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Wrong. Any vehicle parked in a "free space" for over 7 days will be subject to tickets/towing.
That is only enforced when a vehicle lacks proper registration/plates. Plenty of people in this city leave their cars parked at the same location for extended periods. It might be a law, but hardly enforced.
At the same time public transportation has priority over a personal automobile. Or do you suggest we remove bus stops too?
I would personally like to see more docks removed from the sidewalks and installed on the street.
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Bicycles want to share the road and therefore should follow the same rules as other vehicles.
Bicycles are different and require adjustments to the rules. Many rules make sense, however some need to be updated.
Bicyclist do not want to be in the streets with drivers in this city either, however we have no choice in most cases. Exceptions being greenways and protected paths.
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Red lights and stop signs were created for all vehicles on the road to protect pedestrians/other vehicles.
Yes, however it has been proven in traffic studies that it is safer to allow bicyclist to yield at red lights and roll through stop signs. You should read the link I provided. Different kind of vehicle, different needs.
I am not suggesting that bicyclist blow through stop signs and red lights. I do suggest a yield in order to safely cross the intersection.
The three most common impacts between bicycles and automobiles are dooring, same direction automobile right turn at the intersection at green, and opposite vehicle left turn collision at green.
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When you keep breaking traffic laws its hard to take you seriously regardless if you think bicycles are safer (which I don't agree with).
One person killed by a bicycle in NYC in 10 years, thousands by automobiles. Fact.
There are numerous statistics available that compare bicyclist fatalities in this city to those that drive or pedestrians. Bicycling is safe.
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Also a light doesn't turn green right away after a light turns red on the other side. The bicyclist ran the yellow very late in order for the car to be moving with a green.
Actually, lights turn green on the opposite side relatively quickly. Which is why when the light turns green you often still have traffic crossing the intersection.
Exactly why delayed reds should be more common in areas with high traffic and pedestrian volumes. The whole point of delayed reds are that the light often changes to quickly.
Actually for simplicity, let's replace that bicycle collision with an automobile. If an automobile enters the intersection at yellow, and is hit by another perpendicular one once the light turns green. Who is at fault?
Or a pedestrian is crossing but doesn't male it to the end before the walk signal changes, and gets hit. Who's at fault?
Wouldn't you wait for a clear intersection? Or like most drivers in Manhattan, frustrated by heavy pedestrian densities at the crosswalk did that person floor it to save some time?
Last edited by nykiddo718718; 06-08-2013 at 05:13 PM..
That is only enforced when a vehicle lacks proper registration/plates. Plenty of people in this city leave their cars parked at the same location for extended periods. It might be a law, but hardly enforced.
At the same time public transportation has priority over a personal automobile. Or do you suggest we remove bus stops too?
Bicycles are different and require adjustments to the rules. Many rules make sense, however some need to be updated.
Bicyclist do not want to be in the streets with drivers in this city either, however we have no choice in most cases. Exceptions being greenways and protected paths.
Yes, however it has been proven in traffic studies that it is safer to allow bicyclist to yield at red lights and roll through stop signs. You should read the link I provided. Different kind of vehicle, different needs.
I am not suggesting that bicyclist blow through stop signs and red lights. I do suggest a yield in order to safely cross the intersection.
The three most common impacts between bicycles and automobiles are dooring, same direction automobile right turn at the intersection at green, and opposite vehicle left turn collision at green.
One person killed by a bicycle in NYC in 10 years, thousands by automobiles. Fact.
There are numerous statistics available that compare bicyclist fatalities in this city to those that drive or pedestrians. Bicycling is safe.
Actually, lights turn green on the opposite side relatively quickly. Which is why when the light turns green you often have traffic still crossing the intersection.
Exactly why delayed reds should be more common in areas with high traffic and pedestrian volumes.
Actually for simplicity, let's replace that bicycle with an automobile. If an automobile enters the intersection at yellow, and is hit by another perpendicular one once the light turns green. Who is at fault?
Or a pedestrian is crossing but doesn't male it to the end before the walk signal changes, and gets hit. Who's at fault?
If a driver has a green light he wouldn't be at fault. Also bus stops and citibike stands are complete different.
Bus stops actually allow a vehicle to be standing/parking for a short period of time while the citibike stand completely takes over the spot. The bus stop makes it multi purpose, citibike just takes over.
Also just because the law regarding 7 day parking is not enforced doesn't mean it's not a law. The car can have plates and tags and still be ticketed/towed once a complaint has been made with 311.
I don't see a scenario where a driver passes a yellow on time and gets hit by a vehicle at green in manhattan. This scenario would be specifically a driver rushing down a road with a red light noticing the other side turning red to not slow down while a driver on the opposite is rushing to beat a yellow turning to red.
