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Because I am telling you that the problem of black unemployment is HARDLY limited to the black under class.
Yes black men who have college degrees are AS LIKELY to face unemployment white men who only graduated high school. What part of that do you not understand? Black men with college degrees also earn what white men who only graduated college. What part of that don't you understand.
So unless your response includes a reaction to that fact then you are being very selective, and also disrespectful to those people who are doing the right thing, but yet face obstacles. And by pretending as if only the under class has this problem is distracting from the fact that there is a problem that ought to be addressed.
So I guess part of the problem is why do people glorify Black failure so much?
Why not examine how and why those Black men who successfully launched careers were able to do so?
Not all whites with college degrees are successful and ditto with other races.
And while discrimination is a factor, there are other factors too that might be cultural.
A lot of poor Blacks who raise their kids right and have them go to college have no concept of a competitive society. Not that all whites have this, but those from wealthier backgrounds (ie, their parents went to top universities) have this concept.
You would have to blow your competition out of the water to be able to get a top paying job or to launch a worthwhile career in anything. Many people with degrees, including many whites cannot.
At least some of those Black males with degrees have to be mediocre.
Also, many Blacks may not realize the importance of social networks, including lifelong social networks in advancing socioeconomically. People like the Bushes have their kids in private school k-12, so they know a lot of other wealthy people growing up. Then they go to an Ivy League school. It's tough to compete with that unless you are a knockout talent or extremely lucky.
But I feel in this case, Carib, you yourself are screwing up this issue by only comparing Black and white males. How do Hispanic and Asian males do? How do Black males who have wealthy parents do?
Eric Holder, the attorney general . What employment opportunities do his children have? What is the employment rate of college educated Blacks who have wealthy parents? What is the employment rate of whites who have poor parents? Added in the other races as well so we can see if this is racism, nepotism, some combination of the two, or something else. Because as you present the matter we can't actually see what's going on.
And this is also why I insist on ethnic and other breakdowns of blacks. To say we all have the same opportunities within the same race (pick any race) is just plain FOOLISH.
Black men who are highly educated professionals don't trust the police either because they expect rude and disrespectful treatment, and also know that there are elements among the police who don't see them any different from rhe black hoodlums.
As usual your narrow focus on the black under class makes you miss the point. In addition of those who are doing the right thing are treated as criminals how can they act as a bridge between the police and black boys?
You know what black professional males who mentor these fatherless young boys tell them? Be careful. Don't put your hands in your pockets. Inform the police of every move before you do so. Only speak when spoken to.
In other words behave with a cop the way you would with an angry pit bull!
Overall I've had nothing but polite treatment from the police. Stop trying to speak for all Black men with degrees, Carib.
That's actually the biggest problem with these types of racial discussions. Black people are not robots linked with one mind, you do realize. We have different perspectives, attitudes, and perceptions.
I come from a family of soldiers, and I tend to admire soldiers and cops.
Cause its human nature for people to make note of differences among each other.
You think others don't do the same?
and it is because people assume that black people are one monolithic group when there are some differences.
As a Black person I agree I just don't see the need in telling people that we are not one monolithic group. If they don't know that by now, they never will. Others have always known but they just don't want to admit it or recognize it. It is easier to marginalize a group and deal with them accordingly; taking differences into consideration would require a level of consciousness most people are either incapable of possessing, or are too lazy, or afraid of exercising.
Most people, when they talk about Black people, could care less where they're from. One gets tired of enlightening people; at the same time we have our own struggles as Black people where we treat each other in the same way that we complain about others treating us. All of this differentiation about where Blacks are from and what type of Black person we are culturally, geographically, nationally, etc. to groups of individuals that are still going to perceive us the same way just feels as though it is for naught.
Christine, perhaps you misunderstood. I'm not asking how many blacks have left NY. I am asking to have some stats for this statement:
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude
You should read about how many African Americans returned to the South since the great migrations. Christine is right, most African Americans live in the South. Most of the Blacks these days in NYC are Caribbean, African, or Black Hispanic.
Please link me to any stats that show that "most of the blacks these days in NYC are Caribbean, African or black hispanic."
Or perhaps NYWriterDude could provide the stats, since he's the one also making this statement.
The link you provided does not give that statistic, does it? I'm curious how anyone could know what percentage of NYC blacks are African American blacks vs other kinds of blacks, if no one actually can link me to that statistic. Perhaps you are just guessing. If that's the case, please state you're guessing on these numbers. Otherwise it gets very confusing to have people state things as fact that they are really just guessing about.
And there are many Caribbean people who prefer AA music over that from the Caribbean.
These aren't distinct communities, even though they have ben tensions and ignorance, which goes BOTH ways.
I also like Chinese food, Italian food, Mexican food, etc.
An AA eating Caribbean food or a Caribbean listening to music from AAs is no different from a Phillipino listening to rap or a white american eating Caribbean food . We are all human beings, yes. But as Blacks we share NO SPECIAL LINKS!
