Baby Dies After Being Shot In Head In Brownsville, Brooklyn (bars, rated)
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I hear that a lot about white women. It may be true about women, but in reality it's black women who benefit the most.
And I will say that AA in the workforce is almost a different discussion than it in admissions for higher education. Being that getting a job is pretty much only based on an interview, they're kind of tough to compare.
We may not agree, but I'm glad that you at the very least acklowledge that this concept exists though...
There aren't enough black women in the U.S. to benefit more than white women. Also, your statements do not have any credence, because when one looks at the private and public sector, white women tend to be in the most senior level positions throughout the country, when compared to other races of women.
In reality, the majority of American colleges/universities are predominately white (just based on the share number of the current population). Are there some minority students who get into the ivy league (or other highly selective elite schools) with slightly lower SAT scores --absolutely. But one must remember that the world is not equal. In many instances, (based on socio-economic standing) Black and Latino students do not attend very good high schools and may not have received any (or very little) test preparation when compared to White and Asian ivy league applicants.
Truthfully, if the average white person had to reside in a ghetto or attend a substandard school many wouldn't have the same standardized scores. Often in inner city schools, most teachers spend more time disciplining than actually teaching, so it's truly a miracle that some of the students who have to attend school in those type of environments even make it out successfully.
Last edited by CityGirl332; 09-08-2013 at 08:55 AM..
There aren't enough black women in the U.S. to benefit more than white women. Also, your statements do not have any credence, because when one looks at the private and public sector, white women tend to be in the most senior level positions throughout the country, when compared to other races of women.
In reality, the majority of American colleges/universities are predominately white (just based on the share number of the current population). Are there some minority students who get into the ivy league (or other highly selective elite schools) with slightly lower SAT scores --absolutely. But one must remember that the world is not equal. In many instances, the minority students did not attend very good high schools and may not have received any (or very little) test preparation when compared to white and Asian ivy league applicants.
Truthfully, if the average white person had to reside in a ghetto or attend a substandard school many of them wouldn't have the same standardized scores. Often in inner city schools, most teachers spend more time disciplining than actually teaching, so it's truly a miracle that some of the students who have to attend school in those type of environments even make it out successfully.
The top schools in this country have a higher percentage of whites than the general population, mind you, in part because of the historical legacies. And if your parents gave the university 100 million dollars, does anyone think admissions is going to be that concerned about SAT scores?
Truth be told, compared to the general population, even poor whites and poor asians would have a hard time getting into top universities. Most applicants get rejected. But if you're already rich, then it gets a whole lot easier.
Whites are a minority in NYC, for example, and a minority in California, but they are not minorities at Columbia or Stanford.
When I went to Cornell, I didn't even know many inner city Blacks. There were a lot of foreign students from Africa and the Caribbean. There were a few inner city Afro Latinos. The majority of African Americans are Cornell were from the suburbs (and already well to do, yes, there are middle class and well of Blacks) or they were from the Southern US.
For whatever reasons, a lot of African Americans from places like NY or Chicago go to Black colleges in the South. And top universities are not going out of their way to recruit kids from poor inner city schools in any significant numbers. Why would they? These kids have no money.
Truthfully, if the average white person had to reside in a ghetto or attend a substandard school many wouldn't have the same standardized scores. Often in inner city schools, most teachers spend more time disciplining than actually teaching, so it's truly a miracle that some of the students who have to attend school in those type of environments even make it out successfully.
Absolutely true - which is why I have advocated for, and participated in - programs to provide the same resources to students of substandard schools.
There aren't enough black women in the U.S. to benefit more than white women. Also, your statements do not have any credence, because when one looks at the private and public sector, white women tend to be in the most senior level positions throughout the country, when compared to other races of women.
In reality, the majority of American colleges/universities are predominately white (just based on the share number of the current population). Are there some minority students who get into the ivy league (or other highly selective elite schools) with slightly lower SAT scores --absolutely. But one must remember that the world is not equal. In many instances, the minority students did not attend very good high schools and may not have received any (or very little) test preparation when compared to white and Asian ivy league applicants.
Truthfully, if the average white person had to reside in a ghetto or attend a substandard school many of them wouldn't have the same standardized scores. Often in inner city schools, most teachers spend more time disciplining than actually teaching, so it's truly a miracle that some of the students who have to attend school in those type of environments even make it out successfully.
You say that you don't see the benefit of race based AA, yet proceed to claim that it's necessary, at least in terms of undergrad. What about the countless poor white folks throughout this country in the same sh1tty schools? They have the same issues. It's time for it to be solely based on socioeconomic status. In fact, it should be illegal to request race/ethnicity info on apps for school. Only financial status. Students who mention it in their essays should be automatically DQ'd. Ironically, having a black or hispanic sounding name in this hypothetical situation would help.
In terms of black women in the workforce, the truth is that none of us can really measure the effect. And you're right, there are less in this country as a whole so it's tough to compare. I will agree that whitey has a better chance of getting promoted to higher management once hired. But put one black and one white woman with the same credentials in front of an interviewer; the interviewer is gonna think twice about hiring that white woman, even if they have a better feeling. Lawsuits have and do happen. This is not fairytale stuff.
You say that you don't see the benefit of race based AA, yet proceed to claim that it's necessary, at least in terms of undergrad. What about the countless poor white folks throughout this country in the same sh1tty schools? They have the same issues. It's time for it to be solely based on socioeconomic status. In fact, it should be illegal to request race/ethnicity info on apps for school. Only financial status. Students who mention it in their essays should be automatically DQ'd. Ironically, having a black or hispanic sounding name in this hypothetical situation would help.
