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Sorry for the off topic post, just wanted to say something about Lewiston
I have not been in Lewiston/Auburn since the early seventies except mayhaps a night or two in a hotel across the decades when traveling south to avoid the higher prices of a room elsewhere. WHen you are a young person confused, what better place to seek solice than with your Grandparents? I went to stay with mine in Maine when I returned from the service. I obtained employment in Lewiston, lots of work then. I worked there as a young man tearing down a coal gasification plant operated by the Central Maine Power Company on Water? Street. Lewiston was a nice town, and a good place to put my field trip to SE Asia in perspective. Good hard physical labor is very soothing for the soul. I have mentioned in these pages about eating often at the Cedar Street Cafe in those days. I actually wanted to stop there in July, but nobody could tell me if it was still in exsistence (The Cafe). Many folks spoke French there in those days.The river looked as if it would burst into flames at any moment from pollution, and did not smell very good. It looked as if someone had poured washing powders into it. I think the radio station the played rock n roll(now called classic) was WBLM? I owe a debt to the kind people of that town, they let me be where I needed to be, and do what I needed to do. This was not readily avalible to many of us in those days. Sorry for the side trip down memory lane.Thanks Lewiston.
I don't care where Flycessna lives...it is irrevelant. I lived in Portland for a number of years, but that does not automatically make me an expert on Somalis in Portland. Similarly, Flycessna living in Lewiston does not make him an expert in Somalis in Lewiston, neccessarily.
Flycessna states some of those myths were proven as fact and I asked him for his source.
I think Flycessna has a better handle on it than you do broadmindedbill.
Sorry for the off topic post, just wanted to say something about Lewiston
I have not been in Lewiston/Auburn since the early seventies except mayhaps a night or two in a hotel across the decades when traveling south to avoid the higher prices of a room elsewhere. WHen you are a young person confused, what better place to seek solice than with your Grandparents? I went to stay with mine in Maine when I returned from the service. I obtained employment in Lewiston, lots of work then. I worked there as a young man tearing down a coal gasification plant operated by the Central Maine Power Company on Water? Street. Lewiston was a nice town, and a good place to put my field trip to SE Asia in perspective. Good hard physical labor is very soothing for the soul. I have mentioned in these pages about eating often at the Cedar Street Cafe in those days. I actually wanted to stop there in July, but nobody could tell me if it was still in exsistence (The Cafe). Many folks spoke French there in those days.The river looked as if it would burst into flames at any moment from pollution, and did not smell very good. It looked as if someone had poured washing powders into it. I think the radio station the played rock n roll(now called classic) was WBLM? I owe a debt to the kind people of that town, they let me be where I needed to be, and do what I needed to do. This was not readily avalible to many of us in those days. Sorry for the side trip down memory lane.Thanks Lewiston.
wblm, started in a trailer in litchfield around 1978(ish) and moved to lewiston/auburn area (think it was auburn)
use to be 108, then 107.9 now its 102.9
I worked in lewiston 25 years ago, met some very nice folks there
WBLM signed on the air in 1973 on 107.5 MHz. It played so-called Beautiful Music (elevator music) from 6 AM to 6 PM and free-form progressive rock from 6 PM to 6 AM. By later that year, WBLM was a full time progressive rocker. In 1979, it modified its format to main stream album oriented rock, after being severely beaten in the ratings by what at the time was a new 3000 watt album rock station, 100.9-WLOB-FM. In February 1990 it switched frequencies with 102.9 WTHT. 102.9 was previously beautiful music station WGAN-FM from 1966 until 1985. Prior to that 102.9 was a different WLOB-FM (The 107.5 frequency is now WFNK, the WTHT calls are currently on 99.9.)
Ain't trying to argue with you MBM, and even though I enjoyed an occasional illegal smile back in the day, I wiki'ed it to make sure my mind hadn't gone the rest of the way out. I knew it was before '78, cause I was in my academic phase of life then.
WBLM signed on the air in 1973 on 107.5 MHz. It played so-called Beautiful Music (elevator music) from 6 AM to 6 PM and free-form progressive rock from 6 PM to 6 AM. By later that year, WBLM was a full time progressive rocker. In 1979, it modified its format to main stream album oriented rock, after being severely beaten in the ratings by what at the time was a new 3000 watt album rock station, 100.9-WLOB-FM. In February 1990 it switched frequencies with 102.9 WTHT. 102.9 was previously beautiful music station WGAN-FM from 1966 until 1985. Prior to that 102.9 was a different WLOB-FM (The 107.5 frequency is now WFNK, the WTHT calls are currently on 99.9.)
Ain't trying to argue with you MBM, and even though I enjoyed an occasional illegal smile back in the day, I wiki'ed it to make sure my mind hadn't gone the rest of the way out. I knew it was before '78, cause I was in my academic phase of life then.
went by memory- a little hazy at times in the late 70's
I remember the wblm 108 bumper stickers back in high school
I think Flycessna has a better handle on it than you do broadmindedbill.
