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With some information on her parents' names and birth dates, it's possible to perhaps track down some relatives that way, if it's not too common a name. This might be better in the genealogy forum.
If she starts by tracing her family members starting with her parents surely she can find someone with a record. What about her father having a military or draft record? Surely she has aunts, uncles,cousins grandparents or someone who was not a cult member and can trace from there and contact that person to see if they can help her. I find it hard to believe no one has a record if she is indeed from this country. I was formerly in a new age cult but ours wasn't that controlling to where we had no identity and didn't work. There are counselors who deal with cult deprogramming and they may have a network of people that could help her. She needs to contact those people not you as what she is asking of you is just unconscionable. I found a book written by a former cult member that helped me; there are a number of books out there which have contact info for people seeking help. The best thing you can do for her is be a good friend, but just don't lie for her as that could have repercussions for you somewhere down the line.
Something else comes to mind she may need other help if her children were born outside a hospital and she has no medical records. That means the kids have no immunizations, no medical care, probably no dental care and same for her. Are these people healthy?
There are probably non-profit organizations that help former cult members.
There may not be, but I am sure there are attoneys out there or some groups that can be of assistance. Doesn't she know her legal name? That is all she would need to start to fill in the holes. If all this story is true and there is no reason to believe it is not, she isn't the first person to have a situation like this. She does need help, obviously her kids do as well, but the best thing you can do is be a friend to her.
OP, do not lie under oath for anyone. You will again absolutely nothing and could ruin your entire life...
If she knows her parents' names and birthdates/places. You could go to ancestory.com or the social security index which will give place and name information.
as another poster said, you could pay for a private investigator.
and you could be a friend.
sad situation but you know it wouldn't be wise to sign the notarized statement.
Not saying that this is the case, especially since any pro would know the ins and outs, but such a story would be a perfect story for a spy or mole. Your word is your word. It is one of the most precious things you own. Never sully it as has been suggested.
As far as her kids, she obviously KNOWS the date and place of birth, so a place to start might be the local police chief of that town. He would be pretty familiar with the situation at the cult. In the past, I would have suggested the local area newspaper. Her story is news and it is relevant to the area. A good reporter covering it could end up being quite helpful.
If she was brought into the cult, chances are there is a record of her live birth somewhere. If she knows her birthday, she cuts down possibilities tremendously. She might be on a missing children database somewhere. A private detective is likely the best way to go on searching things out. One other way to get a ball rolling might be to sue for child support. If the children were born within the cult compound, a suit against the group might make them a WHOLE lot more interested in sorting things out.
Her story could be absolutely true; in which case, it is likely that her genealogy could be traced.Verifying the birth of the children could be difficult but not impossible; there may be records available in the cult or elsewhere around them, and the ideas about contacting the local officials is good, and as a last resort, suing the cult.
But - what if her story isn't true? If you lie on an affadavit that supports her lie, then you could be held just as liable for fraud as she. Sympathy and empathy are good things, but not when someone asks you to violate your principles to prove your empathy and further their own benefit. She is probably not a con artist - but maybe, just maybe, she is - and where would that leave you? How far are you willing to go for her?
We had a fellow with his young son who came here a year ago; he had such a sob story that my friend hired him and gave them a place to stay. She signed an affidavit to the Social Services in his home state - where the father had taken him from his foster home during a visit - that she would be responsible for the child's welfare. The next thing she knew, they were scamming everyone - churches, individuals, Social Services; at the last estimate they were collecting over $4000 in 'services'... when it became apparent that the law in several states was looking for them, he and his son - already a well-trained and accomplished con artist himself - disappeared. My friend was left not only with all of the phone calls and 'visits' from law enforcement entities, she also started receiving the duns from bills that he had run up, and the cleanup on the once lovely and completely refurbished, now incredibly filthy and partially-destroyed house that she had given them, rent free. It turned out that the "home state" they were supposedly from was just a state where he had been busted for neglect; he wasn't really from there at all, no one knew where they were from. Don't be taken in... lying on an affidavit may be just the first step.
Not saying that this is the case, especially since any pro would know the ins and outs, but such a story would be a perfect story for a spy or mole. Your word is your word. It is one of the most precious things you own. Never sully it as has been suggested.
As far as her kids, she obviously KNOWS the date and place of birth, so a place to start might be the local police chief of that town. He would be pretty familiar with the situation at the cult. In the past, I would have suggested the local area newspaper. Her story is news and it is relevant to the area. A good reporter covering it could end up being quite helpful.
If she was brought into the cult, chances are there is a record of her live birth somewhere. If she knows her birthday, she cuts down possibilities tremendously. She might be on a missing children database somewhere. A private detective is likely the best way to go on searching things out. One other way to get a ball rolling might be to sue for child support. If the children were born within the cult compound, a suit against the group might make them a WHOLE lot more interested in sorting things out.
