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For the most part, it seems like a good college, but it has gotten a few bad reviews. Some of the things the bad ones said were:
1.) That its located in a bad neigborhood full of crime (only read this in one review.)
2.) That the people are snobby. (again only ine one, the rest said the student body was friendly.)
3.) That the student body does a lot of drugs.
I'm trying to look at some colleges far from home, and I was wanting something in the north too. Bates seems like a good school, but I would like some first hand advice.
Here is what I'm looking for in a college:
1.) Friendly profs. who are acessable and always there for you.
2.) A friendly student body that isn't super cliquey or super greek oriented.
3.) Relativly small student body. Max. 2000 people.
4.) That I'm going to get the best education possible.
5.) Small class sizes. Max. 20 people.
6.) Not a school that is heavily focused on drinking and partying.
I don't have any money at all to spend on college. Not a penny. My parents are poor and never saved any money for my college. I am extremely smart though, with a 3.7 gpa (my school doesn't weight grades, so that's my GPA with all my AP classes included) and I'm going to have to rely on finanical aid. Are they good about giving it out?
I think Bates is an excellent small college. As Northern Maine Land Man pointed out, it's going to be pricey, but that's the case with just about any small, private college or university. If it's worth the price to you, then go for it. I went to college at a state school in Maine (actually, two... I transferred once) and have no debt and I feel the education is as good as I made it. My sister, on the other hand is a sophomore at Northeastern in Boston and after she finishes med-school will have over 100,000 in debt. She considers herself lucky that each of us had a college fund set up for us and hers is wiping out a significant portion of her debt... she could realistically look to spend over $200,000 without that fund. I guess whether or not it's worth it depends on what you want to do and how you feel about the cost.
To your questions:
1) Bates is in Lewiston, Maine. It's a very small city (pop 35,000) that was heavily centered around manufacturing and industry. When those businesses left, the town lost a lot of its primary industry and fell (like many cities throughout the Northeast) into a big rut. It's still somewhat run-down but I would hardly call any of it "dangerous." There are some abandoned buildings and a little blight, but it's not a dangerous place. Lewiston also is a stronghold for Somali refugees and in a lilly-white state, a large pocket of a different race may be a bit scary for some (I know it's irrational, but people are inherently aprehensive of anything "different"). Of course, it is a "city" and any city has certain elements of crime, but really not bad. In fact, it's crime rate is lower than that of Portland which is considered by most to be a VERY safe city. If you check City-data's crime statistics, you'll see that Lewiston is WELL below the national average in its overall crime statistics. In the end, I think the people you will hear call Bates' neighborhood and Lewiston in general "dangerous" will be those who really don't know any better. It's not quinetessential "picturesque" Maine and there is a larger minority population than you'll find just about anywhere else in the state and that is a big turn off for many. Use basic common sense (don't walk alone at night, etc) and you'll get by just fine... I really wouldn't worry about safety too much.
2) Sure... there are going to be some. It's a small, private, relatively exclusive college. There are going to be "snobs" at just about any private school you could consider going to and Bates is no different. I wouldn't use it as a generalization of all of the students, but there will be some snobs. You won't escape this by going somewhere else unless you go to a state school somewhere and even then, you'll bump into some. Just look past it. If you're not a snob, you'll likely attract similar peers and do just fine.
3) Again, you can't make this generalization about the entire student body. Some students do a lot of drugs. It's college and it'll happen wherever you go. Given the type of student that chooses bates, the TYPE of drug may be different than your typical state school (i.e. cocaine instead of pot or mushrooms) but there are drugs anywhere. You can easily avoid using drugs by, well, not using them. If you have a roomate that uses, report and request a new room. Associating with people who don't do drugs (there will be plenty!) will also help. I would say Bates overall is about average with drug use (with no hard data, just experience). There are drugs at any school, the bigger issue is how you respond to it. I wouldn't worry about being bombarded with drugs, it won't happen.
