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Whew, it's a heavy load for a family. Thanks for the reminder that at least we're not alone in this.
The schizophrenia can be calmed by meds, from what I understand - and I truly do have sympathy for anyone struggling with this illness - even the ones who brought it on by substance abuse.
What complicates his case IS his personality disorder. I am not sure there's any fixing it. I am curious to see the effects, if any, of his meds on his personality disorder. Schizophrenic or not, like I said, he's been a complete jerk his entire life. He's really treated his family abominably. We're trying to work through our anger at those issues while trying to address his very real mental illness as well. It's hard to separate the two.
I just started attending Al Anon. Hopefully that will help me get a better grip on my own state of mind as we struggle through this as a family.
This is going to sound insensitive, but I am curious: What do you really love about him? If he has "been a jerk for years," and has treated you all badly, what do you truly "love?" How do you experience that "love?" I honestly am just curious, because I see "love" on a continuum of "like to love . . ." I know some people see it differently. M. Scott Peck sees "love" as commitment, not a feeling. Just wondering what you love about him and how you know you "love" him at this point.
If these questions aren't useful, please feel free to skip them.
This may have been stated already but a Cluster B diagnosis is NOT induced by substances of any kind. Drugs/etoh may make the traits worse but they do not make a person get this diagnosis.
This is going to sound insensitive, but I am curious: What do you really love about him? If he has "been a jerk for years," and has treated you all badly, what do you truly "love?" How do you experience that "love?" I honestly am just curious, because I see "love" on a continuum of "like to love . . ." I know some people see it differently. M. Scott Peck sees "love" as commitment, not a feeling. Just wondering what you love about him and how you know you "love" him at this point.
If these questions aren't useful, please feel free to skip them.
No, they are good questions and I am a fan of M Scott Peck and agree with him that love is a commitment.
I love my brother because when he was born and placed in my arms I committed my love to him (there is ten years age difference). I love him because we have many shared experiences growing up in the same family. I love him because in spite of his jerk ways, he is also witty and sometimes fun to be around, as long as you accept his totally self centered and histrionic take on things.
The way my love feels now is like a burned finger - very raw and sore - but it's MY finger, ya know? He is blood of my blood and flesh of my flesh. I look at him and see our parents, him as a baby, and myself in his eyes. I see a shattered man, ruined dreams and opportunities, and my heart aches for him.
If I didn't love him, my heart wouldn't hurt so badly for him. I'd be more detached, though I'm sure I'd feel empathy for many people in similar situations. But that empathy wouldn't keep me awake at night, or cause my heart to twist in my chest.
This may have been stated already but a Cluster B diagnosis is NOT induced by substances of any kind. Drugs/etoh may make the traits worse but they do not make a person get this diagnosis.
I didn't say that the Cluster B personality was induced by drugs - just to clarify. His team of doctors believes that his PARANOIA may be induced by substance abuse. The Cluster B personality disorder only further complicates things.
And really, that's the part I'm having more trouble with. Now that his meds have kicked in, and the other substances are out of his system, he doesn't seem paranoid or schizophrenic anymore - but he's still got an AWFUL, dysfunctional personality. That's my real question - CAN HE HELP THAT? How responsible can I hold him for his rudeness, manipulation, etc that comes from the personality disorder? Where does bad character leave off and biology pick up?
I don't buy that "personality disorder" bs. Like, it is a pass to act like an a-hole.
Same thing as when a diagnosis of "Borderline Personality Disorder" is labeled, pretty much "code word" for "psycho b".
I don't buy that "personality disorder" bs. Like, it is a pass to act like an a-hole.
Same thing as when a diagnosis of "Borderline Personality Disorder" is labeled, pretty much "code word" for "psycho b".
As for me, I confront it. No pass. Act like a jerk, I will flat out say, "I am done talking to you, when you say x y z".
And I have no problems with saying that. If you let him slide, he will continue to act that way.
I agree with the above. The DSM is TOTALLY MADE UP - in it, you have several "personality disorders" which are really a-hole1, 1-hole2, a-hole3 . . . in my mind, these are all character defects - the person has somehow made it pay off to be a jerk - is rewarded for it somehow OR does not learn from mistakes - not sure why that might be the case.
