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Give meetup another chance. I have been going sporadically for years. I am in a hiking group with loads of people but there are some "core" members who I see more frequently. Last summer some of us did a Tough Mudder. What a bonding experience! We just did another one last weekend. Men and women are in the group and I am finally getting closer to some of the women. At our age, friendships take a lot more time to grow than they did as teens and twenties.
A lot of the men befriended me right away but I think most have ulterior motives lol. I recently asked one member what his initial impression of me was because we were talking about my lack of female friends (I brought it up and wanted his opinion). He told me that I seemed standoffish at first. This is a common observation for me. He also said that a curse of being an attractive woman is that even if you are just quiet and shy, you seem standoffish. He said if you are unattractive usually people will just assume you're shy.
He also said about how competitive women are and that if they think you get too much male attention that may make them not like you. So anyway I am careful about not exclusively talking to the men and I definitely stay far away from any man who has an attachment to anyone else in the group. Be equally friendly to men and women. Take things super slow. Friendships will develop even if they are not like the groups of girlfriends seen in movies. I hope to someday have some close female friends but for now, I am just enjoying doing fun activities in a group setting.
Look for older, or slightly more successful, more attractive etc. women.
I find it unusual that anyone would tell you such things. Is beauty or looks a common topic of conversation that it might come up? How is it that this issue is discussed at all I guess is what I'm wondering? Even if woman looked like Liz Taylor in her finest hour, was as perky and charming as Reese Witherspoon, was as intelligent as Marilyn Vos Savant or as successful/wealthy as Oprah, I would never say something like that to them.
Either there is rough parity in a friendship or there is not and I'd be disinclined to strike up a friendship with someone so far out of my general playing field, up or down. It just leads to issues in the long run. Find someone somewhat like yourself.
Humble-bragging is different from overtly bragging, and just posting fewer times on FB won't take care of it.
It's an overall attitude I was trying to explain in my other posts, and it is very hard to see when you're the one doing it.
But if multiple women are indeed calling you out for stuff, you must be doing something.
I am 50 with multiple college degrees and try to take care of myself. But I have never had a grown woman say those kinds of things to me. I can certainly see where it would be distressing, but to have it happen multiple times in your life should make you wonder.
If you truly intimidate others through your physical beauty and life accomplishments, then you are going to have to accept that you are a rare person and will struggle to find true peers in life. Figure out where others of your caliber socialize and start going there. I'm serious.
I wish I could lie about my experiences or they didn't exist but they indeed do and women have told me personally what they think of me. Sometimes it is very complimentary and matter-of-factly, and other times it is "you look like a model and I wish I did", (not bragging, this was a real conversation I had a few months ago, and I felt awful). It is a nightmare and it is alienating at best. I have met women that do not feel this way, or atleast do not outwardly show it. But, it has happened enough where it is clear I need to change what I am doing or find a way to attract women with a different mindset.
I think I would like to chat with and get to know some older ladies. The women I have met through work and various places have been honest and kind.
Right there in the bolded, the person saying that is fishing for compliments or looking for sympathy. Don't give them either one. Tell them you have a great hairdresser, change the subject, and cross the person off your list of potential friends. (Yes, I've done this.) Don't be apologetic when you tell people what you do. It's normal conversation between people getting to know each other.
There are people who think of life as a zero-sum game. They think if you're winning, they must be losing, and if they can bring you down, they'll be winners. These are ones who are jealous of your looks and accomplishments. Then there are people who think of life as a series of challenges to be met. They think if they hang around with winners, a little success will rub off on them.
Whichever attitude someone picks is entirely on them, not you. Let their attitude--their jealous comments, miffed looks--be a litmus test of whether they're a candidate for friendship.
You've said you avoid making friends with coworkers. I wouldn't write them off--I'd proceed slowly and avoid oversharing.
Just a thought--look up Ollie Mathews' latest videos on Youtube and see if they strike a chord with you.
I wish I could lie about my experiences or they didn't exist but they indeed do and women have told me personally what they think of me. Sometimes it is very complimentary and matter-of-factly, and other times it is "you look like a model and I wish I did", (not bragging, this was a real conversation I had a few months ago, and I felt awful). It is a nightmare and it is alienating at best. I have met women that do not feel this way, or atleast do not outwardly show it. But, it has happened enough where it is clear I need to change what I am doing or find a way to attract women with a different mindset.
