Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Mexico
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 12-03-2009, 12:35 PM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 11,441,592 times
Reputation: 1463

Advertisements

The spanish language is strong and thousand-year-old like the vampires.

Over the centuries the language has became stronger because of it's simple structure and the easiness to go from spoken to written language.

AP
El universal
Guadalajara, thursday 03 december 2009



It's birth was around one thousand and four hundred years ago, and it has survived, becoming stronger over the centuries.

It's not a popular vampire, it is the spanish language whose origins come from the Castilla and Leon zone in the center of Spain, and that is now spoken by more than 400 million people in the world.

"Spanish is a thousand-year-old language. We are documentng it's origins in the VI century. This means that the language has lasted for 1,400 years" stated Gonzalo Santonja, who participates in the international book fair in Guadalajara.

"It all began when castillian was a very small language in the center of the iberian peninsula, then it became the language of all Spain, then it went overseas and became the language of all America, and now it's expanding in the United States" he pointed.

But how this happened and why?

The expert assures that it has to do with many factors, one of them like it's simple structure that makes it very easy to go from spoken to written language, unlike french or english whose phonetics and grammar vary greatly.

"Besides, the language has been decisively enriched because we represent the origins, but those who have made spanish great are the people that decided by their own will to feel, love, enjoy, worry and be happy in this language" and leave a written proof, in diferent genres, Santonja assured.

Another factor is the easiness to adopt different modalities and being flexible. Instead of rejecting them and becoming static, the spanish language has guaranteed it's growth and extension because their inhabitants are capable of adopting changes.

Spanish Phrases that are understood in Latinamerica and viceversa and that soon are used in both sides of the Atlantic make people "feel comfortable speaking spanish, regardless they learnt it in Colombia or Chile".

"This shouldn't be perceived as negative, we should think that some words are a different solution than yours. Then it's important to think why it is given and which one is the most plastic, which one is the most adequate to the circumstances and from there we make an integration norm.

Santonja affirmed that besides all this spanish is a "really good sounding language, that has thousands of hues and infinity of entries... and it has an enormous depth with thousands of millions of terms.

Because of this in communities in the United States with strong hispanic immigration like Los Ángeles or New York, it feels alive and in expansion.

According to the expert, many of the people who feel obliged to travel to the United States to improve their quality of life and that of their families, could leave their language behind by feeling expelled from their countries or by feeling that they don't owe them nothing because of the deplorable living conditions they had.

However, they decided to cling to this language instead of loosing it, which is an admirable phenomenon.

To his perception, the denominated spanglish that mixes english and spanish, more than a deformation of the language is an evidence of that attachment to the roots: instead of entirely embracing the language of the place where they live, they keep spanish alive in their homes and with the people close to them.

"Spanish wins the battle because it has always been an street language" ,Santonja stated

However, he said that we need to keep working hard to preserve those one thousand four hundred years of history. And the first thing we should do is to solve poverty and consolidate democracy so people can channel their energies in cultivating their culture, reading and worrying about speaking, reading and thinking properly in their language instead of surviving with dignity.

"The future is solidly marked, but we need to solve the situation of social injustice that prevails in many of the inhabitants of the spanish language", he concluded "This has to be solved for everyone's sake".

Translated from Idioma español, milenario y fuerte como los vampiros - El Universal - Cultura
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-04-2009, 03:49 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,138 posts, read 22,835,296 times
Reputation: 14116
So why is Spanish "vampiric"?

It nice that it stayed or or less the same for so long though. I can easily read documents from the 1500's with my average spanish but can't make heads from tails of English documents until the 1700's
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-05-2009, 08:41 AM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,752,438 times
Reputation: 22474
"Spanish wins the battle because it has always been an street language" ,Santonja stated


I've seen people from Spain and from Mexico City equally horrified by the Spanish they hear in the USA. One guy from Mexico City said "If this is how they're going to speak Spanish, they should just forget it and try to learn some English". He was disgusted by phrases like "oagoncita" for station wagon, and "esta working", "da me la pencil".

I've heard radio stations mocking how Spanish is becoming -- filled with worlds like "jelo", "o que" as an answer to a question or command, even phrases like "por plis" and "hasta la bai bai". I don't think anyone questions "lonche" or "yonke" any more and "troca" seems to have replaced "camion" even in much of Mexico.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 11:32 AM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 11,441,592 times
Reputation: 1463
Hehehehe that's true, although troca is more popular in northern Mexico than here in the center of the country, where people will mock you if you speak like that.