In terms of black women in the workforce, the truth is that none of us can really measure the effect. And you're right, there are less in this country as a whole so it's tough to compare. I will agree that whitey has a better chance of getting promoted to higher management once hired. But put one black and one white woman with the same credentials in front of an interviewer; the interviewer is gonna think twice about hiring that white woman, even if they have a better feeling. Lawsuits have and do happen. This is not fairytale stuff.
Yes. A lot of whites go to poor public schools, and you even have whites in inner city schools. I too think that universities should not ask for race on college applications. On the last supreme court ruling on the matter, they allowed this to continue for now but said this was something that should not continue indefinitely.
As for your comments on the interview, you speak for all employers or all hiring managers? You have a direct headline into the minds of everyone who hires in this country to know what you said is true is true? This is merely a figment of your imagination.
Now, on an individual basis, anything is possible. Yes, its possible that an individual interview could have the above mention bias you named. An interview could have any bias, on anything. But to categorically declare 100% of interviews as always having the same bias, or even most interviews of feeling a certain way when you have little or no evidence of that is just plain silly.
The top schools in this country have a higher percentage of whites than the general population, mind you, in part because of the historical legacies. And if your parents gave the university 100 million dollars, does anyone think admissions is going to be that concerned about SAT scores?
Truth be told, compared to the general population, even poor whites and poor asians would have a hard time getting into top universities. Most applicants get rejected. But if you're already rich, then it gets a whole lot easier.
Whites are a minority in NYC, for example, and a minority in California, but they are not minorities at Columbia or Stanford.
When I went to Cornell, I didn't even know many inner city Blacks. There were a lot of foreign students from Africa and the Caribbean. There were a few inner city Afro Latinos. The majority of African Americans are Cornell were from the suburbs (and already well to do, yes, there are middle class and well of Blacks) or they were from the Southern US.
For whatever reasons, a lot of African Americans from places like NY or Chicago go to Black colleges in the South. And top universities are not going out of their way to recruit kids from poor inner city schools in any significant numbers. Why would they? These kids have no money.
I just find it interesting that no one has any issue with legacy admissions. Most only want to focus on race.
Also, it is true that whites are sometimes over represented at elite colleges. And if admission decisions were really based solely on standardized testing, top colleges would have far more Asians than white students, but again, many don't want to talk about this...
I've never believed that standardized scores alone should be used to determine admissions. There are some very smart students who simply may not test as well as others, for a wide variety of reasons. In my opinion, if the student meets the acceptable standardized testing range for admission to the school AND has a lot of outstanding traits (i.e. high GPA, stellar extra curricular participation, great recommendations, etc,) they should not be denied admission (especially if they came from an under performing school), simply because their SAT score was not as high as an Asian or White student who attended an elite private or very good public school.
I am not suggesting that a person with a low SAT be admitted to the ivy league or other elite colleges, I'm merely pointing out that if they fall within the acceptable standardized testing range AND have a lot of excellent traits (mentioned above), they should not be overlooked, just for having a slightly lower SAT score than their Asian and/or white counterparts.
You say that you don't see the benefit of race based AA, yet proceed to claim that it's necessary, at least in terms of undergrad. What about the countless poor white folks throughout this country in the same sh1tty schools? They have the same issues. It's time for it to be solely based on socioeconomic status. In fact, it should be illegal to request race/ethnicity info on apps for school. Only financial status. Students who mention it in their essays should be automatically DQ'd. Ironically, having a black or hispanic sounding name in this hypothetical situation would help.
Selective colleges consider many factors when compiling their freshman class. Class is considered, therefore poor whites, who perform well within their districts are certainly granted the same need blind admission as impoverished minority students. It's odd that you don't understand that a number of poor whites are admitted to the ivy league and other elite colleges.
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In terms of black women in the workforce, the truth is that none of us can really measure the effect. And you're right, there are less in this country as a whole so it's tough to compare. I will agree that whitey has a better chance of getting promoted to higher management once hired. But put one black and one white woman with the same credentials in front of an interviewer; the interviewer is gonna think twice about hiring that white woman, even if they have a better feeling. Lawsuits have and do happen. This is not fairytale stuff.
I can't say if the interviewer will hire the white or black women. I will however say, that in my experience, even if the white woman doesn't get that particular job, she will usually be able to get another equally suited job (and then move up the ranks, usually quicker than minority women).
I have noticed that Asian women in particular, regardless of their education and experience often have a far more difficult time moving into senior management (non scientific roles) than other races of women. Asian men also have this problem as well. I don't mean to get off the topic, but just look at the NYC mayoral candidate John Liu. How is it that Liu's polling numbers are worse than Weiner? The fact is, race does show its ugly head at times, and people make many assumptions about a person's competence or ability to manage, based sometimes solely on outer appearances.
Regardless of what you may believe, an educated tall white man, who dresses and looks the part, will be promoted quicker in most instances than an equally educated minority male or woman. This is not always the case, but it is what I have observed in the work place.
I am so happy. The SOB that shot at a gangbanger and killed a kid in Brooklyn is finally behind bars. I hope he is convicted and never gets out. I hope the idiot father who would not cooperate with the police in investigating the death of his own son gets what he deserves. I hope the madness with guns will stop. I hope little Antiq can rest in peace.
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Also, your statements do not have any credence, because when one looks at the private and public sector, white women tend to be in the most senior level positions throughout the country, when compared to other races of women.
Brooklyn baby killer apprehended
