Cars in L.A as an insight into poverty/wealth of residents (Merced: 2014, buying)

[Mister 7]

Originally Posted by jm1982

Yeah, I always thought it was kind of ridiculous that so called 'luxury' cars have more problems than the nonluxury cars.

Not sure about BMW, but I heard the older Mercedes were built to last longer. The current cars while nice looking seem to be pretty over engineered , which of course benefits the car maker and dealers, not the consumer. I have a family member that bought a certified Mercedes, they haven't had problems with it yet but it's not that old . Not sure if they will own it outside of the warranty or not.

You are correct about the older Benzes. And by older I mean OLD. They may have had quirks here and there, but they were basically indestructible. Mercedes had to cut costs and lower their prices (and quality) in the 90s to compete with.....Lexus. Their products went to crap in the process. They seem to be on the rebound, though. MB finally seems to be back on its game now. They still won't be nearly as reliable as Lexus, but much, much better than before. I feel that driving an over-engineered car is a great thing for the consumer, so long as everything works, lasts a very long time, and there is no trouble with all the gadgets, gizmos, etc. This is the case with Lexus cars, and back to our original chat, is basically the reason why they hold their value better than the competition.

[bpeeps]

Originally Posted by AJT123

This post is wrong on so many levels.

Lexus LS has nothing to do with a Camry. Lexus IS has nothing to do with a Corolla. They are both unique, Lexus-only designs. To say a Lexus isn't refined is just nonsense. When the first LS400 came out introducing the Lexus brand, it completely and utterly knocked every other luxury brand on its a$$, especially Mercedes. Sent them all scrambling back to the drawing board. All the luxury car companies bought LS400s and took them apart piece by piece and studied them to figure out just how they made a car so refined. A lot of Lexus haters use the "It's just a Toyota" line, but that's just a cop out. If anything, Lexus quality is better than the competition. I own a 2004 LS430, an 11 year old car now. Other than normal maintenance, it's never been to the shop ONE TIME, and drives like a 3 year old car with 30k on it. Show me ONE single 2004 S-Class, 7 series, Audi A8, Jaguar XJ, or basically any high end, complex flagship sedan that can match that. If that's not quality, I don't know what is.

Lexus doesn't quite have the cachet of MB or BMW, but to say it's not a true, legit luxury brand is plain wrong.

I don't doubt Lexus has influenced the luxury car market, but that's a different discussion altogether.

2004 vs 2015. A lot has changed in a decade and Lexus has remained stagnant. The current iterations of their cars are indistinguishable from every other car on the market. Take off the L emblem and what do you have? Generic and not unique and similarly equivalent to the Toyota compact and mid-sized cars.

[UKWildcat1981]

Originally Posted by AJT123

This post is wrong on so many levels.

Lexus LS has nothing to do with a Camry. Lexus IS has nothing to do with a Corolla. They are both unique, Lexus-only designs. To say a Lexus isn't refined is just nonsense. When the first LS400 came out introducing the Lexus brand, it completely and utterly knocked every other luxury brand on its a$$, especially Mercedes. Sent them all scrambling back to the drawing board. All the luxury car companies bought LS400s and took them apart piece by piece and studied them to figure out just how they made a car so refined. A lot of Lexus haters use the "It's just a Toyota" line, but that's just a cop out. If anything, Lexus quality is better than the competition. I own a 2004 LS430, an 11 year old car now. Other than normal maintenance, it's never been to the shop ONE TIME, and drives like a 3 year old car with 30k on it. Show me ONE single 2004 S-Class, 7 series, Audi A8, Jaguar XJ, or basically any high end, complex flagship sedan that can match that. If that's not quality, I don't know what is.

Lexus doesn't quite have the cachet of MB or BMW, but to say it's not a true, legit luxury brand is plain wrong.

Having a BMW and Mercedes does not have the same cache it used to as well, Bentley and Rolls now thats a different story.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by AJT123

Lexus LS has nothing to do with a Camry. Lexus IS has nothing to do with a Corolla. They are both unique, Lexus-only designs. To say a Lexus isn't refined is just nonsense.

I think he just meant that Lexus is the luxury vehicle division of Toyota.

Originally Posted by UKWildcat1981

It has nothing to do with wealth, its just how much you value a car

Exactly.

[djmanu]

I live in Montreal and Miami, Montreal (and the NE) is probably the rust capital in North America and yes people still drive old japanese cars there too !!
The rust is not the issue really, Miami is the US metro I've been where the cars were the nicest and newest, if you don't wash your car there people will stare at you
Probably because people are materialistic (they want new cars, boat,... ), there's no public transit and housing is quite cheap compared to LA and Montreal , people can afford newer cars ...
If you love nice cars like I do, Miami is like paradise

[Mister 7]

Originally Posted by bpeeps

I don't doubt Lexus has influenced the luxury car market, but that's a different discussion altogether.