Finally, in response to your criteria, I would say that Bates will fit the bill (again, at a cost). It has exactly what you're looking for.
However, depending on what you're majoring in, if you want to go to school in Maine I would suggest heading 50 minutes up Route 4 to the University of Maine at Farmington. It is what you describe... small (around 2,000 students), small classes, VERY friendly professors (I did 2 years at UMF and still talk to some of my Proffs), friendly/ easy going student body, not a big party school at all (though you can if you want), and best of all CHEAP. It provides an excellent quality education (check the rankings) at an affordable cost. Farmington is a bit more attractive than Lewiston and the schools are similar in size. I would seriously consider it depending on your major as the quality of degree is similar to bates at about at a much lesser cost. You'll also find it to be much less "snobby" and much more laid back.
1) Bates is in Lewiston, Maine. It's a very small city (pop 35,000)
2) Sure... there are going to be some. It's a small, private, relatively exclusive college. There are going to be "snobs" at just about any private school you could consider going to and Bates is no different. I wouldn't use it as a generalization of all of the students, but there will be some snobs. You won't escape this by going somewhere else unless you go to a state school somewhere and even then, you'll bump into some. Just look past it. If you're not a snob, you'll likely attract similar peers and do just fine.
3) Again, you can't make this generalization about the entire student body. Some students do a lot of drugs.
Finally, in response to your criteria, I would say that Bates will fit the bill (again, at a cost). It has exactly what you're looking for.
However, depending on what you're majoring in, if you want to go to school in Maine I would suggest heading 50 minutes up Route 4 to the University of Maine at Farmington. It is what you describe... small (around 2,000 students), small classes, VERY friendly professors (I did 2 years at UMF and still talk to some of my Proffs), friendly/ easy going student body, not a big party school at all (though you can if you want), and best of all CHEAP. It provides an excellent quality education (check the rankings) at an affordable cost. Farmington is a bit more attractive than Lewiston and the schools are similar in size. I would seriously consider it depending on your major as the quality of degree is similar to bates at about at a much lesser cost. You'll also find it to be much less "snobby" and much more laid back.
I agree with almost everything said here. First, there are no bad neighborhoods in Maine in comparison to here in the D.C. area. If you can't take the crime level in Lewiston, Maine, head for a rural school (example would be Colby if you insist on spending a lot).
Second, the school is the snobbiest of all the mini-ivies in Maine. I've got two relatives going to school there and both have cited this as a major issue. This is a college for wealthy out of state people that expect to have classmates that fall into that category.
Third, Bates is a BIG party school. Like all the top schools, if you get in it's almost impossible to flunk out.
Personally, I don't think any undergrad college is worth getting into $200,000 in debt. And although you will get "financial aid" from these expensive schools, unless you are a minority, don't expect much of anything other then loans. All Maine colleges are desperate to enroll minority students.
Farmington is a great school if you plan to major in education, and if you are, Bates would be a complete waste of money.
Smartie_Pants,
I'm not sure it still applies, but Bates, Bowdoin, and Colby...(three private colleges in Maine) were talked about in the same breathe as the Ivy League schools in New England. I'm not saying there were on equal footing as the Ivy League schools, but barely a step down. It wasn't easy to get into any of them. A degree from any of them is something to be treasured. If I were to rate those three schools, it would be Bowdoin, Colby, then Bates, only because the first two have such beautiful campuses.
As for financial aid, you probably will find you stand a better chance at the private schools in your particular situation. Because of the status as a private school with many endowments (which I assume have taken a hit with the stock market downturn), they eagerly look for diversity. Your value as a poor, intelligent student will get you a better financial package. It's almost as if very poor, very smart students are recruited by the private schools just to bring a richness to the diversity they aspire to achieve. Another thing about the private schools is each year the financial package gets better. They see it as an investment. Public schools tend to reduce financial aid as you progress, almost as if they've got the hook set and you can't walk away so will find a way to pay more yourself. If you are really poor and really smart, go the private school route...they are looking for you. I'd look into Bowdoin if I were you.
