Question in regards to Ask a Jew thread (Jehovah, believe, Bible)
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I have been searching for a forum where I can ask a few people from the Jewish Faith some questions. I finally found one with people in it that actually like to answer questions and it has been closed.
I am hoping those same people would be willing to answer a few of my questions, based on what they posted in that forum. I know its probably been lost so i will reference their comment before I ask my question.
For the record I am very Pro-Israel and Jewish and believe without a shadow of a doubt that Jews are G-d's chosen people and salvation for all humanity comes from the Jews.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovejazz That's an excellent question.
The whole subject of a messiah is different. The Jewish messiah will be a great man, but that man will be very much human, and we are still obligated to worship only G-d, and not any man, including the messiah.
For us to recognize the messiah, all of the prophecies must come true.
The messiah will not tell people to pray through him to get to G-d, which is the teaching of Jesus. Again, Jews pray directly to G-d, with no intermediaries.
The messiah will be a descendant of David. However, the Christian messiah had no biological father.
The word "alma" is the Hebrew word for young woman. Unfortunately, when the Torah was translated into Greek, the word was mistranslated into virgin. This means that mortals were impregnated by gods, and the Jewish messiah will descend from human parents via sexual intercourse.
The basis of Jewish belief is the sh'ma, which says that G-d is One. Thus, G-d cannot be composed of three parts (the trinity) or of two parts (the messiah and G-d).
There are many more reasons, but these are just a few.
Hope this helps.
There are a few things I would like to address individually in this post or following posts.
1. The Messiah
The correct interpretation of scriptures, mainly New Testament I confess, is that Jesus is fully G-d and fully man. The problem comes into play when you hear people talking about a trinity, or 3 persons in 1 G-d. Which as you already pointed out, is NOT the case.
The reason why Jesus was fully G-d is only because it was G-d in Him.
You know and believe that G-d is a Spirit and cannot be seen. Being a Spirit you must also worship Him in Spirit.
Until Jesus, G-d was never seen before with exception of a few descriptions that could of been G-d (Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego in the fiery furnace comes to mind). Until G-d walked with us in the flesh, He came to a few people in an Angelic forms (i.e. In the tent with Abraham, wrestling with Jacob and a burning bush).
The best definition of who Jesus was is located in 1 Timothy 3:16 (sorry I know its New Testament)
Quote:
1 Timothy 3:16 - And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: G-d was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Jesus wasn't a second God, or second person of a holy 'trinity' - He WAS G-d. He was Abba, Jehovah-Savior. G-d promised to atone for our Sins. Jesus became the Sacrificial Lamb for the atonement for all our sins.
G-d's name is Jesus - throughout Scriptures we read a few of the Names of G-d
Quote:
Jehovah Nissi (The Lord My Banner)
Jehovah-Raah (The Lord My Shepherd)
Jehovah Rapha (The Lord That Heals)
Jehovah Shammah (The Lord Is There)
Jehovah Tsidkenu (The Lord Our Righteousness)
Jehovah Mekoddishkem (The Lord Who Sanctifies You)
El Olam (The Everlasting God)
Elohim (God)
Qanna (Jealous)
Jehovah Jireh (The Lord Will Provide)
Jehovah Shalom (The Lord Is Peace)
Jehovah Sabaoth (The Lord of Hosts)
We can now add one Jehovah Savior.
You say 'Messiah will be a man' - true! Jesus was fully man, having to endure every temptation and trial that we go through, even today. He was a man that was guided by G-d's Holy Spirit to teach and show who the Almighty was. Because, like I said He was not known before this.
G-d manifested Himself into Jesus - wrapped His Spirit in flesh so that He could atone for our sins through this Sacrificial Lamb.
G-d presented this man, Jesus, as a place where atonement by the Messiah's blood would occur through faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because he had waited patiently to deal with sins committed in the past.
Jesus never said pray to Him. He said 'When you ask anything of my Father in my Name. It will be given to you'
Why did He say this? Because G-d's name is Jesus - Jehovah-Savior. Jesus isn't the man that walked the Earth, it is the name of the Spirit, the G-d inside of that man.
