle class Americans money. This a perfect example. We're being taxed so a group of foreign nationals can get a free college degree. What an insult to every American taxpayer, legal immigrant and foreign student!

We could at least try to deport them...100 billion dollars and 10 years and maybe a lot more than that and failure at the end. But we could try. We as a people chose not to. I don't care you would like to...we don't.

Given that they will actually end up here with us for their adult life...the most likely outcome...it is perfectily reasonable to educate them as fully as possible so as to maximize their value to our society. Spend your money on the best and brightest...not the also rans.

The best and brightest don't skip immigration lines. They don't violate our laws. They don't demand that people in other countries cut their own education so they can get something for free. Let the people in question do the right thing. If they want to go to college here let them apply as foreign nationals.

Sure they do when not consulted. The children have no control good or bad over any of this.

When Americans read the illegals are literally DEMANDING a free college education I don't think the emotion that springs to mind is love or respect.

The children demand in the American way that they be treated fairly. Just like any other resident.

No they're not. They're foreign nationals. And how does a kid pay any taxes at all? More than half of all illegals are high school drop outs. You know this. They're not paying much in taxes. They're certainly not paying enough to offset the cost of a four year degree.

California schools are a mess right now. If Jerry Brown were a leader rather than someone pandering to the Hispanic lobby he would have focused on the needs of Californians rather than the desires of a largely Latino foreign national population.

Excellence should not involve skipping immigration lines. The whole world is not entitled to a free college education at American expense. I am sorry you apparently think otherwise.

The present value of any resident goes up strongly with education. At the graduate high school level they are roughly neutral. They will pay as much to the society as they cost. As they get college credentials their value vastly increases. If you want a capable young illegal to pay the most to the society you educate them as far past high school as you and they can. The better they do the more money they return to the society. YOu can of course educate them through the Phd and then send them to Brazil. Brazil will be glad and we will lose a great deal of value.

And yes they get to skip immigration lines. They are not in them...and there is no way they are going to be. We can ship them out. We can let them stay. But they are never going to join the Queue. That is how it is. Neither you nor I control it. And we don't get to vote on how we would like it to be...

[chicagonut]

Originally Posted by Eleanora1

I prefer not to hand them out to people who skip the immigration laws and cannot get a job here. That's what I prefer. I prefer not to tell the world that if they wait around long enough we'll give them handouts. Worse, we'll shortchange our own citizens in order to do so.

That's what I prefer.

They are not residents. And if they're eighteen or older they're criminals fully capable of going back home.



What bills?

Illegals cost most middle class Americans money. This a perfect example. We're being taxed so a group of foreign nationals can get a free college degree. What an insult to every American taxpayer, legal immigrant and foreign student!



The best and brightest don't skip immigration lines. They don't violate our laws. They don't demand that people in other countries cut their own education so they can get something for free. Let the people in question do the right thing. If they want to go to college here let them apply as foreign nationals.



When Americans read the illegals are literally DEMANDING a free college education I don't think the emotion that springs to mind is love or respect.



No they're not. They're foreign nationals. And how does a kid pay any taxes at all? More than half of all illegals are high school drop outs. You know this. They're not paying much in taxes. They're certainly not paying enough to offset the cost of a four year degree.



California schools are a mess right now. If Jerry Brown were a leader rather than someone pandering to the Hispanic lobby he would have focused on the needs of Californians rather than the desires of a largely Latino foreign national population.



Excellence should not involve skipping immigration lines. The whole world is not entitled to a free college education at American expense. I am sorry you apparently think otherwise.

The desperation of the pro-illegals never ceases to amaze me. Now all American college students are just dummies who are blondes with perky noses less deserving that an illegal alien student?

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by chicagonut

The desperation of the pro-illegals never ceases to amaze me. Now all American college students are just dummies who are blondes with perky noses less deserving that an illegal alien student?

You are into blonds with perky noses?

I prefer bright students with 4.0s and 140 IQs...whatever kind and status even illegal. I doubt perky noses will end up with very many patents. Maybe lots of sales though.

[Eleanora1]

Originally Posted by olecapt

We can argue the semantics of whether they are illegal or unlawful or deportable and that.

But by any dictionary and normal meaning of the word they are residents. And they are almost certain to remain that.

They're not deportable?

They're adults and they have no right to be here. They are illegal aliens not residents. That's not semantics. That's just the truth however much defenders of illegals like to pretend otherwise.