Yes I'm thinking that too--it might be true and it might not--it's the sort of story that an unscrupulous person would use to gain sympathy and it's hard to pick those out sometimes.
I would not advise going back to that town to get info though--I've read enough about cults to know that they have "plants" around town who are trained to look for runaway cult members and return them back to the compound and this would only alert them to her whereabouts--the sheriff might be on their payroll. I read a book about the Jim Jones cult and this lady had a heck of a time getting away from there b/c in the nearest town there were spies everywhere and she barely got away before the poisoned koolaid incident.
I do like the idea of checking a missing children database though, but only if she was born before her folks joined the cult. If it was after then chances are that grandparents and other relatives would be completely unaware of her existence. Uh, that stuff is so sad and so sick. OP, there may be websites with advice about finding family--it's worth a look and a way to get started today. I mean, people do genealogy all the time so it should be theoretically possible to find family and if the story is true, they would surely be thrilled to see her and the kids.
Your friend's mother might be in missing adults database. I second the idea of trying genealogy. The folks in the CD People Search forum would have tips I bet.
I was not sure where to put this, so I am leaving it up to the mods, if they feel a different forum is more appropriate.
I have a casual acquaintance who has asked me for advice and I am at a loss. So I thought I would take this to the forum for help.
This person was part of a religious cult that is located in Oregon. During the time that she was part of this organization she had two children who are now in their mid teens. Approximately six months - to a year ago (not sure of the exact time frame), she decided to leave the cult and packed her bags in the middle of the night and took off, on foot with her two kids.
Because she was young when she joined this cult with her parents, she did not have any contact growing up with family members, and in fact, no one was allowed to discuss their "before life" so she does not even know the names or location of any family members at all. She has no knowledge of any family history. Likewise, no friendships outside the group were permitted.
After leaving the group, she was homeless for a while and unable to get a job because she had no social security card and no documentation about who she was, etc. (no birth certificate). For the past year or so she has been living and working in a shelter and trying to weed through the government requirements so that she can get the proper documentation for her and her children so that she can get a job and the children can go to public school, etc.
She has been volunteering at a charity thrift shop, this is how I met her and got to know her. She seems like a very nice person who has had quite a difficult time and is just looking for an opportunity. She told me that she need to get notarized affidavits from "friends or family" attesting to the fact of when and where her children were born. Of course, I am taking her word for all this, but she has asked me if I would do one of these affidavits.
I want very much to help her out, but I am not comfortable with swearing that I know when and where her children were born. I am trying to find out if there is some other way that I can help her with this without lying under oath! I told her I would do anything I could to help, but I would not do anything illegal or dishonest.
Do any of you have any ideas how to approach this? Let me just repeat a few points so that I don't get responses that are inappropriate.
1. She has no family
2. She has no friends or other people that she can contact about this.
3. She cannot contact anyone within the group because they will not respond to her.
4. She has no documentation AT ALL regarding her birth or her children's birth. No birth certificates, no doctors records, no school records. Nothing. Nada.
Any ideas are very much appreciated.
20yrsinBranson
I know your heart is the right place, but....
First, lying on her behalf under oath is perjury. As in a felony. Are you prepared to go to jail when, not if, this whole episode is uncovered?
Second, in a world filled with con artists, can you be absolutely sure this woman is telling the truth about herself? She very well could be running from a child custody order. Or a crime. Every few months, a news report surfaces of some person who has evaded the law for years and has started a new life with a new identity.
Third, I tend to be very, very suspicious when people say that no family, no where, will help them. Not a brother or sister? Not a kindly aunt? Nobody she can reach out to on Facebook even after all these years? In even the worst of families, there's always someone who is prepared to help, particularly after someone has disappeared for years and years. If she claims no, then I call baloney on her story.
I realize you want to help. And, in this situation, I'd want to be compassionate as well. But extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. And this woman's story is sounding like a Lifetime movie. Here's what I would do.
First, listen very very carefully to what she says. Ask a question or two about this alleged cult and then quietly investigate it on its own. Look for contradictions in what she says. What's more, if you note a disconnect between a couple of stories, mildly call it to her attention by saying, "But I thought that...." Then watch her reaction carefully. If she spits out a rapid-fire explanation replete with facts, then you know you have a liar on your hands.
Second, if you are really intent on helping this woman, then ask the name of a few of her relatives. Then offer to be an intermediary between her and them. If she refuses, then there's something afoot with her.
Third, do not give her money. Do not lend her your car. Do not co-sign anything.
If she is really legitimate in her needs, then her legal requirements are far beyond your capacity to help. Steer her to the nearest charity that deals specifically with her needs. Check in with her. Be a friend. But be a friend with one eye open.
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