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A company this big has counsel on retainer. They don't have to hire any attorneys. If they make a habit out of suing former tenants, the attorneys already have the papers drawn up and just have to fill in the blanks.
thank you for explicitly making the same point I was implying!
They're likely to have counsel on retainer, meaning your lawsuit will cost them nothing beyond what they're already paying, and frankly, if I was them, I'd rather pay a lawyer than a former tenant, since if word gets around that they pay off former tenants rather than litigating, everyone in the universe will threaten to sue them over every little thing just to get a payout.
Also, I lived in a different Avalon, and if memory serves, the cleaning fee was built into the lease.
You could sue in small claims, but I don't know that it's some great slam dunk case. If you didn't pay for sewer and water for the unit for two days, and the sewer and water was on for two days, and they incurred a cost that should've been paid by you, you likely do owe them that. Same goes for repairs - even if it was "little" stuff that "doesn't matter" to the average tenant, if they actually did repair something, it's at least arguably a fair charge (they overcharge like crazy for this stuff, and it's pretty absurd, so I feel your pain, but at the same time, I don't know how much traction you'd have in court if you're refusing to pay for services that were actually rendered, and that you're obligated to cover under the terms of your lease).
If you have the time and inclination, go to small claims, but don't expect success. Personally, if I had the $700 available, I'd probably just pay them and be done with it, both to avoid the aggravation of small claims court and the ding to my credit score for non-payment that would happen while the lawsuit was pending.
Personally, if I had the $700 available, I'd probably just pay them and be done with it, both to avoid the aggravation of small claims court and the ding to my credit score for non-payment that would happen while the lawsuit was pending.
^^^ This.... is the biggest thing going for the property managements companies ! I am not sure how this can change in the short term. I had to shell out when I moved too, I felt sick for a few days about it, I have to admit.
They're likely to have counsel on retainer, meaning your lawsuit will cost them nothing beyond what they're already paying, and frankly, if I was them, I'd rather pay a lawyer than a former tenant, since if word gets around that they pay off former tenants rather than litigating, everyone in the universe will threaten to sue them over every little thing just to get a payout.
Also, I lived in a different Avalon, and if memory serves, the cleaning fee was built into the lease.
You could sue in small claims, but I don't know that it's some great slam dunk case. If you didn't pay for sewer and water for the unit for two days, and the sewer and water was on for two days, and they incurred a cost that should've been paid by you, you likely do owe them that. Same goes for repairs - even if it was "little" stuff that "doesn't matter" to the average tenant, if they actually did repair something, it's at least arguably a fair charge (they overcharge like crazy for this stuff, and it's pretty absurd, so I feel your pain, but at the same time, I don't know how much traction you'd have in court if you're refusing to pay for services that were actually rendered, and that you're obligated to cover under the terms of your lease).
If you have the time and inclination, go to small claims, but don't expect success. Personally, if I had the $700 available, I'd probably just pay them and be done with it, both to avoid the aggravation of small claims court and the ding to my credit score for non-payment that would happen while the lawsuit was pending.
This exactly.
I get it. I moved out of a rental last year and the property managers were awful! But, I doubt you'd be the first person to challenge these kinds of fees. It will be much more burdensome for you to pursue this than it will for Avalon to defend against it.
You could sue in small claims, but I don't know that it's some great slam dunk case. If you didn't pay for sewer and water for the unit for two days, and the sewer and water was on for two days, and they incurred a cost that should've been paid by you, you likely do owe them that. Same goes for repairs - even if it was "little" stuff that "doesn't matter" to the average tenant, if they actually did repair something, it's at least arguably a fair charge (they overcharge like crazy for this stuff, and it's pretty absurd, so I feel your pain, but at the same time, I don't know how much traction you'd have in court if you're refusing to pay for services that were actually rendered, and that you're obligated to cover under the terms of your lease).
If you have the time and inclination, go to small claims, but don't expect success. Personally, if I had the $700 available, I'd probably just pay them and be done with it, both to avoid the aggravation of small claims court and the ding to my credit score for non-payment that would happen while the lawsuit was pending.
Why not? My god you guys are whimpy. They would have to show burden of proof that the tenant destroyed the apartment and created more than "reasonable wear and tear". Little repairs can be considered reasonable wear and tear and if the tenant left the apartment in "pristine" condition AND has the pictures to show for it, I don't see how the landlord can win here.
The same people that "pay them and be done with it" are the same people that fuel these companies into continuing to screw the other tenants. Sue these guys!
