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Old 12-14-2010, 09:04 AM
 
276 posts, read 793,102 times
Reputation: 184

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mt-7 View Post
Oh boy
The world has found Montana.
When hubs was a kid he too had his hunting rife in the pickup in Oregon. No longer. Kids are kicked out of schools now with blank check offenses. No consideration to the student, current grade standing, nothing.
This is sad but it is the beginning. So sorry to read this.

Can someone keep us advised?
Well, I've seen it all as an educator. I suppose that the problem would be the "Columbine Syndrome" where teachers are told to be aware of guns near the school grounds. I'm still looking for a teaching position in MT, but I guess that I'm too old, too educated and too conservative!
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Old 12-14-2010, 09:30 AM
 
Location: NW Montana
451 posts, read 999,767 times
Reputation: 385
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mt-7 View Post
Oh boy

Can someone keep us advised?
I toldja so.... :

The Daily Interlake (Kalispell)

Top Story (http://www.dailyinterlake.com/top_story - broken link)


http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/dailyinterlake.com/content/tncms/assets/editorial/2/ce/b80/2ceb8040-072a-11e0-8dc7-001cc4c002e0-revisions/4d06d6df08e49.preview-100.jpg (broken link)

Columbia Falls girl back in school
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
8,090 posts, read 15,167,694 times
Reputation: 3740
Good to see Montanans turn out in the girl's support.

Good example of how "zero tolerance" policies are actually "kneejerk turn-your-brain-off and do as the nanny in D.C. tells you" policies, and ALWAYS have unintended consequences that most negatively impact the most honest upstanding students (and other citizens).

I hope that when the girl comes of voting age, she remembers that leftwing policies handed down from D.C. directly caused her anguish.

Thomas Jefferson's famous quote, "If we were directed from Washington when to sow and when to reap, we would soon want for bread," doesn't apply only to farmers, but to all aspects of life.
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
8,090 posts, read 15,167,694 times
Reputation: 3740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floridahater View Post
Well, I've seen it all as an educator. I suppose that the problem would be the "Columbine Syndrome" where teachers are told to be aware of guns near the school grounds. I'm still looking for a teaching position in MT, but I guess that I'm too old, too educated and too conservative!
No, no, come hither quickly; Montana needs all the conservative counterbalancing it can get!

As to Columbine, what most people are blithely unaware is that this (and all other incidents of its type) wasn't a "massacre". It was a loud, messy suicide, where they acted out the common juvenile revenge fantasy of "I'll show them! I'll make them pay for what they did to me! They'll be sorry when I'm gone!" which nearly all kids have at some point, but few are sufficiently driven to act upon.

I swear, there's a Stupid Gene that turns on when people have kids of their own, that makes them forget how much it sucked to be a kid, let alone how kids THINK.
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:37 AM
 
22,768 posts, read 30,745,293 times
Reputation: 14745
Quote:
(A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.

(B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—
(i) on private property not part of school grounds;
(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
(iii) that is— (I) not loaded; and (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;
(v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;
(vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity; or
(vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.
now i'm no lawya

but if the gun was unloaded and locked in her trunk, it should be OK under federal law, correct?
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
8,090 posts, read 15,167,694 times
Reputation: 3740
Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
but if the gun was unloaded and locked in her trunk, it should be OK under federal law, correct?
Yes, and that was exactly Gary Marbut's point -- the girl was in total compliance with federal law and the school drastically overstepped its bounds, essentially making law of its own on the spot (which I believe is prohibited by state law at that, does anyone better recall the statute I'm half-remembering?)

Zero tolerance means zero common sense, too.
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Old 12-14-2010, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Nebraska
4,530 posts, read 8,870,515 times
Reputation: 7602
What State or Federal Laws did she violate? If it would have been a handgun she would have to be 21 to possess it. As far as I know that is not Montana Law (I don't live there but I spend time there). Is there a State Law in Montana against having a gun on school property? Not the parking law but in the school?

Go to the NJ , Mass and other forums and follow the gun discussions on those boards. I am convinced we have too many LIBERAL F***ing idiots for this country to survive. I was hoping Montana was one of the few states left that would be a haven of freedom. If this young girl is punished it will be time to get rid of some school officials and board members.

GL2
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Old 12-14-2010, 02:25 PM
 
Location: NW Montana
6,259 posts, read 14,681,199 times
Reputation: 3460
Glad it seems to be getting worked out.
However I bet that district refines it's policy and the next kid might be in more trouble.
Times are changing.
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Old 12-14-2010, 02:35 PM
 
9,341 posts, read 29,693,899 times
Reputation: 4573
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mt-7 View Post
Glad it seems to be getting worked out.
May be, may be not.