You said it yourself bicycles are different from automobiles, the cyclist was foolish to try and run the yellow.
If a driver has a green light he wouldn't be at fault. Also bus stops and citibike stands are complete different.
So if a bus is still peaking out of an intersection (buses are long, it's rolling past) and you hit it, the bus driver is at fault? Despite entering that intersection during the authorized time?
You are supposed to wait until an intersection is clear before proceeding. Alternatively, there would be accidents everywhere because people always block the box. Especially in areas with heavy traffic like where this occurred.
And you drive, sheesh! When I do drive, I wouldn't just slam into things in front of me. I also always wait for cross traffic to completely stop or quickly decelerating. Screw the honking.
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Bus stops actually allow a vehicle to be standing/parking for a short period of time while the citibike stand completely takes over the spot. The bus stop makes it multi purpose, citibike just takes over.
It's a no standing zone and you have 2 minutes max. You can only pick up or unload passengers. If a bus comes you can be ticketed immediately.
A Citi Bike dock is barely an obstacle. A person can easy walk through a row of bicycles. No bus stops were replaced by Citi Bike stations, only private vehicle parking and no standing zones.
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Also just because the law regarding 7 day parking is not enforced doesn't mean it's not a law. The car can have plates and tags and still be ticketed/towed once a complaint has been made with 311.
That's true. Still, a Citi Bike station is less of an obsticle to cross then a parked car. Again, it reclaims public space for public use. It's a more efficient use of space.
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I don't see a scenario where a driver passes a yellow on time and gets hit by a vehicle at green in manhattan. This scenario would be specifically a driver rushing down a road with a red light noticing the other side turning red to not slow down while a driver on the opposite is rushing to beat a yellow turning to red.
Scenario: Automobile enters intersection on yellow at slow speed due to traffic ahead. Midtown; everyday, all the time.
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You said it yourself bicycles are different from automobiles, the cyclist was foolish to try and run the yellow.
A misjudgment on both sides. Wasn't there, but she should have stopped considering she didn't make it. Wide intersection. However the driver screwed up too by proceeding before the intersection was clear. Having a much greater potential to cause damage, loss of life or injury he should be held to stiffer judgment.
Last edited by nykiddo718718; 06-08-2013 at 05:40 PM..
When you keep breaking traffic laws its hard to take you seriously regardless if you think bicycles are safer (which I don't agree with).
Also a light doesn't turn green right away after a light turns red on the other side. The bicyclist ran the yellow very late in order for the car to be moving with a green.
You continue to demonstrate ignorance of the traffic laws you insist bicyclists are breaking. It's perfectly legal to enter the intersection on yellow. And traffic entering on green must yield the right of way to traffic already in the intersection
24 S 1111(a)(1)
Traffic, except pedestrians, facing a steady circular green signal
may proceed straight through or turn right or left unless a sign at such
place prohibits either such turn. Such traffic, including when turning
right or left, shall yield the right of way to other traffic lawfully
within the intersection or an adjacent crosswalk at the time such signal
is exhibited.
You continue to demonstrate ignorance of the traffic laws you insist bicyclists are breaking. It's perfectly legal to enter the intersection on yellow. And traffic entering on green must yield the right of way to traffic already in the intersection
24 S 1111(a)(1)
Traffic, except pedestrians, facing a steady circular green signal
may proceed straight through or turn right or left unless a sign at such
place prohibits either such turn. Such traffic, including when turning
right or left, shall yield the right of way to other traffic lawfully
within the intersection or an adjacent crosswalk at the time such signal
is exhibited.
Yeah, I'm still scratching my head how the bicyclist would be at fault. I own a car and drive in manhattan a handful of times. As a driver I've come to expect cars, cyclist running lights, just as much as pedestrians running through traffic. As a pedestrian, I hate cyclist that ride on sidewalks, or purposely blast through red lights, weaving through folks on the crosswalk.
I signed up for an citi annual membership and am eagerly waiting for my key fob. I see it's as having another transportation option as I primarily walk or take the subway.
Lane splitting for motorcycles has proven to be safer in congested conditions, as evidenced by data that show rear end collisions are lower in California for motorcycles than in other areas. However, Manhattan can be just as congested, yet it's not legal to lane split, just as it's not legal for a bicyclist to run lights and stop signs, regardless as to data that show such practices to be safer in other cities.
Manhattan is a different place with higher pedestrian concentration, such that obeying traffic signals, including those specifically for bicycles, is required. Higher pedestrian volume is one reason why cars are prohibited from making right turns on red in the city, designed to promote pedestrian safety. Pedestrian safety should be encouraged, even if it constrains bicyclists, too, because the pedestrian is the most vulnerable. I have been flipped off, screamed at, etc. on 9th when crossing legally (more than once) because I walked in front of an approaching cyclist who chose to ignore the signal that required them to stop, since the little bicycle cannot be green if I have a walk signal to cross 9th. Such behavior is wrong at the most fundamental level of any sort of road sharing, as the road occupant to whom one should always yield, regardless of circumstance or legality, is the pedestrian.