This is what I mean about humble bragging.
First of all, there's no reason to feel terrible when someone says "You look like a model, I wish I did." There is nothing inherently wrong with being attractive, so why feel terrible about it? Just smile and say "thank you, that's very nice of you to say."
It's a theme that's been running through your threads. A "People hate me because I'm beautiful. I can't help being beautiful."
For me, it leaves me wondering "Is she indeed so stunning and nice, that lesser people are put off by it, like Cinderella and her evil step sisters? OR is she a bit of a flirt who irritates most women with her humble bragging.?"
A "one-off" event would be one thing...but it seems like (to my perception) it could be something else.
Again...not accusing. It's really hard to tell sometimes over the internet.
I am trying to be honest about my experiences without sounding like bragging, but it still sounds that way. I am trying hard to word my experiences to not offend people or come across as conceited, but I simply cannot via the internet. The only way I can avoid that perception is to not say anything about it, but I felt that information was an important part to the story. That plays a role in my life and it comes up whether I do my best to avoid it. I know that I will not be able to avoid this, but looking for ways I can meet healthier people for friendship.
I felt terrible because this was someone that was telling me she did not feel attractive and was in a way comparing herself to me. I don't think people hate me because I'm beautiful, but when people do think so they do not hesitate to let me know (men and women). I honestly did feel bad because it wasn't just: "you look nice", it was "you look nice and I don't feel I look as nice as you." So, I responded with thank you, but after that I did not hear from her again.
I don't flirt with anyone, like I've mentioned, these conversations come up without any prompt or questions asked from me. They come up all on their own which is what I dread and want to avoid because they put me on the spot. I always respond with "thank you", because it is nice to hear, but it is awkward when surrounded by other people. Not every woman reacts to me that way, but you are right, they are not one-off's and there has to be more to it. I have been described as nice and quiet. I smile a lot and I listen to others, so people feel at ease with me.
I do not think anyone is so beautiful it drives everyone away. But, I am finally bringing myself to recognize looks do seem to play a part in friendships, sadly-I absolutely do not think they should. I choose friends by their personality and interests-people I connect with. I do not care what they look like. And it's always a punch in the gut when looks become such an issue when it never mattered in my friendship. I have been told by others that women generally choose friends that are similar in attractiveness. I don't know how true that is? I just choose people.
I do think I have been perhaps choosing the wrong people historically combined with my prior social media behavior just looked like bragging when to me I was just sharing what I was up to. Just posting a photo going out I received pretty harsh criticism about it. So, I modified what I do, how I do it, when I do it, and what I say. I don't post too many photos of myself and I discourage photographers and makeup artists tagging me in things if and when I work with them. I try to keep my education and work a secret whenever I can. When I meet people for the first time, I am just having normal conversations and have no control over what they decide to say.
Right there in the bolded, the person saying that is fishing for compliments or looking for sympathy. Don't give them either one. Tell them you have a great hairdresser, change the subject, and cross the person off your list of potential friends. (Yes, I've done this.) Don't be apologetic when you tell people what you do. It's normal conversation between people getting to know each other.
There are people who think of life as a zero-sum game. They think if you're winning, they must be losing, and if they can bring you down, they'll be winners. These are ones who are jealous of your looks and accomplishments. Then there are people who think of life as a series of challenges to be met. They think if they hang around with winners, a little success will rub off on them.
Whichever attitude someone picks is entirely on them, not you. Let their attitude--their jealous comments, miffed looks--be a litmus test of whether they're a candidate for friendship.
You've said you avoid making friends with coworkers. I wouldn't write them off--I'd proceed slowly and avoid oversharing.
Just a thought--look up Ollie Mathews' latest videos on Youtube and see if they strike a chord with you.