We could at least try to deport them...100 billion dollars and 10 years and maybe a lot more than that and failure at the end. But we could try. We as a people chose not to. I don't care you would like to...we don't.

Or we could stop handing them free college degrees. That's an easy fix. We need to stop providing them with incentives to stay, let alone incentives most natives don't have. When you do that all you do is encourage more illegal immigration.

Given that they will actually end up here with us for their adult life...the most likely outcome...it is perfectily reasonable to educate them as fully as possible so as to maximize their value to our society. Spend your money on the best and brightest...not the also rans.

So amnesty and free college tuition for illegals! Yeah. There's a winning plaform.

Americans don't want them here. We sure as hell don't want to provide them with a free college degree. It is perfectly reasonable to ask them to leave.

The best and brightest do not skip our immigration lines nor do they ask for things we don't gave to our own citizens.

Sure they do when not consulted. The children have no control good or bad over any of this.

An eighteen year old is not a child. And Americans were not consulted when and their parents came here in flagrant violation of our immigration laws. We should have to the right to deport them, not be asked to pay for the college degrees.

The children demand in the American way that they be treated fairly. Just like any other resident.

How is this fair to legal immigrants or foreign students? The American way is to obey our immigration laws, not demand special benefit for violating them. They are NOT children. A 21 year old is an adult. Fairness should be treating him like one.

We've been incredibly fair to them. We even educate them even though they're not supposed to be here. Are we thanked? No. Of course not. Instead we're asked for even more.

The present value of any resident goes up strongly with education. At the graduate high school level they are roughly neutral. They will pay as much to the society as they cost. As they get college credentials their value vastly increases. If you want a capable young illegal to pay the most to the society you educate them as far past high school as you and they can. The better they do the more money they return to the society. YOu can of course educate them through the Phd and then send them to Brazil. Brazil will be glad and we will lose a great deal of value.

They are not residents. They can't even legally get a job. Most AMERICANS do not have a college degree. Why are we supposed to provide one for foreigners, let alone for without cost?

I want the illegal to go home. I want his parents to leave with him. I want him to stay home and not come here in the first place when he's 5 and his idiot parents bring him here without permission.

Handing out free education is not the way to accomplish that goal. All you're doing is encouraging even MORE illegals to come here. That's not what most Americans want.

And yes they get to skip immigration lines. They are not in them...and there is no way they are going to be. We can ship them out. We can let them stay. But they are never going to join the Queue. That is how it is. Neither you nor I control it. And we don't get to vote on how we would like it to be...

I love how you're perfectly okay with telling American citizens we should literally have no say in how our tax dollars are spent.



Can I demand the same thing of Mexicans? I'd like them to work harder so my three kids can get a free college degree. I'd like a phd. I'll move to Mexico and demand one right now!

Give them free degrees and you'll only get more illegals. That's an idiotic policy, let alone when we're in the middle of a huge economic crisis.

That's the midset of the illegal lobby and their supporters. They believe illegals are literally entitled to things Americans aren't up to and including a free college degree. And then they wonder why the American public hates them . . .

[Eleanora1]

Originally Posted by olecapt

You are into blonds with perky noses?

I prefer bright students with 4.0s and 140 IQs...whatever kind and status even illegal. I doubt perky noses will end up with very many patents. Maybe lots of sales though.

I prefer students who obey our immigration laws. Most illegals are hardly in the very high IQ category anyway. If a handful of extremely bright foreign nationals want to apply for a scholarship and a college degree here then let them. That's what many people across the globe do right now when they agree to follow our laws. But it should NOT be an automatic policy to hand out a free degree to illegals just because they can get into college.

Brown is not looking to invite the best and brightest here. He's just pandering to the Latino lobby. Gil "one bill" Cedillo only cares about illegals because 80% share his ethnicity. He's not about justice for all, let alone justice for the American taxpayers he's supposed to represent.

[btownboss4]

Well MA isn't going that way, we don't have instate tuition.

[chicagonut]

Originally Posted by Eleanora1

I prefer students who obey our immigration laws. Most illegals are hardly in the very high IQ category anyway. If a handful of extremely bright foreign nationals want to apply for a scholarship and a college degree here then let them. That's what many people across the globe do right now when they agree to follow our laws. But it should NOT be an automatic policy to hand out a free degree to illegals just because they can get into college.

