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Old 08-15-2015, 02:51 PM
 
Location: New Jersey!!!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlem resident View Post
And it speaks volumes that you are unable to comprehend how "free market" actually works in the contemporary world.
When you add the caveat of "contemporary world", you make yourself correct only because the free market no longer exists due to onerous government regulation.
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Old 08-15-2015, 05:43 PM
 
593 posts, read 470,724 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
When you add the caveat of "contemporary world", you make yourself correct only because the free market no longer exists due to onerous government regulation.
I agree. America does NOT have a free market, but rather a system that Ludwig von Mises called "interventionism." This is a system in which the government continuously intervenes into the market place to address perceived wrongs. These interventions create problems which require further intervention, creating a vicious cycle. Therefore, it is an unstable, transitional system.

For example, check out this chart of the number of pages of regulations added to the Federal Register each year from 1936 to 2011: Chart Of The Day: The Rise Of The Regulatory Leviathan, 1936-2011 | David Stockman's Contra Corner.

What are we transitioning to? Socialism--specifically a 1930's German style of socialism with nominal private ownership of the means of production that is actually controlled by the state.
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Old 08-15-2015, 06:36 PM
 
Location: New Jersey!!!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fluttereagle View Post
What are we transitioning to? Socialism--specifically a 1930's German style of socialism with nominal private ownership of the means of production that is actually controlled by the state.
Socialism has already been insidiously achieved in this country through government regulation rather than overt ownership, which the people - as disengaged as we are - would never have allowed.

While business owners may technically own their corporations, every single aspect of their production is controlled and dictated by the permission granted through government regulation. Our individual rights are being attacked using the same tactic. We no longer have absolute rights, we now have "rights" as exceptions only to legal government actions.
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Old 08-15-2015, 06:43 PM
 
Location: West Harlem
6,885 posts, read 9,930,168 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
Socialism has already been insidiously achieved in this country through government regulation rather than overt ownership, which the people - as disengaged as we are - would never have allowed.

While business owners may technically own their corporations, every single aspect of their production is controlled and dictated by the permission granted through government regulation. Our individual rights are being attacked using the same tactic. We no longer have absolute rights, we now have "rights" as exceptions only to legal government actions.
These ideas cannot work for the same reason pure socialism did not - people. Both ends of the spectrum are utopic and demand, for example, that people behave decently at least the majority of the time. They do not.

I have said before that the best solutions, if indeed we do find a way to move toward them, will incorporate parts of different ways of thinking.
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Old 08-15-2015, 06:56 PM
 
Location: New Jersey!!!!
19,049 posts, read 13,964,273 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlem resident View Post
These ideas cannot work for the same reason pure socialism did not - people. Both ends of the spectrum are utopic and demand, for example, that people behave decently at least the majority of the time. They do not.

I have said before that the best solutions, if indeed we do find a way to move toward them, will incorporate parts of different ways of thinking.
Absolutely true, utopia in the anarchist's view is not what I desire. Still, we've reached a point where government intervention in our lives, in all forms, truly has become the snowball barreling down the mountain. There is no longer a restrictive force serving to check government's incessant growth.

A great example would be to compare government regulations to Freud's psycho-analytical theories, which have been abandoned over the years by psychologists. His entire theory was set up so that it could not be disproven scientifically. He did not follow any definition of the scientific method. The very act of denying whether one fit his profiles ensured that one did (similar to how some "tests" define alcoholism). It is the same with our current state of government. When a regulation or law fails to achieve its stated goals (after being rammed down our throats nonetheless), government doesn't back off, rather it doubles down passing further regulation.

How are The People to combat this situation? I say we can no longer exercise our power of control over government because that power no longer exists. Our government is now a self-fulfilling prophecy which cannot be disproven such as a problem of the natural sciences can be.
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Old 08-15-2015, 07:00 PM
 
Location: West Harlem
6,885 posts, read 9,930,168 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
Absolutely true, but we've reached a point where government intervention in our lives, in all forms, truly has become the snowball barreling down the mountain. There is no longer a restrictive force serving to check government's incessant growth.
I agree with this - it is broader than government though.
A rationalization process run wild, quantify everything and everyone.
This is increasing by the day.
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Old 08-15-2015, 07:00 PM
 
Location: New Jersey!!!!
19,049 posts, read 13,964,273 times
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Sorry, I made some changes after you quoted me.
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Old 08-15-2015, 07:03 PM
 
Location: New Jersey!!!!
19,049 posts, read 13,964,273 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlem resident View Post
I agree with this - it is broader than government though.
A rationalization process run wild, quantify everything and everyone.
This is increasing by the day.
Unfortunately the natural response to an excessively complicated situation is to over simplify. This is what we see now in society, compounded by the fact that most people seem to be disengaged from every day life via the distractions presented by electronic devices.
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Old 09-11-2015, 06:53 PM
 
2,301 posts, read 1,886,466 times
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i feel sorry for the landlord
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