Without licensing, what recourse is there against a cyclist who hits a pedestrian, runs over their foot, etc. and leaves the scene of the accident? What recourse is there against an aggressive cyclist who chooses to weave through pedestrians, run through a crosswalk with a legal walk signal, and otherwise dominate the road? If we want to allow bicyclists to treat signals as yield signs, then they need to be registered and certified (as in a license) to engage in such behavior because of the complex nature of Manhattan streets. Short of that, cyclists need to obey signals, just as other vehicles and pedestrians need to do as well.
I have little tolerance for jaywalkers, and think enforcement should be much stronger, especially in Midtown and Lower Manahttan, as aggressive pedestrians are just as much of a problem to other pedestrians, vehicles, buses, motorcyclists, and bicyclists. It's not safer for a pedestrian to jaywalk, unless they are fleeing a maniac, though I have rarely found that to be a need in the city, so following the signals and standing on the sidewalk, not leading into the street, can help to save lives, too.
It's not impossible to have respectful multiple uses of roadways in the city by various means, but a fundamental level of respect for the other forms of transportation, and stepped up enforcement of statutes needs to be implemented to make for a system that does not favor a specific mode of transit.
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All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players: they have their exits and their entrances; and one man in his time plays many parts, his acts being seven ages.
~William Shakespeare (As You Like It Act II, Scene VII)
^-Cities with dense pedestrian activity allow bicycles to yield at red lights too. Like Paris.
If running red lights in NYC were dangerous, our streets would be covered in blood because 98% of bicyclist run red lights here. Almost every intersection in Manhattan has a traffic light, along with many in the outer boroughs especially the inner city. Like I have said before; it's dangerous to blow a red light without regard, not to yield and cross when safe.
At the same time I support ticketing those that choose to ride against traffic, with headphones in both ears, without lights at night, and on the sidewalk.
Riding against traffic reduces reaction time for both the bicyclist and on coming vehicles of all types. It also makes you unexpected at intersections, pulling out of driveways or parking lots. Headphones in both ears limit awareness, I personally never ride with headphones in at all. No lights = invisible at night, just don't do it. Riding on the sidewalk will lead to a collision with a pedestrian or object in due time, or an unsuspecting vehicle at an intersection (since your likely moving faster then the average pedestrian). However, it should be case by case because I know of good reason when sidewalk riding makes sense for a short period of time due to safety in areas with little to no regular pedestrian activity.
And I would only support licensing if a certain percentage of New Yorkers commuted by bicycle. It would have to be significant. I would not want to discourage bicycling due to the net benefits versus the cons.
In reality, dangers presented by cyclists are much exaggerated. In the meantime, automobiles cause damage, injury, kill, create pollution, congestion, and require expensive infrastructure.
And we have so many jaywalkers because of poor pedestrian infrastructure in relation to capacity. You want less jaywalking? Install mid-block stop lights and wider sidewalks, crosswalks. Vehicles should also be traveling slow enough to react to pedestrians in high density areas. Otherwise, wishful thinking. Our local roads are not supposed to be limited access, we have expressways and parkways for that.
Last edited by nykiddo718718; 06-08-2013 at 10:09 PM..
We decided to drive to the city yesterday and relax. We ate at a cafe and decided to eat outside. Near us was a row of those Citibikes. The misses and I were considering going for a little stroll on the bikes for the hell of it but as we sat and ate we witnessed numerous people try to "dock" the bikes (for lack of a better term) and stand there in frustration and anger, as they could not do so. I heard there are a lot of problems with the docking stations and I was wondering what the operators plan to do about the problems?
We decided to drive to the city yesterday and relax. We ate at a cafe and decided to eat outside. Near us was a row of those Citibikes. The misses and I were considering going for a little stroll on the bikes for the hell of it but as we sat and ate we witnessed numerous people try to "dock" the bikes (for lack of a better term) and stand there in frustration and anger, as they could not do so. I heard there are a lot of problems with the docking stations and I was wondering what the operators plan to do about the problems?
I've definitely had multiple encounters with a "dead" docking station. I post about a previous encounter earlier in this thread about the ones along Chambers Street, but there were a few of them in Hells Kitchen. In other words, you couldn't take a bike out nor could you put one back in b/c the dock wouldn't respond. And this is despite their own app saying bikes are available at this station and it was functional.
The ones that I found most reliable are in Midtown along 6th Avenue and Broadway.
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