Christine, perhaps you misunderstood. I'm not asking how many blacks have left NY. I am asking to have some stats for this statement:
Please link me to any stats that show that "most of the blacks these days in NYC are Caribbean, African or black hispanic."
Or perhaps NYWriterDude could provide the stats, since he's the one also making this statement.
The link you provided does not give that statistic, does it? I'm curious how anyone could know what percentage of NYC blacks are African American blacks vs other kinds of blacks, if no one actually can link me to that statistic. Perhaps you are just guessing. If that's the case, please state you're guessing on these numbers. Otherwise it gets very confusing to have people state things as fact that they are really just guessing about.
Links were provided, go back and read them and make your own conclusions. Links were also provided on the large number of AAs who have long since left NYC.
Lastly, you clearly have access to Google just like the rest of us, if this is a topic that interests you do your own research.
As a Black person I agree I just don't see the need in telling people that we are not one monolithic group. If they don't know that by now, they never will. Others have always known but they just don't want to admit it or recognize it. It is easier to marginalize a group and deal with them accordingly; taking differences into consideration would require a level of consciousness most people are either incapable of possessing, or are too lazy, or afraid of exercising.
Most people, when they talk about Black people, could care less where they're from. One gets tired of enlightening people; at the same time we have our own struggles as Black people where we treat each other in the same way that we complain about others treating us. All of this differentiation about where Blacks are from and what type of Black person we are culturally, geographically, nationally, etc. to groups of individuals that are still going to perceive us the same way just feels as though it is for naught.
No, it is not for naught. It's stupid for someone to take on all the burdens of all Black people everywhere in the world, particularly when one has nothing to do with those people.
Lastly, whatever my personal perspectives are, I cannot speak for all Black people nor do I have all encompassing knowledge about Blacks.
A white person yesterday for example asked me how I perceived the South. In his mind the South is KKK land. I responded most African Americans live there (not immigrant Blacks). He asked me how did I personally feel the times I went. I said I personally felt fine, but there are people who FEEL different (there are Blacks that would say the South is a racist hellhole and they want nothing to do with it).
Part of the disputes on this thread isn't just about racists, it's about the tendency of some Blacks to speak on the behalf of all Blacks, or that there's media representation that one or two people are the mouth of all people of African descent in the world. So some of us are speaking out against these things.
I feel no connection towards people from the Caribbean per say. Outside the US, I was more interested in mainland South America culturally and historically. So the blacks on this forum claiming that West Indians and AAs are one do not speak for me, or for all West Indians or AAs. Some of these people identify with each other, and some don't. Me going to a restaurant and eating Puerto Rican food or Colombian food (northern south america, not really the Caribbean) doesn't mean all of a sudden I'm down with all Caribbean people! It would be ridiculously patronizing and disingenuous to imply such.
Also if some one has three grand parents who are African American and one who is Caribbean, does this make a person Caribbean? Obviously they are much more exposed to AA influences and identities.
The notion that there are distinct AA and black Caribbean communities is nonsense. We live in many of the same neighbors and face many of the same societal problems, and so must work together to resolve these issues.
I do agree that more and more Caribbean and African families are also leaving NYC.
BTW: My immediate family (mother, father, grandparents (on both sides)) are AA, however most of my cousins are half Caribbean. Overall, my extended family is blended. I have aunties and uncles in the Bahamas, Jamaica, UK, Aruba and France.
And this is also why I insist on ethnic and other breakdowns of blacks. To say we all have the same opportunities within the same race (pick any race) is just plain FOOLISH.
Nigerians are the most educated immigrant group. Considerably more educated than are native non Hispanic white Americans. Yet their household incomes lag behind those of Asian Americans. They also suffer higher unemployment, and are more likely to occupy jobs below what one would expect, given their educational levels.
They also don't engage themselves in "soft" degrees, being disproportionately involved in healthcare, finance, and engineering degrees. They are what many demand that African Americans be. Strong family values and a fanatical devotion to education. Yet this problem exists.
I don't know what you expect a break down of blacks by ethnicity to show. It will show that West Indian and Africans have the highest median household incomes, with black Americans and black Latinos lagging. Black Latinos held back to language issues. All you will do is embolden those who put 100% of the blame on black Americans and cite the "success" of black immigrants, which both you and I know is BS.
So what is your question because it turns out that the black ethnic group which has been in the USA longest is among the least successful when using most metrics of socio economic status. This despite the notion that they should have the strongest social networks and greatest knowledge of how to succeed in this country.
If you can find data that refutes my argument, feel welcome to show it. But the very selectivity of the immigration process, combined with the legacy of racism on blacks who have lived longest in this country, are the root causes of this.
Overall I've had nothing but polite treatment from the police. Stop trying to speak for all Black men with degrees, Carib.
.
And YOU need to stop pretending as if YOU represent blacks based on YOUR experience!
Many others have different experiences and are quite vocal about that!
And you know what. The black professionals who most often express those views are BLACK AMERICAN! Indeed groups like the One Hundred Black Men and the 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement Who Care host training to tell young blacks how to respond if they encounter the police.
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