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Old 02-18-2023, 08:39 AM
 
6,632 posts, read 4,307,298 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
Dividend yields are irrelevant because they are part of the withdrawal rate and hence the withdrawal amount .

If you are drawing 40k from a million dollar portfolio how much is interest , dividends , rmds or appreciation is irrelevant… it can all come from appreciation and it wouldn’t matter or change a thing .

All that matters is totaled up it doesn’t exceed 40k first year..that is because total return doesn’t care how it is made up …it’s all the same whether dividends , appreciation or a combo of the two.

It’s total return and total withdrawals that determine things as well as sequences and inflation
How many times will you have to say this?
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Old 02-18-2023, 08:42 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizap View Post
How many times will you have to say this?
For such a simple concept few actually seem to grasp it so it just won’t die
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Old 02-19-2023, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Sputnik Planitia
7,829 posts, read 11,792,339 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
For such a simple concept few actually seem to grasp it so it just won’t die
I know total returns are the only thing that matters whether dividends are paid out or not is irrelevant - I think this has been clarified even if a large number of people DO NOT believe this and think dividends are somehow "extra" free money.

What I am clarifying is something else entirely - i.e. in the 70s what was the source of the dividends. Since those payouts can come from debt or profits. In the 70s robust wage growth perhaps drove profitability, today we are not sure if this wage growth will materialize and can the question is whether inflation can stick around without wage growth since that will drive demand destruction and less profitability.
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Old 02-19-2023, 02:26 PM
 
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The high dividends in the 1970s were not from high payouts but from their relationship to low stock prices .

The more a stock price falls the higher the same dividend becomes .

Dividends in the Great Depression were running 14% because prices fell so much.
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Old 02-21-2023, 06:04 PM
 
Location: Sputnik Planitia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
The high dividends in the 1970s were not from high payouts but from their relationship to low stock prices .

The more a stock price falls the higher the same dividend becomes .

Dividends in the Great Depression were running 14% because prices fell so much.
ah yes, you're right since it's a percentage. Did not take that into account.
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Old 02-22-2023, 01:25 AM
 
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Exactly .

The div increases don’t always reflect rising dividend payouts .

in a down market they can reflect falling stock prices .

It just means the mandatory withdrawals one gets are a larger percentage of the stocks value…

Some payouts in the Great Depression had popular stocks falling as much as 14% in price from the payouts alone on top of the markets sliding

Last edited by mathjak107; 02-22-2023 at 01:52 AM..
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Old 02-23-2023, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Sputnik Planitia
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Fact or Myth: High Dividend paying stocks have outperformed their non-dividend paying peers? I think this is FALSE. There are so many pro Dividend YouTube videos out there, the dividend investing thing has essentially become a craze right now. It is only here that we discussed the reality of this phenomenon.



This video makes nonsensical statements - more knowledge is required to sell shares? Why? You can just sell the same proportion of shares to generate income, in fact you can control the timing of the sale to suit your cashflow needs which makes dividend investing and the forced sale that comes with it to be a poor choice.
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Old 02-23-2023, 01:40 PM
 
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This is why these myths don’t die . They just keep parroting poor information
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Old 02-23-2023, 01:54 PM
 
Location: Victory Mansions, Airstrip One
6,762 posts, read 5,061,212 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k374 View Post
Fact or Myth: High Dividend paying stocks have outperformed their non-dividend paying peers?
Well, I certainly wouldn't base my investing on some random YouTube video. However...

There are a number of studies that found dividend payers, or at least dividend payers with certain characteristics, to have had higher returns than non-dividend payers. Here's one from JP Morgan:

https://thefalconmethod.com/steps-of...DENDS-2013.pdf


And here are some older ones from Tweedy Browne:

https://tweedy.com/resources/library...UND2014Web.pdf

https://tweedy.com/resources/library...und%202021.pdf


If you want more, you can read books by David Dreman and James O'Shaughnessy.
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Old 02-23-2023, 01:58 PM
 
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Stocks are really going to be based on individual situations….I wouldn’t generalize anymore about any one type having better returns .

But in either case it’s still going to be about total returns.

In fact at this point I don’t want to own individual stocks as a core investment….I much prefer diversified funds and eliminating individual company risk
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