Here is another update from Gary Marbut ...

Dear MSSA Friends,

Pasted below is a report from Sean Frampton, Demari's attorney, about
Demari's school board expulsion hearing last evening.

Although the school board voted unanimously to not expel Demari, I am
disappointed that she is on probation and her record will only be
cleared at the end of the school year if she has no further
violations. I do not believe this incident was a violation (except a
violation of Demari by school administrators). Continuing probation
implies that Demari did something wrong. I don't like that implication.

Also, I've heard no reports that the school board will address the
mistakes made by their employees, school administrators, or seek to
revise their flawed school policy that is at variance with federal law.

BTW, I have finished drafting a bill to fix state law to prevent
further occurrences like this. That draft has been delivered to
requesting legislators. Expect that bill to be introduced into the
upcoming legislative session and to be added to MSSA's already
extensive legislative agenda.

Gary Marbut, president
Montana Shooting Sports Association
author, Gun Laws of Montana

=====================


The meeting ended with a good result for Demari. More
than 75 people showed up in support of Demari at a location that was
changed at the last minute to accommodate the expected large
crowds. Approximately 10 to 15 picketers with signs such as "Free
Demari" were standing outside of the hearing place. The local and
regional print and television media also attended.


The hearing began with the school's position. Of
particular note was the Principal's recitation of the number of times
that the policy had been communicated to the students, including a
review by the teacher on the first day of class and specific
announcements during hunting season.


Demari told her story to the Board herself. She
testified consistently with the position communicated in the
media. I then spoke to the legal issues. My main point was that
Montana never intended to "trap" kids with this law. I found two
instances in the legislative record where representatives inquired
and satisfied themselves that the proposed bill (now statute) would
not trap them. One such legislature said "he does not want to see
rural kids with a .22 in the back of their truck trapped by the
bill." Another asked if a student "could bring a truck with a gun in
a gun rack and park it there all day." In both instances, the
response to their inquiry was that a hunting rifle "wouldn't be a
concern of this legislation." I then addressed the exception in
federal law that the Gun Free School Act "shall [not] apply to a
firearm that is lawfully stored inside a locked vehicle on school
property." 20 USCS 7151.


Two other interesting points I raised were that when
a school teacher, in reviewing the policies, instructed Demari and
other students to just call the principal if they accidently leave a
hunting rifle in the car and they will be allowed to take it home
and, impliedly, without punishment, such a statement constituted an
oral policy that was different and less strict than their written
policies. Also, I argued that the school officials did not follow
their own policy which requires that prior to dispensing disciplinary
action, the school authorities shall consider extenuating circumstances.


Larry Wilson, the only NRA member on the Board of
Trustees, moved to deny the expulsion, have Demari's record and her
suspension expunged at the end of the year, be readmitted immediately
into school, and given all of the assistance necessary to catch up on
her homework and be allowed to take her exams. Superintended
Nicosia, who initially had recommended expulsion, withdrew his
recommendation and stated that he will do everything within his power
to help Demari make up her work. The Board unanimously passed the motion.


At one point in the hearing, Demari became very
emotional. The issue was whether this suspension would affect
Demari's ability to enter college. The Principal said that he spoke
to a number of schools, including the University of Montana where
Demari wants to go, and represented that this suspension will not
hurt her education. Demari asked her attorney (for permission - GM)
to speak and when she spoke, she became very emotional about how this
has already affected her chances because she has at least two F
grades due to her inability to take mid-term exams. The school
authorities assured her that they would do everything necessary to help her.


Eleven people spoke in public comment. All were in
favor of Demari. Most speakers received applause after their
comments. Tom Opre, a Board member of the Montana Shooting Sports
Association, received an applause when he said that the school
district needed "common sense policies." Fred Hodgebloom generated
applause when he said the motion should be amended to give Demari an
apology and to suspend the school officials for their conduct. Two
representatives from the Montana legislature were present and in
support of Demari. Jerry O'Neil, who represents the district which
comprises Columbia Falls, advised that he currently has a place
holder for a bill and would be willing to sponsor a bill to amend the
laws to make them more clear.
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Old 12-14-2010, 02:52 PM
 
Location: NW Montana
6,259 posts, read 14,681,199 times
Reputation: 3460
I am sure it is not over...
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