And don't worry about debt collectors. I once had a debt collector try to come after me for disputing the charge on crappy laminate flooring I bought and didn't want. Turns out the debt collectors violated FDCPA enough in their letters to me. I sued the debt collector with the help of Joseph Mauro. I got the debt wiped. Got to keep the flooring. My attorney got paid because you can sue for reasonable attorney fees under FDCPA. I didn't pay a dime to my attorney or anybody. Everyone was happy. Well except for the debt collector who went away with it's tail between it's legs.
If you are that whimpy, then pay the $700 and then sue them. All it takes is $30 bucks (or whatever the local court fee is) and a morning in court. And you get the honor of hearing everyone else's lovely case in court. It's like watching an episode of Judge Judy. I got more entertainment out of that than taking my debt collector's money.
I get it. I moved out of a rental last year and the property managers were awful! But, I doubt you'd be the first person to challenge these kinds of fees. It will be much more burdensome for you to pursue this than it will for Avalon to defend against it.
Why not? My god you guys are whimpy. They would have to show burden of proof that the tenant destroyed the apartment and created more than "reasonable wear and tear". Little repairs can be considered reasonable wear and tear and if the tenant left the apartment in "pristine" condition AND has the pictures to show for it, I don't see how the landlord can win here.
The same people that "pay them and be done with it" are the same people that fuel these companies into continuing to screw the other tenants. Sue these guys!
And don't worry about debt collectors. I once had a debt collector try to come after me for disputing the charge on crappy laminate flooring I bought and didn't want. Turns out the debt collectors violated FDCPA enough in their letters to me. I sued the debt collector with the help of Joseph Mauro. I got the debt wiped. Got to keep the flooring. My attorney got paid because you can sue for reasonable attorney fees under FDCPA. I didn't pay a dime to my attorney or anybody. Everyone was happy. Well except for the debt collector who went away with it's tail between it's legs.
If you are that whimpy, then pay the $700 and then sue them. All it takes is $30 bucks (or whatever the local court fee is) and a morning in court. And you get the honor of hearing everyone else's lovely case in court. It's like watching an episode of Judge Judy. I got more entertainment out of that than taking my debt collector's money.
The "burden of proof" in a civil action is extraordinarily low. OP said her charges were related to sewer and water fees - pictures aren't going to help with that, and I can pretty much guarantee you that Avalon has bills to substantiate the debt.
And as for your "don't worry about debt collectors" theory, that only works if you don't care about the hit to your credit score that happens while the legal process is sorting itself out. Sure, you can file an FDCPA case, and maybe win, and maybe get the debt wiped, but that'll take at least a year, and in the meantime, your credit score drops 50-60 points or more. For someone trying to buy a home (as OP is), a significant drop in credit score is going to cost a lot more than $700 in the long run, in the form of either a higher interest rate on a mortgage, or not being able to get a mortgage at all.
It's not about being a wimp - it's about weighing the costs, ALL of the costs, of pursuing a lawsuit versus the cost of the debt itself, and then deciding what's in your best interests.
The "burden of proof" in a civil action is extraordinarily low. OP said her charges were related to sewer and water fees - pictures aren't going to help with that, and I can pretty much guarantee you that Avalon has bills to substantiate the debt.
And as for your "don't worry about debt collectors" theory, that only works if you don't care about the hit to your credit score that happens while the legal process is sorting itself out. Sure, you can file an FDCPA case, and maybe win, and maybe get the debt wiped, but that'll take at least a year, and in the meantime, your credit score drops 50-60 points or more. For someone trying to buy a home (as OP is), a significant drop in credit score is going to cost a lot more than $700 in the long run, in the form of either a higher interest rate on a mortgage, or not being able to get a mortgage at all.
It's not about being a wimp - it's about weighing the costs, ALL of the costs, of pursuing a lawsuit versus the cost of the debt itself, and then deciding what's in your best interests.
Wrong. My FDCPA case took two, maybe three months tops start to finish. And I betcha any decent FDCPA attorney can get that taken care of while you stall the DCs with letters to validate.
I would be careful about spewing incorrect facts regarding FDCPA without actually knowing what happens. I've been there. Was the easiest process in the world. And $400 for water and sewer fees. For what... two days? Yeah please show me a bill that says water and sewer for the OPs unit costs $400. Wow.
It's not about being a wimp - it's about weighing the costs, ALL of the costs, of pursuing a lawsuit versus the cost of the debt itself, and then deciding what's in your best interests.
Yes and in the end I guess there are two types of people. The ones that stand up for themselves and defend their RIGHTS. And the ones that simply "bend over" and just take whatever is dealt to them.
Sorry Ave, but I don't believe I have a personal "right" to welch on a debt on a technicality when the debt was incurred for a service I actually received. To each his own, right?
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