Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
No she wasn't born in a hospital. Apparently there was someone in the group with medical knowledge that attended births and other medical emergencies. Any contact with the outside was strictly forbidden, apparently.
My understanding is that she has been in touch with many different agencies since returning to civilization and she hasn't received much help. They keep telling her that she needs to get affidavits from family and friends as a first step. They cannot seem to understand that this isn't going to happen (except by fraud).
One of the problems that she has is that she has no income and no money so that prevents her from doing a lot. She has an idea that her family is from somewhere outside of Chicago, but she is not sure.
20yrsinBranson
You know. The more I read, the less credulous I am. No birth records anywhere? Does she know her date of birth? Where she was born? If so, there would be some kind of record somewhere. About three quick phone calls or an inquiry onto Ancestry.com would take care of matters. The alarm bells are going off in my head.
To me, the more likely scenario is that she is on the run from someone or something that is not a cult, either a child custody order or the law. She is likely trying to put together a new identity in order to disappear and could be using your good nature as a vehicle to do it. In fact, I would offer that that is a more likely scenario than the one she's claiming happened. And even on the 1% chance her story is actually true, then you're dealing with someone who has gotten herself into a huge pickle through a lack of wisdom, and it's way beyond your ability to help her get out. If her situation is really as bad as you describe, then she needs serious, serious help, more than you can possibly offer.
The true test. Has she gone to the authorities? Has she worked for a long period of time with a single organization to get this straightened out? Or has she bounced from one to the other, claiming that no one is willing to help? The latter suggests to me that she has knocked on a lot of doors hasn't been able to find a soft touch to game the system. Under the guise of wanting to help, I'd want to see the paper trail myself.
Proceed with extreme caution. And if you discover she has been lying about her situation, do not confront her unless you want to wind up dead in a ditch. For someone who is going through those kinds of pains to cover up their identity is someone who will do anything to protect. Simply let the authorities know of her existence and they'll do the rest.
Yes, I would be very suspicious of her story since she's asking you to commit fraud and lie.
It would be one thing if she were asking you what she thought she should do -- but it's weird she's got it all figured out about these notarized statements that are false. If her story was true, then why the lies? Whot not just figure out the legal and honest way to get her situation fixed?
That right there make me think she's some kind of scammer.
Yes, I would be very suspicious of her story since she's asking you to commit fraud and lie.
It would be one thing if she were asking you what she thought she should do -- but it's weird she's got it all figured out about these notarized statements that are false. If her story was true, then why the lies? Whot not just figure out the legal and honest way to get her situation fixed?
That right there make me think she's some kind of scammer.
Yep.
I am involved with two different charities that help the homeless, one for ten years and the other for three. I have spent the night at shelters, I have dished out food, I have made phone calls, and I have helped people find jobs. I have seen people at their worst and I have seen people regain their lives in extraordinary and moving ways.
However, there is a reason to be cautious. Every person who is homeless is that way for a reason. A very few sometimes it is due to life's circumstances. More often, it is because they have royally screwed up. Substance abuse. Firing. Dishonesty. So in the homeless population, there is a very significant element of people who are that way because they lie without compunction. And you can pick these people out. They are the ones who, when volunteering how they got into this situation, IT'S NEVER THEIR FAULT.
The woman in the OP might be telling the truth. But the more likely situation, based on my experience, is that there are some things in her life that are unrevealed. 20yrs, I know you have a good heart. I know you really want to help this woman. But I would really counsel you to leave this up to the professionals, the ones who know how to separate the true hard cases from the con artists.
I too am very suspicious about this case. I am sure the government would love to help her get a social security card and birth certificate so she could start paying taxes and become a contributing member to our ever higher taxed population. That is of course, unless she is a criminal or illegal alien trying to get a clean citizenship via her Jane Doe story of fleeing a religious cult. How common are those cults anyway? Is that like 1 in a million odds that she would really come from there? Your odds are probably better that she is lying... Sorry to say it.
Good luck to you and her. As others suggested, I would do the leg work for her in trying to find help. Past that, I wouldn't lie for her. Maybe you can probe her honesty by suggesting she go to the police and ask them what to do. Or suggest contacting the Department of Labor or Division of Vital Records to see what her options are. If those things scare her off, she is probably lying.
I am involved with two different charities that help the homeless, one for ten years and the other for three. I have spent the night at shelters, I have dished out food, I have made phone calls, and I have helped people find jobs. I have seen people at their worst and I have seen people regain their lives in extraordinary and moving ways.