Isaiah 52:6 states: "Therefore My people shall know My name; therefore in that day I am the one who is speaking, ‘Here I am.’”
We can now say that His name is Jesus, Yeshua.
I didn't expect this post to be this long. I'll reserve my other questions in another post.
One more thing about Messiah being from the linage of David:
Mary, the mother of Jesus, was of the tribe of Judah and the lineage of David (Psalm 132:11; Luke 1:32). She was connected by marriage with Elisabeth, who was of the lineage of Aaron (Luke 1:36).
I don't understand your posting, at all. It sounds like a case for worshiping Jesus. Is this what you want Jews (I'm Jewish, by the way) to respond to?
I have been searching for a forum where I can ask a few people from the Jewish Faith some questions. I finally found one with people in it that actually like to answer questions and it has been closed.
I am hoping those same people would be willing to answer a few of my questions, based on what they posted in that forum. I know its probably been lost so i will reference their comment before I ask my question.
For the record I am very Pro-Israel and Jewish and believe without a shadow of a doubt that Jews are G-d's chosen people and salvation for all humanity comes from the Jews.
There are a few things I would like to address individually in this post or following posts.
1. The Messiah
The correct interpretation of scriptures, mainly New Testament I confess, is that Jesus is fully G-d and fully man. The problem comes into play when you hear people talking about a trinity, or 3 persons in 1 G-d. Which as you already pointed out, is NOT the case.
The reason why Jesus was fully G-d is only because it was G-d in Him.
You know and believe that G-d is a Spirit and cannot be seen. Being a Spirit you must also worship Him in Spirit.
Until Jesus, G-d was never seen before with exception of a few descriptions that could of been G-d (Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego in the fiery furnace comes to mind). Until G-d walked with us in the flesh, He came to a few people in an Angelic forms (i.e. In the tent with Abraham, wrestling with Jacob and a burning bush).
The best definition of who Jesus was is located in 1 Timothy 3:16 (sorry I know its New Testament)
Jesus wasn't a second God, or second person of a holy 'trinity' - He WAS G-d. He was Abba, Jehovah-Savior. G-d promised to atone for our Sins. Jesus became the Sacrificial Lamb for the atonement for all our sins.
G-d's name is Jesus - throughout Scriptures we read a few of the Names of G-d We can now add one Jehovah Savior.
You say 'Messiah will be a man' - true! Jesus was fully man, having to endure every temptation and trial that we go through, even today. He was a man that was guided by G-d's Holy Spirit to teach and show who the Almighty was. Because, like I said He was not known before this.
G-d manifested Himself into Jesus - wrapped His Spirit in flesh so that He could atone for our sins through this Sacrificial Lamb.
G-d presented this man, Jesus, as a place where atonement by the Messiah's blood would occur through faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because he had waited patiently to deal with sins committed in the past.
Jesus never said pray to Him. He said 'When you ask anything of my Father in my Name. It will be given to you'
Why did He say this? Because G-d's name is Jesus - Jehovah-Savior. Jesus isn't the man that walked the Earth, it is the name of the Spirit, the G-d inside of that man.
Isaiah 52:6 states: "Therefore My people shall know My name; therefore in that day I am the one who is speaking, ‘Here I am.’”
We can now say that His name is Jesus, Yeshua.
I didn't expect this post to be this long. I'll reserve my other questions in another post.
One more thing about Messiah being from the linage of David:
Mary, the mother of Jesus, was of the tribe of Judah and the lineage of David (Psalm 132:11; Luke 1:32). She was connected by marriage with Elisabeth, who was of the lineage of Aaron (Luke 1:36).
I apologize if it came off that way, it was way past my bedtime when I wrote it. The first post was in regards to the answer this person gave on the Messiah. I am not exactly sure HOW to ask my questions without being called out on it. I mean no disrespect and only giving what my knowledge is and asking questions about it, and I am trying to understand the mindset of the Jewish Faith today.
