O-H Kasich Got to GO (Cleveland, Union: school, law, legal)

[Townes Van Zandt]

Originally Posted by taxedtodeath

I am shocked, SHOCKED, that any politician would be motivated by politics.

Good, so you understand sarcasm.

[Cleveland_Collector]

Originally Posted by Dwatted Wabbit

There is no such thing as a "collective bargaining right."

The National Labor Relations Act of 1935, known as the Wagner Act, established the right to collective bargaining in the United States.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationa..._Relations_Act

It is a concession that was granted back when the money tree was full, and politicians used that money to bribe various constituent groups for their votes.

In 1935 (the middle of the Great Depression), the "money tree" was far from full.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Depression

Bribed with your own money, how stupid can people get?

Apparently, with you, the sky's the limit!

[AGuyFromCleveland18]

Kasich claims the protests and low poll numbers are because people always react negatively to change. Well, that's not true, people know what is good and bad for them, we know that Kasich is hurting the middle class in favor of his rich corporate friends. Someone in the state congress, and it's gotta be republicans, has got to stand up to this guy. Pressure your state senators and representatives people. This state is a representative republic, our representatives are supposed to represent US. Our state is making the statement that the middle class do not matter? And are we going to let them get away with that?

[PhillytoCincy]

He is just out to support his buddies aka the oil and asphalt companies.

Whatever with the 3C Corridor at this point, but he had no right to take away the Streetcar. Everytime this guy talks I think is he actually saying what I think he is saying. He knew nothing about the streetcar, but he has no problem building a bridge that we don't need.

[Townes Van Zandt]

Originally Posted by Cleveland_Collector

The National Labor Relations Act of 1935, known as the Wagner Act, established the right to collective bargaining in the United States.

National Labor Relations Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I can't speak for DW, but when I said that there is no such thing as a "right" to collective bargaining, I meant that I philosophically disagree that such a "right" exists.

You might disagree, and that's fine.

[Droolrockworm]

I believe that the right to collectively bargain is the only way that the little guy doesn't get trampled by big business. I am including public institutions in that statement. People obviously have not learned much about the laissez faire period of the late 19th century before unions emerged. Robber barrons like Rockefeller, Carnegie, Morgan etc. became exceptionally rich (US steel was sold for 1B before the turn of the 20th century meanwhile workers faced 16-18 hour work days and still could not make ends meet. Children were in the workplace and abused, coal miners were paid in company script that could only be used in the company store and were paid so little that at the end of the week the owed the company money (and that is without the purchace of simple masks that protected them from black lung). The AFL fought (literally) for the 8 hour day and 40 hour work week as well as requiring a safer workplace. The government played a role as well protecting workers from company paid mercenaries to break strikes. I know that unions are not perfect and as a president of one I get to see all sides of this issue and there is no question that without union protection my members would face a much worse workplace. People need to understand that when government steps out of line the people have a chance to change those decisions. When a big company makes poor decisions government is the only entity that can step in and force reasonable behavior is the government, as long as it is bigger than said company.

[Townes Van Zandt]

Originally Posted by Droolrockworm

I believe that the right to collectively bargain is the only way that the little guy doesn't get trampled by big business. I am including public institutions in that statement. People obviously have not learned much about the laissez faire period of the late 19th century before unions emerged. Robber barrons like Rockefeller, Carnegie, Morgan etc. became exceptionally rich (US steel was sold for 1B before the turn of the 20th century meanwhile workers faced 16-18 hour work days and still could not make ends meet. Children were in the workplace and abused, coal miners were paid in company script that could only be used in the company store and were paid so little that at the end of the week the owed the company money (and that is without the purchace of simple masks that protected them from black lung). The AFL fought (literally) for the 8 hour day and 40 hour work week as well as requiring a safer workplace. The government played a role as well protecting workers from company paid mercenaries to break strikes. I know that unions are not perfect and as a president of one I get to see all sides of this issue and there is no question that without union protection my members would face a much worse workplace. People need to understand that when government steps out of line the people have a chance to change those decisions. When a big company makes poor decisions government is the only entity that can step in and force reasonable behavior is the government, as long as it is bigger than said company.

I respect your opinion and I agree that people should be able to get together and form a union if they feel the need to do so. With the way the federal and state government's create artificial monopolies in certain industries and bail out corporations who made irrational investments, I don't blame individuals for finding power in numbers. History has proven that the government will bail out the CEO's and let the average worker starve.

Of course, there's the whole issue of pricing yourself out of the market. That's part of the risk you take, I suppose. We've seen plenty of that in Ohio.

Given the current reality, I understand the need for unions. You still haven't convinced me that human beings have an intrinsic right to collectively bargain.

If we had a true free market society, things would be different.


Oh, and I encorage you to read the following article(feel free to check out the rest of the website...it might open your eyes to some things you haven't considered):

The Free Market: The Union Myth

[Dragneel]

Kasich is a wonderful governor, he could create a competitive and vibrant Ohio.
This governor is a gift for this declining state !

[Droolrockworm]

Originally Posted by Dragneel

Kasich is a wonderful governor, he could create a competitive and vibrant Ohio.
This governor is a gift for this declining state !

Ha, I love sarcasm! Or are you serious???

[Droolrockworm]

KSU
I read the article and question almost the entire article. Seems to me that it is a reinvention of history. If you look at period pieces you will literally see the violence of capitalists (and unions) that forged these rights. The author may be one of the Texan textbook writers that say that the South actually was in favor of the abolition of slavery. I grew up near a guy that had a plate in his head and quite a dent when he (as a coal miner) got clubbed by people brought in to stop a strike when they argued for safer working conditions.