Kansas: Home of murderous zealouts (to live, fence, statistics)

[Jane72]

Only three others do late term abortions in the country. That is how distasteful the general public finds it.

People keep parroting this like it's fact.
The number changes- only 2 others, only 3 others, only 5 others- but it's always low.
The fact is, nearly every major hospital performs late term abortions routinely.
When a woman's life and health is imminently threatened by her pregnancy, do you guys suppose they just leave her to die? Do you suppose they call for Dr. Tiller or one of these other "three" villains, who then fly across the country to perform the procedure?

If so, I've got some oceanfront lots in Arizona to sell you.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by janelle144

It was horrible what happened to Tiller but the man has been doing late term abortions for years and it is estimated he has done 60,000 of them.

<snip>

It's sad but if what Tiller said was true, than the killer got it into his head he was going to tell Tiller what he was going to do and not do.

<snip>

There is no such thing as "this is sad, but" and then go on for several paragraphs about how Tiller deserved it. The person who did this should be found (hopefully he has but I do believe in innocent until proven guilty), prosecuted, and sentenced.

[talbet]

All this claptrap does not change the fact that the radical right fundamentalists gin up hate against people they do not like, Does any one remember Matthew Sheppard? And how a couple of so called Christian haters of gays took him beat him and then tied him to die on a fence post? Then all those Hagee types said that they had nothing to do with it just as the same hate spewers try to distance themselves from the man that shot tiller. Any of you who have railed against a group of people weather it is Abortion Drs, or Gays or immigrants, and someone has been empowered by hate speech has blood on their hands. You can not on one hand sit in a church such as Hagee's and listen to speeches that say Katrina was gods revenge on a Gay pride parade and then say that you love your fellow man or you had nothing to do with the mentally ill that kill on the basis of that same hate speech. When the people of the towns were paraded through the death camps after the war, they tried to say they had no idea or were not part of any of it. But because they did nothing when their leaders preached hate they were part of it. This is why they drew contempt from the soldiers and officers that liberated the camps, and these people would have been punished very hard if they stood up, but you people who could just stand up and maybe receive a small amount of ridicule shrink back into lumps on quivering jelly, or worse yet raise your fist like so many hate mongers at the so called Tea bagging party’s and say, succeed from the union, or like some did at the campaign rallies "Kill Him" "He is a terrorist" or "He is an Arab" You are part of the hate that ends up in violence and then when it does happen you step aside with your hands in your pockets like you are a simple bystander. Those of you that do this make me sick.

[averagejoe76]

Kansas the new breeding ground for the american taliban?
Radio host's being compared to Nazi war criminals & blamed for the actions of..
A few crazies?Christians being compared to Islamic terrorist's??
I think someone is off their medication.

[kanhawk]

The day after Tiller was murdered in Kansas a man walked up to an army recruiting station in Little Rock, Arkansas and shot 2 soldiers killing 1 of them. His name is Mujihad Muhammed. Is the left as quick to condemn the muslim community for this murder as it to condemn the pro-life movement for Tiller's murder? Of course not.
The left's outrage is selective, and politically convenient.

[Fiddlefeet]

I think believe most moral persons do not endorse murdering murderers outside the authority of governing law. I certainly do not condone the murder of Dr Tiller. However, when a society degenerates, its governing bodies become corrupt and the law of the land more and more desecrates moral law -- moral people find themselves awash in moral dilemmas every single day. How long do they accept this situation passively?

Perhaps Kansans, on the whole, retain a greater sense of themselves as a moral people, with civic responsibility to resist oppressive and immoral legislation from local, state and federal governing bodies.

Personally, I hope there are a lot more states whose citizens are willing and ready to resist the increasingly powerful and corrupt government(s) in the US. Yes, it's extremist to murder an abortion doctor. But -- extremism runs along a spectrum --- ask Janet Napolitano -- she'll tell you all about right wing extremists like returning military veterans and anyone else who disagrees with Democrat/Socialist policies.

[Steve97415]

Originally Posted by Fiddlefeet

Perhaps Kansans, on the whole, retain a greater sense of themselves as a moral people, with civic responsibility to resist oppressive and immoral legislation from local, state and federal governing bodies.

Well, if that's true, then we can note the rise of the American Al Qaeda Movement in Kansas as well as the American Taliban. For this is precisely what terrorists do: they shun the oppressive rule of human law to act directly on their own higher moral convictions...selflessly sacrificing their own lives to bring down the boastful Towers of Babel erected by the Great Satan.

Civilization is about conforming to the Rule of Law, not venerating your own moral reflex as the ultimate arbiter of what should be. There is no widespread consensus on what is "moral" and what isn't. Mores vary with geography, language groups and religious indoctrination. Some still hold that birth control is by its very nature immoral. For many decades the church railed against "miscegenation", interracial marriage, as "degenerate and immoral." For others, it is immoral to engage in interspecies cannibalism by consuming the flesh of other animals. Drinking alcohol is immoral. The Puritans fined early colonists for the immoral act of celebrating Christmas. The Amish condemned members of their fellowship for the moral violation of sewing zippers on their clothing. The Bible, in the 19th Chapter of Leviticus forbids shatnez (wearing clothing made of mixed fibers) as part of Hebraic moral code.

If people want to exercise their own construction of personal morality in their own lives...let them. Let people eat meat or not, marry whomever they want, dress as they see fit, control their own reproductives lives...what does it subtract from your life if you allow them to live by the dictates of their consciences just as you demand to be allowed to live by the dictates of yours? Doesn't the Golden Rule require that you extend them that reciprocity of moral self-determination?

If you are a talibanist, then it does not. You hold the moral insight of your own culture to be infallible and that of that of others to be degenerate.

[j_k_k]

If anyone thinks that the kind of sentiments that led to this assassination are specific to Kansas, and not prevalent in numerous other states, they are uninformed. If anyone thinks that most Kansans approve of Fred Phelps, they are simply delusional.

[mhouse2001]

Originally Posted by pioneer88

...but it doesn't make it better to "kill him back." By killing him he put himself on George Tiller's level, which is really counterproductive isn't it?

Not to alter the course, but I've used this same argument on people who feel it's OK to waterboard terrorists, and they don't get it. They feel justified in their hatred and cruelty. When you stoop to the level of those you despise, you are just as guilty as they are. Why can't people understand that?

[mhouse2001]

Originally Posted by kanhawk

The day after Tiller was murdered in Kansas a man walked up to an army recruiting station in Little Rock, Arkansas and shot 2 soldiers killing 1 of them. His name is Mujihad Muhammed. Is the left as quick to condemn the muslim community for this murder as it to condemn the pro-life movement for Tiller's murder? Of course not.
The left's outrage is selective, and politically convenient.

No, it will be the right's job to quickly condemn the Muslim community. The right has trouble with all things bearded apparently. Those on the left recognize that not everyone from the Middle East is a bad guy and we won't jump to the conclusion that the soldier killer you mention is a spokesperson for their whole group. On the other hand, it is easier to condemn the pro-lifers because they ARE extremists who feel compelled to interfere with other peoples' lives and choices. And they are local to this country. It's not selective outrage. The pro-lifers are perceived as a more dangerous "enemy" because of their hardline approach and interference in our personal choices. Pro-lifers make it personal.