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Thread summary:

Forensic accountant: New Jersey, debt, loan, interest.

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Old 12-10-2008, 10:04 AM
 
5,340 posts, read 13,951,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sofietrt View Post
The way to make this madness stop is to stop spending more than what one takes in. But that would hurt a lot of folks in the short term, and votes would be lost among other things.

What do you do when your revenues no longer generate the cash needed to meet current obligations and you continue to meet those obligations? Borrow... or I should say borrow against the future. Countries do it... states do it... individuals do it.

New Jersey's fiscal probs regarding borrowing are only a piece of its messy puzzle. You have other flaws in strategy such as making unrealistic assumptions of returns on investments that have led to declining revenues, coupled with reducing tax revenues due to population losses etc. etc. on top of which spending has not adjusted to such lower revenues. Therein lies the rub... New Jersey is bankrupt. Period. It's a done deal. You continue to spend more than you have and do not make up for it at some point with increasing revenue... at some point you will go bankrupt whether you be a country, a state, or an individual.

Japan's economy is in trouble... heck Britain is headed for bankruptcy if it doesn't stop its "madness"! etc. etc.

There's more to it than government corruption or political agendas. The powers that be in corporations who for the most part are not regulated have run their companies into the ground for short-term monetary gain strictly for themselves, it's true. And yet plenty of individuals live way beyond their means out of that same materialistic mindset, and borrow borrow borrow in maxing out their credit cards and living in houses they really cannot afford if they were to save for the future sufficiently. And some people just get caught... they don't necessarily live beyond their means but something catastrophic hits them like illness and medical bills that pile up they cannot afford... yet still they too go bankrupt because what they bring in is not enough to pay their obligations off that exponentially increase with finance charges etc etc.

I think we will see unprecedented fallout in 2009. The job losses piling up in the US alone are staggering! Where will all these displaced workers go to work? Population shifts create additional problems for both the exit and entering states. You can dream about "green economies" all you want but tooling up for that takes time so that in the short term it won't put food on a table or shelter over a family's head.

A younger friend of mine is thinking of going back to grad school, as they are facing most likely being let go from their present job. And yet this friend is trying to figure out how to pay for that schooling and have a place to live and something to eat daily without a paycheck coming in. A co-worker suggested taking out a loan (which is fine if you can get one for extending your education) but also getting some credit cards to use??? <head shaking> Enough said.

According to the numbers and generally understood economic benchmarks for depression, the US is not that bad off presently. Yet we are in a very deep recession that for some people does function more or less like a depression... for example people who cannot find work for an extended period of time such as longer than a year and whose unemployment benefits have run out and what now? When you have the size of bubble in the stock market and real estate and incomes there has been AND that has been kept up for so long, when the inevitable downturn finally happens it's not the kind of correction you have with a typical recession. It's a huge correction and we have not bottomed out yet... no way.

Truth is... no one can say just exactly when this ride (or the madness) will end. Yet as that great actress Bette Davis said with certainty, playing the character Margo Channing in the movie All About Eve, "Fasten your seatbelts. It's going to be a bumpy ride."

EXCELLENT post! +1
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Old 12-10-2008, 10:46 AM
 
96 posts, read 236,993 times
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Originally Posted by EEEPNJ View Post
EXCELLENT post! +1
Thanks. :-) When you make extremely risky loans to enough people, collecting lots of interest in the short term mind you, and yet those defaults start rolling in like an avalanche, you have Citibank laying off 53,000 etc. etc. The big guys have already lined their pockets along with the golden parachute for which they already negotiated for themselves as well, as the ax really falls on the little guys, the workers. I can say this because my father was in business, a top executive, and even when adjusting for inflation/col, he did not make nearly the kind of money these guys today make. It's blows my mind... the greed! Then you have defaults on obligations (on the personal level loans, credit cards, taxes owed, etc.) that get "forgiven" which just compounds the problem. Never mind the kind of "forgiveness" that gets extended to larger entities like countries or even states. I'm not making a value judgment here when saying this... (ie. third world economies) just stating the fact that the balance sheets don't balance. What is needed is auditing but then enforcement.

I do my best to be financially responsible (because I am fortunate in that regard and actually have something to manage), therefore having the luxury to focus beyond survival (unlike many for whom that is a daily struggle) and on what's important which are the people in my life.

What do we take with us beyond the grave? I won't take what's left of my money (if there is anything left LOL!) but I know I will take the wealth that comes from having been loved in this life.

Okay... I'll stop being mushy.
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Old 12-10-2008, 11:50 AM
 
96 posts, read 236,993 times
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Originally Posted by sofietrt View Post
... you have Citibank laying off 53,000 etc. etc.
Okay this just in... just got off the fone with a friend living in NJ and working in Manhattan... one of the i-banks on Mad Ave (ehm ehm) announcing layoffs today... three cubes away a Director... gone... too expensive to keep but he knew that already. A woman in Admin on the other side of the bullpen... gone. Mood downshifting to the extreme... lots of sad, scared faces is reported. My friend walking along now with other co-workers to a restaurant to meet with their recruiter. Stay tuned.

I bet twitter is all a twitter.

It's not over.

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Old 12-10-2008, 12:00 PM
 
96 posts, read 236,993 times
Reputation: 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by sofietrt View Post
Okay this just in... just got off the fone with a friend living in NJ and working in Manhattan... one of the i-banks on Mad Ave (ehm ehm) announcing layoffs today... three cubes away a Director... gone... too expensive to keep but he knew that already. A woman in Admin on the other side of the bullpen... gone. Mood downshifting to the extreme... lots of sad, scared faces is reported. My friend walking along now with other co-workers to a restaurant to meet with their recruiter. Stay tuned.

I bet twitter is all a twitter.

It's not over.

It is said 6 employees from the above said bank and group who moved from New Jersey to North Carolina thinking they'd be "safe," ... now also without a job having been told this today.
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