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I realize that monthly maintenance fees can vary depending on several factors, but is there any general rule of thumb to calculate a rough guide, especially for units in buildings on the UES?
For example, on the Miami market, which I know best, a rough guide in the upscale market is around 75 cents per square foot per month.
Similar for annual property taxes. Any basic rule of thumb based on purchase price or assessed value? Again, in Miami a conservative rule of thumb is 2% of purchase price.
Usually the terminology is different depending on whether you are looking at a co-op or a condo. Only co-ops have "maintenance" called as such and it includes TAXES (the apartment's share of the the total tax on the building).
Condos have "home owner association fees" or "HOA" and do NOT include taxes which are levied directly by the city on the condo owner just like a freestanding house,
So you must define which you are asking about becasue that tax item can be considerable or it may be an abated trifle.
Unique to a co-op is that most buildings carry an IMMENSE mortgage on the corporation that all co-opters buy into. This is different from a condo where the only debt is the one incurred by the buyer. The Co-opter essentially buys into TWO debts. Again, this can range from small monthly costs to HUGE costs.
Some hideously expensive co-ops with no underlying debt in the best neighborhoods pay low maintenance and some dumps pay exorbitant fees, often because the debt load is so high.
The cost of both types of occupancy depend SO much on the staffing of buildings...24 hour doormen are costly as are handymen and porters standing ready to take your garbage out and recyclables downstairs.
SOme co-ops even have single meter electricity so your electricity is paid by your maintenance fee. I think this is rare in condos.
And then there are special ASSESSMENTS in both cases
when a building needs repointing or a half milllion dollar elevator goes phlooey.
What I am driving at is that it is very hard to generalize, but going out on a limb would say that a co-op here will GENERALLY cost a little MORE than 2% per annum of the purchased price...but then your real estate taxes are paid.
But then I have a friend who got a 4 room coop in Rego Park for $50K at the bottom of the market...but she is paying about 20% of that amount annually (a little over $800 a month.) Since that is her taxes, her heat, cooking gas and electricity...no doormen, it is a bargain no matter the high percentage.
So it's a crapshoot.
And now you know probably as much as when you asked the question.
Last edited by Kefir King; 05-14-2012 at 05:05 PM..
Well, thanks for taking a stab at it. I knew that there are differences between co-ops and condos, but I did not realize how significant.
But now at least I know that one has to seriously research a building's ownership structure and its finances before understanding the true meaning of an advertised purchase price.
What you can count on is that since low monthly costs are so desirable, there is an inverse relationship between maintenance cost (or HOA) and purchase price.
I have a friend trying to unload a beautiful best-part-of-the- village one bedroom co-op at a reasonable price but her VERY high (well over $2K/month) monthly maintenance charge is scaring everyone away.
I'd like to refloat this thread, and ask the question in a more targeted manner. Specifcally, for co-ops only, what is considered a reasonable maintenance fee on a per square foot basis?
Back in the old days it used to be around $1/sqft. However, as expenses (mostly, but not limited to property taxes, have skyrocketed), I don't think this holds any more. So what's a good, up to date value? Brokers are especially invited to reply.
square ft really won't mean much in a co-op . it really depends on the outstanding mortgage on the building since that can be a major part of your maintenance fee..
assuming two identical buildings.
the bigger the outstanding mortgage on the building the larger the maintenance charge and the cheaper the apartment. the smaller the mortgage on the building the more the apartment will cost.
other things like reserve account funding and flip taxes to defray costs matter too.
there are just so many variables I don't see how you can come up with a number
If someone is looking to buy an apartment, they generally consider the maintenance on a square foot basis. Below a certain number is considered low, above it, high. This is sort of a city standard thing. Like I said, it used to be $1/sqft. But that was a long time ago. I want to know what that is now.
It's 2.0 now. 2 dollars per square foot per month. You can thank the city raising property taxes hard from 2009-2012 and wages for union doormen (inclusive of health care and pensions) rising faster than inflation.
Of course, this is an average with a wide range- it will vary depending on how large your building is, whether there is retail revenue to offset, etc, etc.
I don't see that working out even in the ball-park on the buildings I know
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