A couple of the most famous alumni from Bates are Bryant Gumbel, the football announcer who also was on the Today show for awhile and Dom Deluise, the comedian.
Last edited by kellysmith; 06-05-2009 at 02:43 AM..
I agree with the above posters. As someone who grew up halfway between Bates and Bowdoin, I would go for Bowdoin over Bates. It's in a nicer location, there seems to be more variety in the students, and the ones I've met seem happy and friendly.
You don't mention where you're from, so I don't know what your geographic criteria may be, but I know of another school that meets the other criterial you list: The University of Chicago. The undergraduate total is only about 3000, and virtually all classes are very small. You get to truly engage in your education, and classes are taught by real professors (many with national and international reputations), not TAs. Most classes after first year are open to grad and undergrad students, so they are challenging. No greek presence. Dorms are organized into small units called houses, where most people make close friendships----often for life. The UofC has a rep as the anti-party school---as if that's a bad thing. You can have plenty of fun there, but it's likely to be more of the variety that someone who lists your qualifications would be more interested in than you would in drunken carousing. The school is usually ranked among the top 10 in the country. Financial aid is in good supply, and I can tell you from experience that they are interested in people with your background.
My daughter just went through this and will be a freshman at Bowdoin in the fall. You can DM me if you want some help - I have a ton of comparative info about the best (top ranked by three different sources) small (less than 2000 undergrads) liberal arts colleges I could send you. The one thing I would encourage you to do is to talk to the financial aid offices directly. Colleges like Bates, Bowdoin, Colby, Amherst, Swarthmore, Middlebury, etc., have strong endowment programs that create wonderful opportunities for strong students like you with limited financial resources to obtain academic grants -- money that doesn't have to be repaid. Do not assume that the best of the liberal arts colleges in America are not available to you without taking on enormous student loan debt. It's NOT true!
Congrats on acheiving a strong GPA in an AP curriculum! You deserve to attend the college of your dreams. Now go make it happen!
For the most part, it seems like a good college, but it has gotten a few bad reviews. Some of the things the bad ones said were:
1.) That its located in a bad neigborhood full of crime (only read this in one review.)
2.) That the people are snobby. (again only ine one, the rest said the student body was friendly.)
3.) That the student body does a lot of drugs.
I'm trying to look at some colleges far from home, and I was wanting something in the north too. Bates seems like a good school, but I would like some first hand advice.
Here is what I'm looking for in a college:
1.) Friendly profs. who are acessable and always there for you.
2.) A friendly student body that isn't super cliquey or super greek oriented.
3.) Relativly small student body. Max. 2000 people.
4.) That I'm going to get the best education possible.
5.) Small class sizes. Max. 20 people.
6.) Not a school that is heavily focused on drinking and partying.
Does Bates seem like a good fit?
OK. Here is the "staff curmudgeon".
I have a couple of questions to ask and then I will offer a tidbit of advice, having sent two children through college once upon a lifetime, and having graduated from college and graduate school myself once upon a lifetime.
Here are the questions:
1. Why do you want to go to college?
Here are my comments. They are not complicated.
1. Your GPA of 3.7 might get your resume and application read at some of the so-called "top line" colleges in the country, INCLUDING Bates.
2. Financial aid is available at almost any college. Paying for college is not as hard as it might seem, depending on how much stomach you have for carrying debt and whether or not your parents have emancipated you so you can be a single person supporting yourself when you apply for financial aid after the first year.
3. When you go to college be prepared to spend an awful lot of time alone. If the college is a party school, don't go to parties. If a school has
a huge "Greek"life, be very very careful about whether or not you take part in that or ignore it, because you will be spending an awful lot of time alone. The reason that you will be spending an awful lot of time alone, is that you will be studying very, very hard. You will be spending your time in the library, in the laboratory, and in your dorm room studdying very, very hard.