2004 vs 2015. A lot has changed in a decade and Lexus has remained stagnant. The current iterations of their cars are indistinguishable from every other car on the market. Take off the L emblem and what do you have? Generic and not unique and similarly equivalent to the Toyota compact and mid-sized cars.

I do agree that Lexus isn't currently on top of their game like they were in 2004 and prior. Back then the LS was class leading, won comparison tests, etc., but now it's an also-ran in today's flagship market. I think Lexus lost its way trying to emulate and chase after BMW. The problem is that Lexus abandoned its old, SUCCESFUL formula: pure, unequivocal, absolute luxury before anything else. The brand had that DOWN PAT, and sort of lost its way once it decided to change its image.

That being said, they are still great cars you can drive 300k miles with minimal, if any, issues.

OTOH I disagree that they look generic and equivalent to Toyotas. On the contrary I think they are doing a better job than ever with their bold designs, and a debadged Lexus would look NOTHING like a Toyota to me, now more than ever. Have you seen the new RC coupe?

[thelopez2]

Originally Posted by bpeeps

There is no unique quality about the Lexus brand at all. Lexus IS = Corolla, Lexus LS = Camry. A maxed Avalon would serve better, honestly.

Top Rated Cars, SUVs & Trucks - Car Reliability Ratings - 2014 Vehicle Dependability Study

"Highest-Ranked Nameplates and Models
Lexus ranks highest in vehicle dependability among all nameplates for a third consecutive year. The gap between Lexus and all other brands is substantial, with Lexus averaging 68 PP100 compared with second-ranked Mercedes-Benz at 104 PP100. Following Mercedes-Benz in the rankings are Cadillac (107), Acura (109) and Buick (112), respectively.

"The 2014 Vehicle Dependability Study is based on responses from more than 41,000 original owners of 2011 model-year vehicles after three years of ownership. The study was fielded between October and December 2013."

Consumer Reports 2014 Annual Auto Reliability Survey Finds Infotainment Systems are a Growing First-Year Reliability Plague: Consumer Reports http://pressroom.consumerreports.org/pressroom/

"European brands have historically been unreliable in Consumer Reports’ survey, but that’s no longer the case."

Originally Posted by bpeeps

I don't doubt Lexus has influenced the luxury car market, but that's a different discussion altogether.

You can believe what you want despite the vast amount of information on the web and historic commercials where competitors compare their cars to Lexus. How much do you really know about the industry?

[Monkeymike]

Originally Posted by thelopez2

You can believe what you want despite the vast amount of information on the web and historic commercials where competitors compare their cars to Lexus. How much do you really know about the industry?

Since when does reliability equate to popularity/ desirability? The Lexus brand really has devolved into pretty bland, higher end Toyotas. They might be unique design but that's how they're viewed. So basically it's Acura. Is Acura more reliable than a BMW? Absolutely. You know what I don't want to drive? An Acura. You know what else I don't want to drive? A Lexus. They're getting better after years of being stagnant but BMW they are not. Mercedes they are not.

I'm not saying this to be facetious but to make some sort of correlation between reliability and desirability is kind of silly. If that was the case we'd all be aspiring to own a Honda Civic.

[diallomacedo]

THE CARS IN FLORIDA AREN'T NEWER, LOS ANGELES IS JUST POOOOOR. I CAME FROM THE DC/MD/VA AREA AND LA IS POOR. EVERY WHERE YOU LOOK--POOR. UP POOR, DOWN POOR, RIGHT POOR, LEFT POOR. The media makes Los Angeles look amazing, but it honestly is the poorest place I have ever visited. Its too poor, additionally, the average person is less educated here versus the east coast. Lack of sophistication too. However, the weather is nice...

[Monkeymike]

As far as the topic goes, I see things a bit differently as a transplant. I grew up in Chicago. An easier indicator of a particular neighborhood's socio-economic standing was the cars that were parked on the street. When apartment shopping I would go through the parking lots of various complexes and see what people drove and the age/ condition/ brand of car largely reflected the complex. Crappy complexes had crappy cars. Higher end complexes had nicer, newer cars.

After I started coming to LA I realized pretty quickly that vehicles aren't a good way to determine the income level of a neighborhood. There are a lot of dumpy houses in Panorama City with really nice cars in the driveway. And here is why I think that is:

Cost of living

The cost of living out here is so high that if you can afford to live out here, a car payment (or lease) ends up being a very small portion of your income as a percentage. In Chicago a $550,000 - $650,000 house would be a mini-mansion. Out here it's an entry level home that might need a lot of work, sitting in a questionable neighborhood.

You see that person out here and you wonder why they're striving to own a high end car when they live in a pretty meh area but in all actuality even if they're living in a run down shack in an average part of Van Nuys they likely paid $500,000+ and a person that can afford a $500,000+ house can generally shake off a $300 - $600 a month car payment no sweat.