However that hibridization with other languages is nothing new for the Spanish language, this has happened since the Arabs invaded Spain for centuries, but also because of languages like Basque (which is completely different from any other language in the region) enriched spanish which has characteristics that make it unique compared to other european languages that come from latin, Spanish also suffered an hibridization with italian and portuguese which created Argentinian and Uruguaian spanish that while still spanish is very different compared to the rest of the spanish speaking countries.

As long as the Spanish language academies continue to exist the language will be preserved without significant deformations but it will continue to evolve and grow.

Something I found very interesting is that Spain uses english words in their day to day vocabulary too, the expression me flipa is quite common there, this expression comes from flip out.

Este trafico me flipa = This traffic is flipping me out.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 11:48 AM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 11,441,592 times
Reputation: 1463
Expert points out virtues of the spanish language.

The director of the Chilean language academy says that there is no other language that has a map as detailed as the spanish language.

The new grammar constitutes a reference for our linguistical and idiomatical behaviors.

EFE
El Universal
Santiago de Chile Sunday 06 of december 2009

11:08 There is no other language in the world that has a map as detailed as the spanish language, stated today the director of the Chilean language academy, Alfredo Matus, when referring to the new grammar that will be announced officialy the next thursday in Madrid.

"The great characteristic of the spanish language is unity among diversity; this grammar caters to that diversity, that is prestigious and it isn't just a mere local diversity" he expressed in his statements to Efe.

The new grammar of the Spanish Language, that will be announced officialy on december 10 in Madrid, is the fruit of eleven years of work in the twenty two Academies of the Spanish Language and reflects for the first time the spanish that unites the four hundred millions of spanish speakers and also what makes them different.

The launch of this work "Is really a great news for the countries who speak spanish, great news for our culture and language that is the third in importance in the world", Matus pointed.

The director of the Chilean language academy will be the host of the V International congress of the Spanish Language, that will be held in the city of Valparaíso on march and that will have in the new grammar one of their main novelties.

This work "is one of the fundamental codes, it constitutes a references for our linguistic and idiomatic behaviors and the teaching of spanish as our first language" he pointed.

The former, he pointed was a grammar made "In the street of Felipe IV number 4 in Madrid" , where the venue of the Royal Academy of the spanish language is located" whereas this one "can be defined as the first authentically panhispanic".

"Now all the idiomatic problems are focused from the entire hispanic world, this is it's importance" , he added.

To Alfredo Matus, "there is no doubt that the new 'Grammar' will place the spanish language in a privileged position among the great languages of the world".

"The spanish language in this moment has a grammatical code of great dimensions. There is no other language in the world in this moment that has a description made with such respect to all it's varieties like spanish" he emphasized.

"Spanish is an standarized language, that since centuries ago deserves a planified development", the linguist explained.

According to Matus, "There is no other language in the world that in this moment has a real map -like the new 'Grammar' has been defined. taking into account all it's varieties".

"The Royal Spanish language academy, and the american academies are focused in working for the unity of language, what means to assure the normalization of it's uses in the great codes, like this new Grammar" he concluded.

Translated from: Experto destaca virtudes del español - El Universal - Cultura
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-15-2009, 02:15 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 5,048,663 times
Reputation: 482
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
"Spanish wins the battle because it has always been an street language" ,Santonja stated


I've seen people from Spain and from Mexico City equally horrified by the Spanish they hear in the USA. One guy from Mexico City said "If this is how they're going to speak Spanish, they should just forget it and try to learn some English". He was disgusted by phrases like "oagoncita" for station wagon, and "esta working", "da me la pencil".

I've heard radio stations mocking how Spanish is becoming -- filled with worlds like "jelo", "o que" as an answer to a question or command, even phrases like "por plis" and "hasta la bai bai". I don't think anyone questions "lonche" or "yonke" any more and "troca" seems to have replaced "camion" even in much of Mexico.
"por plis" is just another slang. I use it all the time, here and in Mexico but only around friends. I dont dare talk like that infront of my parents, church or any other public important place. Each place whether Mexico City, rural Mexico or the US, each one has its own use of slang. The problem, IMO, is when the person does not know what is slang and what is correct Spanish. There are appropriate and unappropriate places and times to use slang, I think.

"camion" is mostly used for bus. I use "camioneta" for truck.

One of my biggest pet peeves is when people use "parqueo" or "parqueadero" instead of estacionamiento, which is the correct word. In LA, I have seen big huge signs with those words.

Very interesting article TF. I love reading about language. Thanks
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Mexico
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top