I will look up Ollie Matthews. That particular woman crossed herself off. Once she said that I didn't hear from her again, nor did I pursue the friendship. I am trying to modify behavior that another poster said that may be viewed as "humble bragging", but I am doing everything I can to not be perceived that way-keep your work and education a secret, don't tell people about prior modeling, basically do not share anything about your life and tip-toe. It's really hard to have a genuine conversation and leave out key accomplishments for fear that I will look like I am bragging. But, in a way, it still feels like people are assuming I must be doing something to drive women away (even when I don't think I am doing anything?), especially people that are not on my Facebook and that I've met recently. I usually can sense when a woman is jealous, and I need to stop denying that is reality and avoid those give off those vibes. There is literally only so much I can do. Thank you again for the advice.
Last edited by jabber_wocky; 05-21-2018 at 04:30 PM..
I do think I have been perhaps choosing the wrong people historically combined with my prior social media behavior just looked like bragging when to me I was just sharing what I was up to. Just posting a photo going out I received pretty harsh criticism about it. So, I modified what I do, how I do it, when I do it, and what I say. I don't post too many photos of myself and I discourage photographers and makeup artists tagging me in things if and when I work with them. I try to keep my education and work a secret whenever I can. When I meet people for the first time, I am just having normal conversations and have no control over what they decide to say.
There's being modest and there's being a doormat. You're not getting the reactions you're getting because you're bragging, but because you're accommodating people way too much. The proper reaction to the criticism of your photo was "**** off."
You might like a book called Unf*ckology by Amy Alkon. She describes her own life being friendless and trying to be likeable--and how she found friends by standing up for herself. She also cites evolutionary-based science in the book.
Humble-bragging is different from overtly bragging, and just posting fewer times on FB won't take care of it.
It's an overall attitude I was trying to explain in my other posts, and it is very hard to see when you're the one doing it.
But if multiple women are indeed calling you out for stuff, you must be doing something.
I am 50 with multiple college degrees and try to take care of myself. But I have never had a grown woman say those kinds of things to me. I can certainly see where it would be distressing, but to have it happen multiple times in your life should make you wonder.
I am in my thirties in a time where women are still competing with one another-for some reason. Multiple women are not calling me out, but the one particular friend called me out about my clothing, a handful of photos on Facebook and apparently making her feel low. Women are indeed telling me that I make them feel less than. I was unaware I had that much power over another human being. I am unsure what it is about my attitude makes another person feel less than me. With that friend, I never even felt that in my heart. I loved her as a person. But she has struggled with her own feelings of inadequacy as long as I've known her.
And that something I am doing to make other women feel less than is what I am trying to figure out. I have asked people that know me. I have asked my family. The consensus has been that I have modified my life for the better and it is clear I am happier. And women that struggle with confidence will not enjoy being around me if they feel overshadowed. My family and friends tell me they don't personally think I am doing anything outwardly wrong. I hold my head high. I smile.
Last edited by jabber_wocky; 05-21-2018 at 04:31 PM..
Give meetup another chance. I have been going sporadically for years. I am in a hiking group with loads of people but there are some "core" members who I see more frequently. Last summer some of us did a Tough Mudder. What a bonding experience! We just did another one last weekend. Men and women are in the group and I am finally getting closer to some of the women. At our age, friendships take a lot more time to grow than they did as teens and twenties.
A lot of the men befriended me right away but I think most have ulterior motives lol. I recently asked one member what his initial impression of me was because we were talking about my lack of female friends (I brought it up and wanted his opinion). He told me that I seemed standoffish at first. This is a common observation for me. He also said that a curse of being an attractive woman is that even if you are just quiet and shy, you seem standoffish. He said if you are unattractive usually people will just assume you're shy.
He also said about how competitive women are and that if they think you get too much male attention that may make them not like you. So anyway I am careful about not exclusively talking to the men and I definitely stay far away from any man who has an attachment to anyone else in the group. Be equally friendly to men and women. Take things super slow. Friendships will develop even if they are not like the groups of girlfriends seen in movies. I hope to someday have some close female friends but for now, I am just enjoying doing fun activities in a group setting.
I am shy and a bit of a nerd. I do not look approachable I have been told, even though I am laughing and smiling. I have actually just joined several book clubs on Meetup. I am hoping I can meet other professional women that like reading. What you have just said has confirmed that I am not going crazy. I am definitely interested in taking my time and developing a long-lasting friendship. Thanks!
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