I am trying to see is if having a better understanding on who Jesus was would make you look at him differently than you do now. Knowing that He was the Sacrificial Lamb that atoned for our sins if it would change your mindset or make you think more of the subject.
Most of the time the Jewish Faith shut down Jesus because it was explained that he was a second person of a trinity and as what was already pointed out. G-d is One, but is a Spirit. By manifesting Himself into a man and dying for us, He would atone for our sins as promised.
Is there a coincidence that the animal sacrifices for atonement ceased after his death or having the veil being torn in two, opening the Holy of Hollies up to everyone now that believed? If there were no atonement for our sins that means we are all still in sin and separated from G-d.
I have read that instead of animal sacrifices now the atonement would be Torah study, prayer, and acts of loving-kindness and the blood-shed would come from circumcision. But my question on this is, since the time of Moses every single ceremony or act the High Priests were to do came directly from G-d. They didn't have wiggle room to make up their own acts and ways to do it (Saul comes to mind when he was tired of waiting for Samuel and offered the sacrifice himself). In 70AD after the temple was destroyed they agreed to this teaching.
My concern on this type of sacrifice comes from reading Book of Malachi where G-d rebukes the Priests for sacrificing the lame and blind to Him, instead of the spotless lamb. In my opinion, G-d instructed on how to give an atonement sacrifice and it needed to be done exact. Did G-d instruct the High Priests in 70AD to 'lessen' the sacrifice from an spotless animal to acts of loving-kindness and circumcision? Wouldn't this be in the Tanakh now since G-d gave instructions on how He wants this done since it is new?
I don't want to take away from the original question I asked because I am not here to debate christian doctrine but to get a better understand of Jewish Faith.
But to answer the question. Jesus had a human spirit, being fully man. He knew G-d was in Him and directing Him. In the same way a Christian today, being filled with His Holy Spirit has G-d's Spirit in him, but also his human spirit. When we see Jesus say 'In my Fathers house..' we see His human side speak and it is indeed His Father, like our Father. Another case to this is that it took Jesus 3 times to go into the Garden of Gethsemene to get his flesh into subjection. His Spirit, who was G-d, was ready and knew what needed to be done. However, his flesh was weak and he had to battle it for 3 hours to get it under control.
When we are filled with the Holy Spirit it not a 3rd person of a trinity. It is G-d that is within us. We have the same Spirit that was within the Apostles, the same Spirit that was in Jesus - but with less measure. For it was written that He was given the Spirit without measure.
And in response to Jazzymom, I am not a jews for jesus person, just someone trying to learn.
I don't want to take away from the original question I asked because I am not here to debate christian doctrine but to get a better understand of Jewish Faith.
I would think that as a Jew you wouldn't care the slightest about understanding Jesus the false prophet.
Wiki is your friend:
Jews have traditionally seen Jesus as one of a number of false messiahs who have appeared throughout history.[1] Jesus is viewed as having been the most influential, and consequently the most damaging, of all false messiahs.[2] However, since the general Jewish belief is that the Messiah has not yet come and that the Messianic Age is not yet present, the total rejection of Jesus as either messiah or deity in Judaism has never been a central issue for Judaism. At the heart of Judaism are the Torah, its commandments, the Tanakh, and ethical monotheism such as in the Shema — all of which predated Jesus.
Judaism has never accepted any of the claimed fulfillments of prophecy that Christianity attributes to Jesus. Judaism also forbids the worship of a person as a form of idolatry, since the central belief of Judaism is the absolute unity and singularity of God.[3][4]
Jewish eschatology holds that the coming of the Messiah will be associated with a specific series of events that have not yet occurred, including the return of Jews to their homeland and the rebuilding of The Temple, a Messianic Age of peace[5] and understanding during which "the knowledge of God" fills the earth,[6] and since Judaism holds that none of these events occurred during the lifetime of Jesus (nor have they occurred afterwards), he is not a candidate for messiah.
Fair enough. But wiki isn't always correct in what it says. I would rather learn from a real Jewish person.
Google away, you will find that answer the same no matter what Jew you ask (Messianic/Jews for Jesus excepted).
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