4. The reason that you will be studying very very hard is because that is the reason that you will be going to college: to earn an education. Note my word: EARN. You don't "get" an education by going to college. You EARN it and it is very, very hard work.
5. Don't worry about going to a "good" college. PLAN on going to whatever college you can get in to. Send out as many applications as you can, and then IF you get accepted to one of those schools, you can make a choice after you go and visit it. I chose the wrong one that accepted me, and didn't go to visit first. I paid for that mistake by spending two terrible years in a terrible school for ME. But I EARNED my education extremely well in making that mistake, and then finished my primary (undergraduate) education at a "good" school afterward.
6. If you have little money, or your family is not going to pay your way in to college, then go to the cheapest college that will accept you. Don't worry about whether or not you are going to a "good" college. You are: you are going to the best college that you can easily afford and your concentration will be on studying and learning, not playing and partying. Don't worry about those other students who are doing the partying and joining fraternaties: they may not be there next semester after their grades come out.
7. Don't worry about whether or not your professors are "accessible". If you have some particular need to see a professor, they will be able to meet you, or their graduate assistant or an assistant professor will be able to meet you. Don't worry any about that: they will all know more than you do and they will help you. If you need the adult leadership to be accessible, perhaps you should remain at home with your mother and father another year or so.
The professor is there to teach, and that they will do. Warm and fuzzies are very much optional, and you won't care since you will be working very, very to earn your education.
8. Don't worry about going to a small school that might not be "rated" as high as some other. The raters have no clue what you need, so they count the number of basketball hoops in the field house and the number of books in the library and "rate" each college. Don't worry about how many books any given college has in the library: if you read them all the college will get you more.
9. Don't worry about which college you go to. Ten years after you graduate no one will ask you WHERE your degree is from. If they are an employer they will only want to know what that education that you earned enables you to do for them, and that will depend on what you did with your education.
10. Don't worry about which college you go to because four years after starting out as a freshman, you will be taking your bachelor's degree WITH HONORS, and using it to get into graduate school. Because your bachelors degree is merely the first step and in order to be well employed you will need to have more initials after your name and you will earn those initials in graduate school. And if you think getting in to college might have been tough, imagine what it will be like trying to compete for graduate school admission against all those other folks like you, who earned their undergraduate education by studying and studying and studying so that the will have graduated with HONORS just like you.
When I was an undergraduate student at that awful college that I chose by error, there were half a dozen young men who were always wandering around,going from class to class and then to the library. I never saw them in the student union or the college dining hall, because they all lived off campus someplace. They also all wore freshly laundered and starched army fatigues. Except for the fact that their army fatigues had no patches or rank insignia, they could have been in army boot camp.
Those guys were also at the very top of the class academically, and when I left that college after two years, they were numbered one through ten or so among the students who were studying. They did NOT belong to a fraternity and fraternities were VERY, VERY big in that little school, and they did not socialize with anyone I knew or do any of the extracurricula things that the majority of students did.
The reason for all of that was that those guys had finished their military service and had learned in that time....two or four years....at least ONE thing that they never wanted to do again, and they knew that they would have to earn their education in order to make sure that they never did again that one thing that they had learned in the army.
You are now in the same sort of position. As you apply for college, you are competing against a whole lot of young people who have 3.7 GPAs and who are as sincere as you are. You will also compete against many young people who have spend a couple of years wearing a uniform and walking down dusty streets where there are angry people who are shooting at them. Those young people have learned one thing that they never want to do again, and they will be the class of the competition for the college slot that you seek, AND for the graduate school slot that you will need to seek later.
So by all means, apply to college. Apply to many colleges. Go to college because it is in YOUR interest to study and earn your education, and worry not at all about WHERE it is, or what sort of school it is.
Almost all the other concerns in your post are trivia and thinking of them will only interfere with your efforts at EARNING your education.
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