Brown is not looking to invite the best and brightest here. He's just pandering to the Latino lobby. Gil "one bill" Cedillo only cares about illegals because 80% share his ethnicity. He's not about justice for all, let alone justice for the American taxpayers he's supposed to represent.

Yeah, it's impossible for any blondes with perky noses to have any college potential, right? They all have to be homely I guess to have any intelligence. Can these remarks by the pro-illegals get any more bizzare or desperate?

What they also fail to acknowledge is if legalized after college they will be competing directly with Americans for jobs. Yeah, that's all we need with millions of Americans out of work.

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by Eleanora1

They're not deportable?

They're adults and they have no right to be here. They are illegal aliens not residents. That's not semantics. That's just the truth however much defenders of illegals like to pretend otherwise.

Bullsh*t. They are residents. They may also be unlawful and deportable. Then again virtually anyone not a US citizen is deportable.

Or we could stop handing them free college degrees. That's an easy fix. We need to stop providing them with incentives to stay, let alone incentives most natives don't have. When you do that all you do is encourage more illegal immigration.

Sure we could. Don't have to give anyone a free college degree. I would think though we would give them to the best and brightest if anyone. You prefer we give them to the perky nosed?

So amnesty and free college tuition for illegals! Yeah. There's a winning plaform.

Americans don't want them here. We sure as hell don't want to provide them with a free college degree. It is perfectly reasonable to ask them to leave.

The best and brightest do not skip our immigration lines nor do they ask for things we don't gave to our own citizens.

They have nothing to do with your immigration lines. That is their parents problem not theirs. They violated no law to get here.

An eighteen year old is not a child. And Americans were not consulted when and their parents came here in flagrant violation of our immigration laws. We should have to the right to deport them, not be asked to pay for the college degrees.

Sure we can deport them. That of course makes no sense but we could do it. Why would we want to deport an exceptional student? You can't understand that that is stupid?

How is this fair to legal immigrants or foreign students? The American way is to obey our immigration laws, not demand special benefit for violating them. They are NOT children. A 21 year old is an adult. Fairness should be treating him like one.

We've been incredibly fair to them. We even educate them even though they're not supposed to be here. Are we thanked? No. Of course not. Instead we're asked for even more.



They are not residents. They can't even legally get a job. Most AMERICANS do not have a college degree. Why are we supposed to provide one for foreigners, let alone for without cost?

I want the illegal to go home. I want his parents to leave with him. I want him to stay home and not come here in the first place when he's 5 and his idiot parents bring him here without permission.

Handing out free education is not the way to accomplish that goal. All you're doing is encouraging even MORE illegals to come here. That's not what most Americans want.

I would agree that stopping illegal immigration is a desirable goal. It is too bad you antis insist upon letting continue.

We would not have these discussion about education if your side would get its head straight and help us stop the illegals coming here. But you won't. YOu are fixated on removing the ones already here. Which is not going to happen. So you will allow all the new arrivals.

I love how you're perfectly okay with telling American citizens we should literally have no say in how our tax dollars are spent.



Can I demand the same thing of Mexicans? I'd like them to work harder so my three kids can get a free college degree. I'd like a phd. I'll move to Mexico and demand one right now!

Give them free degrees and you'll only get more illegals. That's an idiotic policy, let alone when we're in the middle of a huge economic crisis.

That's the midset of the illegal lobby and their supporters. They believe illegals are literally entitled to things Americans aren't up to and including a free college degree. And then they wonder why the American public hates them . . .

You simply have lost track of reality. Residents pay taxes and get services. Citizens get to vote.

You really need to learn the difference.

We should have fixed all this in the 1980s. We did not. Now it haunts us. But the fact you don't like it will get us very little mileage.

In the mean time we should take good care of the children who grow up here. And we should take particular care of the best and brightness.

Hey maybe we can make a deal with Mexico to send them the ones who don't get out of high school. Trade for the ones we want to keep. We could pay the Mexicans a substantial amount to take our non achievers and end up ahead.

[IBMMuseum]

Originally Posted by chicagonut

Yeah, it's impossible for any blondes with perky noses to have any college potential, right? They all have to be homely I guess to have any intelligence. Can these remarks by the pro-illegals get any more bizzare or desperate?...

You were the one talking bad about Shakira...



Isn't that nose perky enough for you?...