I don't think it is ok for people with "personality disorders" to trump everyone else, just by the virtue that they "have a disorder." Why do they get a pass on being rude? Do they enjoy people being rude to them? No, they don't - so why are they given special favors and accommodations - it just makes their behavior worse.
There is no excuse for rudeness and nastiness - I don't care what any popular groupthink psychiatrist book says to the contrary.
I don't buy that "personality disorder" bs. Like, it is a pass to act like an a-hole.
Same thing as when a diagnosis of "Borderline Personality Disorder" is labeled, pretty much "code word" for "psycho b".
As for me, I confront it. No pass. Act like a jerk, I will flat out say, "I am done talking to you, when you say x y z".
And I have no problems with saying that. If you let him slide, he will continue to act that way.
Are you saying that you do not believe that personality disorders exist, or what?
By the way, I am not looking for excuses to let him slide. I have never let him slide in the past - I've ALWAYS called BS on him or established my own personal boundaries. Not that it's ever really done any good. All it's basically meant is that when he steps out of line, I remove myself from his presence - or have him removed from mine (I've had to call the police on him twice).
Regardless of cause, or whatever, I always ask "So what's the application?" Regardless of whether or not he is fully responsible for his actions, I still have to deal with his actions - and I know I do not have to tolerate verbal abuse (or any kind of abuse) from him. My question though is one of empathy, or searching for understanding, and trying to determine just how "hardline" I need to be with him, or whether or not there is hope for meaningful change with him in the future.
No, they are good questions and I am a fan of M Scott Peck and agree with him that love is a commitment.
I love my brother because when he was born and placed in my arms I committed my love to him (there is ten years age difference). I love him because we have many shared experiences growing up in the same family. I love him because in spite of his jerk ways, he is also witty and sometimes fun to be around, as long as you accept his totally self centered and histrionic take on things.
The way my love feels now is like a burned finger - very raw and sore - but it's MY finger, ya know? He is blood of my blood and flesh of my flesh. I look at him and see our parents, him as a baby, and myself in his eyes. I see a shattered man, ruined dreams and opportunities, and my heart aches for him.
If I didn't love him, my heart wouldn't hurt so badly for him. I'd be more detached, though I'm sure I'd feel empathy for many people in similar situations. But that empathy wouldn't keep me awake at night, or cause my heart to twist in my chest.
I have a few similar personalities in my family (similar in that they have "issues" and a some of them seem to be different people than they once were) . . . I grapple with the attachment to "the old person" and the difficulty relating to the "new person." I don't even know if the old person still exists or has been overridden by the new person and how all that works.
All I know is that these are not reciprocal relationships - how much does he love you or your parents?
In my case, I am rebelling against the unfairness of it all - the nice people shouldn't have to suffer . . .I know it sounds simplistic, but that's how I feel after going through Hell.
I have a few similar personalities in my family (similar in that they have "issues" and a some of them seem to be different people than they once were) . . . I grapple with the attachment to "the old person" and the difficulty relating to the "new person." I don't even know if the old person still exists or has been overridden by the new person and how all that works.
All I know is that these are not reciprocal relationships - how much does he love you or your parents?
In my case, I am rebelling against the unfairness of it all - the nice people shouldn't have to suffer . . .I know it sounds simplistic, but that's how I feel after going through Hell.
He shows very little affection to any of us - but he DOES occasionally. It's like we see glimmers of what could be there.
The point I'm at is that I am not responsible for his actions, only for my own. I cannot change him or cure him. That's totally up to him. All I'm trying to do is make sure my head is on straight when dealing with him.
I realize that it's my CHOICE as to whether or not I ever visit him, or call him, or write to him. I am choosing right now to visit him a few times a month. I'm not going to let him be blatantly rude to me, and I'm going to call his hand if he starts trying to manipulate me or my emotions (I've already had to do that on my first visit - and he calmed on down).
I'm just trying to understand where his head is, how he's feeling, IF he's feeling, etc. I'm trying to do the right thing, whether he does so or not.
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