Thanks for the comment Maineah...now do you think you can put on your big-boy pants and offer up some insight into the discussion other than "Flycessna is right because he lives in Lewiston and therefore you are wrong"?
Well I certainly didn't feel I went on and on about anything. I called the article a bunch of Liberal Propaganda because that is what it is. I certainly do not owe it to you to gather a bunch of statistical data for which you would ignore anyways!
But you really do not need to go any further then the article itself!
Myth #1: Somalis are draining the welfare coffers
Lets save Myth 1 for last as it has most of the statistical data and is probably the most heated topic .
Myth #2: Somalis don’t want to work
Myth 2 comes close to an issue but whether Somali’s “want” to work is not the issue. The question is whether or not Somali’s “have” to work. It is clear that they didn’t immigrate here for employment opportunities and because of our generous welfare they do not have to work. The writer failed miserably to even defend the myth that Somali’s don’t want to work and provided no evidence that they do.. But again I do not feel that is the real issue. I doubt that more then 5% of the Somali population is actually working and supporting themselves and their families! So if you have statistical data to prove ME WORNG… PLEASE DO!
Myth #3: Somalis don’t want to learn English.
Myth #5: Somalis get free apartments
Myth #6: Somalis get free cars.
These examples are not about distorting any myths?? They create them. These discredit anyone who has something to say against immigration or against the Somali immigration in Lewiston by making them look stupid.
I have contact with MANY people; Teachers, Police officers, and small business owners and many others. ALL of whom are or have been concerned about the Somali Immigration and NONE of them would ever assume that Somali's receive free cars or free apartments or ANY special treatment.
When it comes to English the only issue I have heard of is wether or not they chose to use it. Like when police are conducting an investigation??
Myth #4: Somalis don’t want to become citizens.
While the writer does not give specific evidence or numbers I think he gives credible argument that many Somali’s do want to become Citizens. But this is a weak myth in that what is the relevency.. wether or not they are actually citizens they camer here not for work but because of a generous welefare system!
Myth #7: Somalis keep live chickens in their kitchen cupboards.
Another bogus Myth that has no relevancy accept to make us look like ignorant bigots As a landlord I have never heard this rumor outside of a joke that had nothing to do with Somali's
Myth #8: Somalis are responsible for a rise in crime
For the record I do not view the Somali community as crime ridden or culturally problematic when it comes to crime. But the writer refers to district court stats and does not consider juvenile crime or even calls for service. All of which have an impact on the community. For those that know me know I was in Law enforcement in Lewiston and I am close to the Police in the area and certainly calls for service and the nature of their work have changed. Just last year there were reported multiple incidents involving Somali juveniles harassing, assaulting, and robbing elderly citizens all of which were non Somali. And even I am afraid to write this but for those who are really interested DM me and I will tell you about the problems sears security was having with the Somali Juvenile’s.
Myth #9: Somalis don’t integrate and don’t want to be part of the community.
Again the myth is off topic?? I think anyone would want to be part of a community and be accepted. However the challenge lay in assimilation. Do the Somali’s want to Assimilate? Do the Somali’s want to be a part of OUR community? I think what we see is many Somali’s actively participating to advance their own culture and community but not really assimilating.
Myth #10: Somalis got a free ride to America.
Are we talking about the free bus ride thing?? I think if you consider many of them who were on government assistance to begin with in Atlanta and used what ever money they had to come here and live on government assistance then yes it was a free ride?? We see here the entitlement mentality when the writer asserts that it was their own money and their own desire to relocate here but the truth is they came here without jobs.. Hey Id like to go live in…. Hawaii.... but I am not about to just pack up my family and move there without any way of providing for myself and my family!
Myth #1: Somalis are draining the welfare coffers.
Fact: In 2008-9, refugees accounted for 15.76% of the General Assistance budget for the city of Lewiston. In 2009, noncitizens (who are mostly refugees) received 6.8% of TANF expenditures in Lewiston/Auburn, and 5.4% of TANF expenditures in Androscoggin County. In 2009, noncitizens accounted for 3% of the food stamp budget in Lewiston/Auburn and 2.1% of the food stamp budget for Androscoggin County. The percentage of funds going to noncitizens has been steadily dropping in all these areas. Most Somalis are not on welfare. Most adult Somalis have a job and pay taxes
So here we go! Myth number 1.
Once again we see the writer choosing to avoid the bigger question. I will first suggest the issue is that the Somali immigration has been a drain on the community!
But just for fun lets take a look at what the write has to say about being a drain on welfare. The notion that 15% of general assistance that is being handed out to "noncitizens" is not a lot of money or a drain. Do me a favor and take you mortgage and increase it by 15% and then tell me it is not affecting your budget. That is a real subjective argument!
The writer tries to make an argument that Somali’s want to be citizens but decides to leave them out when he talking about general assistance. Strange how all of a sudden we are just looking at “noncitizens”.. how much general assistance is going to Somali citizens??