However, there is a reason to be cautious. Every person who is homeless is that way for a reason. A very few sometimes it is due to life's circumstances. More often, it is because they have royally screwed up. Substance abuse. Firing. Dishonesty. So in the homeless population, there is a very significant element of people who are that way because they lie without compunction. And you can pick these people out. They are the ones who, when volunteering how they got into this situation, IT'S NEVER THEIR FAULT.
The woman in the OP might be telling the truth. But the more likely situation, based on my experience, is that there are some things in her life that are unrevealed. 20yrs, I know you have a good heart. I know you really want to help this woman. But I would really counsel you to leave this up to the professionals, the ones who know how to separate the true hard cases from the con artists.
Not to derail the thread. I live in Chicago and thus I see a lot of homeless folks. I always thought to myself how it is that somebody could alienate themselves so bad that they have no friends or family to fall back on. This kind of always made me think it was related to drugs or bad decisions in general. This kind of confirms my thinking. Rep'd.
Whereabouts in Oregon is this cult located? I am from Oregon and lived there for many years and to be honest I have never heard of any religious cults located there. Not to say there aren't any, but usually you hear something about them.
I agree with other posters, contact the city where this cult is supposed to be located. The police will know something about them.
Not saying that this is the case, especially since any pro would know the ins and outs, but such a story would be a perfect story for a spy or mole. Your word is your word. It is one of the most precious things you own. Never sully it as has been suggested.
As far as her kids, she obviously KNOWS the date and place of birth, so a place to start might be the local police chief of that town. He would be pretty familiar with the situation at the cult. In the past, I would have suggested the local area newspaper. Her story is news and it is relevant to the area. A good reporter covering it could end up being quite helpful.
If she was brought into the cult, chances are there is a record of her live birth somewhere. If she knows her birthday, she cuts down possibilities tremendously. She might be on a missing children database somewhere. A private detective is likely the best way to go on searching things out. One other way to get a ball rollingmight be to sue for child support. If the children were born within the cult compound, a suit against the group might make them a WHOLE lot more interested in sorting things out.
I always thought to myself how it is that somebody could alienate themselves so bad that they have no friends or family to fall back on. This kind of always made me think it was related to drugs or bad decisions in general.
Its not that unusual. Anyone who studies cult & brainwashing techniques can see its common practice for the cult leader to alienate people from family and from associating with non-cult members as a way to further control the person. In my years in a new age cult it was repeatedly stressed how spiritually unclean everyone else was & how we should live life a certain way in order to be spiritual leaders for the rest of mankind's sake. Also the mere fact if you are constantly participating in worship or ceremonies throughout the week you have little time to get out and meet new people or keep up with family who will drift away from you if you don't try to keep in touch. Others will see the weirdness of your religious group and steer clear of making friends with you so no its not odd that people get isolated. You'd be surprised how many cults are out there staying under the radar so people don't hear about them and you'd also be surprised how many people do live in communes. I couldn't believe myself there are two communes in my state and I grew up here yet had never heard of them till just a couple years ago. As if that was bad enough that I got involved in one for 10 years I recently went out of town and darn if I didn't get approached to join another one. I could not believe it! Its kinda insulting. Folks this stuff happens a lot as these groups purposely go after single people especially college kids away from family, anyone artsy or openminded are targets. Not saying the lady the OP knows is legit and not a con artist, but yeah it can happen...except the part about not having any records of her existence is rather questionable. This would have to be one of the more advanced, longlived cults to pull something like that off.
Something about this story just doesn't add up for me. Please proceed with caution. A true friend wouldn't ask you to lie for them no matter how dire their circumstances. It concerns me greatly that she's okay asking you to commit fraud.
Something about this story just doesn't add up for me. Please proceed with caution. A true friend wouldn't ask you to lie for them no matter how dire their circumstances. It concerns me greatly that she's okay asking you to commit fraud.
Exactly.
I mean, if my friend were being pursued by organized crime and I needed to lie so he could live, then yeah. But to provide an alibi if he were stepping out on his wife? Hell no. And certainly not for a reason that would land my butt in jail. Anyway, I'm a really lousy liar. I suck at it. MrsCPG would instantly know if I lied about putting the cap back on the cotton-picking toothpaste. So I'm certainly not going to lie to a public official whose major purpose in the transaction is to make sure I'm not lying to him.
In fact, SK just raised a good point. A person who asks you to lie on his or her behalf is someone who may not place a lot of value on the truth, whatever it is.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