The real question is always has been why did they come here?? And are those reasons justifiable. We can all appreciate that they want a safe community to raise their children and appreciate that they chose Maine. But they didn’t come here for work. This is a poor state and Lewiston is a poor community. They have been a huge drain on our community. From just what the article will admit we are talking about 1000 Somali’s in our schools along with 15% of our general assistance budget being handed over to noncitizens.
If the writer was really concerned with raising the image of the Somali people he could have just done that by gather full and complete data on how they have impacted the city of Lewiston.
I can't disagree that alot of the original authors points were strawman arguments nor can disagree that 15% is alot of a budget to go to any group, non-citizen or otherwise. The statistic that struck me as the most interesting is that percentage of the budget going to non-citizens appears to be decreasing over time.
This suggests that these non-citizens (who are assumed to be all Somali) are becoming employed and not needing/receiving assistance anymore. This is just like you would expect from folks coming to the US for a better life, not coming here to suck up plush government assistance benefits.
The Maine Department of Labor reports an overall Somali immigrant employment rate of 49% from 2001-2006. If you assume that most of the immigrants are young families, then this statistic is in line with what you would expect for a single-income family (Father works, mom stays at home to watch kids).
So again I don't know if you can make the conclusion that all of these families immigrated here and are just hanging out enjoying the welfare dole. It sounds like they just aren't making enough to make end meet (yet). Unfortunately, it does put a strain on a poor community like Lewiston. But that is a different discussion of how/why then ended up in Lewiston of all places...
Last edited by broadbill; 10-28-2010 at 06:53 AM..
Thanks for the comment Maineah...now do you think you can put on your big-boy pants and offer up some insight into the discussion other than "Flycessna is right because he lives in Lewiston and therefore you are wrong"?
I didn't call you wrong ...just dismissive. Fly made some good points and YOU were the one who was not interested in what he was saying. I simply pointed out the fact that he lives there and may have some personal insights the rest of us don't have. You didn't want to hear an alternative view to the original post.
I can't disagree that alot of the original authors points were strawman arguments nor can disagree that 15% is alot of a budget to go to any group, non-citizen or otherwise. The statistic that struck me as the most interesting is that percentage of the budget going to non-citizens appears to be decreasing over time.
This suggests that these non-citizens (who are assumed to be all Somali) are becoming employed and not needing/receiving assistance anymore. This is just like you would expect from folks coming to the US for a better life, not coming here to suck up plush government assistance benefits.
The Maine Department of Labor reports an overall Somali immigrant employment rate of 49% from 2001-2006. If you assume that most of the immigrants are young families, then this statistic is in line with what you would expect for a single-income family (Father works, mom stays at home to watch kids).
So again I don't know if you can make the conclusion that all of these families immigrated here and are just hanging out enjoying the welfare dole. It sounds like they just aren't making enough to make end meet (yet). Unfortunately, it does put a strain on a poor community like Lewiston. But that is a different discussion of how/why then ended up in Lewiston of all places...
That's an interesting report but unfortunately it doesnt hold much water. My suspicions are that just because some might be working the questions remain... are they providing for themselves and their family "if applicable"? I say no.
I am not one to take one expierence and call that the norm but all you need to do is spend a day hanging around Lewiston City Hall and see the disproportionate number of Somali's entering General Assistance when compared to Non-Somali's.
As an individual I consider myself to be open minded and flexible. Someone who likes travell and enjoyes learning about and appreciates other cultures. So call me a bigot if you want but to me it is still somewhat unsetling to see one community change so much in such a short time. We will see what the new sensus shows but just comparing 2007 estimates to 2000 sensus Lewiston went from being 99% white to 82% .. 5,000 "non whites" moved into the city while 3000 white people moved out?? I have to beleive this is because of Somali immigration. What does this mean to the future of Lewiston... A city that made HUGE strides this past decade.
In my own experience I have met some highly intelligent Somali's who work and run their own business's... Not much different then that same kind of mentality we see with other immigrants who move here and take advantage of our great opportunities in free enteprise to run their own business's. but again because of our system it is not the norm. Once they are invited into the circle of welfare I dont see them leaving it.
So for me I blame the system! white, black, yellow ect its NOT an issue of race per se.. But in life you get what your willing to accept. As a nation we have gotten what we have been willing to accept! The apathy displayed by Americans the past 20 years has really hurt this country. We cannot feed and take care of the entire planet. I feel sorry for nations around the world who have continued to find themselves in continous tormoil.. But we cant be the dumping ground for every nation that finds itself in the middle of civil war.
This whole thing is about politics and power. And the race card is played allbeit behind the scenes. I would really like to see a stat that can show how all these immigrants are likely to vote? But I think its prety obvious.. A debate here on another thread about the proposed question to allow "Non Citizens" to vote in Portland for me is right at in line of the things that have been going on for years in this country. If it is voted through it wont be because the majority of people support it. It will be because good people didnt do enough to stop it! I've seen a change in attitudes these past two years, a revolt against big government and a progressive liberal agenda is under way and I hope it continues.
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